ST "You will never be as strong as Darth Vader!"

On screen, Jedi and Sith have said "your thoughts betray you"

So a fair interpretation is that force sensitivity can allow for reading of thoughts.

The semantics about emotion as opposed to thoughts is bogus anyway; a complex instant interpretation of, say, hormonal signals to allow a reading that specifies people, relationship dynamics, is no more unreasonable than using the force to interpret electrical signals in the brain.

Either way, semantics aside, there is zero difference in practice between "extracting" the idea that someone has a twin sister they are protective of, and extracting a fear that you won't be as powerful as another villain.

This is nitpicking really. I remember when this came up before and people were ADAMANT that no mind reading of any sort had ever happened in canon. It was only a few pages in when someone quoted "especially for... Your sister" that the tenuous distinction was made

Edit: also power levels are a ridiculous concept that film makers won't be beholden to at all. Power dynamics are more important, as long as an eye is kept on ensuring that there aren't nonsensical events which undermine the wider story.

 

To be fair, though, the Force made sounds sometimes in the OT too. Even in ANH, when Vader Force chokes Motti, you can hear a low rumble of the Force that stops as soon as Vader releases him.

 

Rey likely sensed Ben's fears and got a general sense of what bothers him the most, but my take was that Rey was mocking him, taunting Ben. Put yourself in her shoes - captured by an intimidating light sword wielding baddie and as you suffer psychic trauma, you sense the baddie's fear(s)... imagine how shocking (and liberating) that must feel! You too would blurt out something in order to unnerve your captor, maybe something that "feels" true, but not neccessarily be factually true. Ya know, heat of the moment, and all that jazz. In the case of Rey, she hit the nail on the head, judging the way Ben reacted.

 

Oh, I don't mind the sound cues. But I do think that depiction of the force and lightsaber duels will match the time the movie was shot.

 

OK, I thought you were saying that there were no "Force sounds" in the OT movies.

 

Well, there were less and they were less noticeable imo.

 

Well now I want an edit where cheesy noises are used for force abilities like in the Adam West Batman.


nanananananananananana JEDI!

 

Yeah, it's probably true that the Force rumble during Kylo's mind reading scenes is louder than it was during the OT scenes like the one I mentioned.

 

We have to keep in mind when the the films were made, and more importantly how they are showing Vader in the contemporary comics and books now. He is a literal one man army. The rebels had nothing for him in Vader Down. He took on a small army without breaking a sweat. Heck let's simply wait for Rogue One and see if he wrecks it. Because I got a feeling he is going to wreck it.

 

Well, again... it's because he looks like Ross Gellar...

 

Darth Vader, a strong (according to Rey) yet sentimental (according to novelization Kylo Ren) Sith lord.

Cognitive Dissonance - How can Rey sense that Kylo Ren fears that he will never be as strong as his grandfather when he thinks that guy was sentimental? Or did Rey actually sense that Kylo Renn really fears that he will end up being a big wuss like grandpa?

Rey was taunting, mocking Kylo Renn.

 

I think I'm too young to know. Maybe PMing him is best.

 

First correct use of 'literally' I've seen in 12 parsecs!

Cloud City needs a weather vane? Oh yeah, the weather report on Robot Chicken SW?

I wonder if Vader and Luke's telepathic mental texting is more because of a biological connection. Maybe not. GL introduced it in ROTJ to show how strong they were in the Force.

 

Yo, here's a nitpick: How does Rey know who Darth Vader is?

 

Two options: as she knew about Han past as a smuggler, she could've known about Vader. Or she just read that information from his mind right there.

 

Sure, valid points. Maybe the line just sounds a little clunky to me.

 

when I first heard that line I was like



he's gonna need a life support suit for that burn!

 

I agree that she sounds a little weird when she says "Darth Vader". It is not her acting, she is amazing, it was just weird to see a new character to speak "Darth Vader".

I guess that it sounds weird to some of us because in the OT, most of the time Han/Leia/Luke only said "Vader", not "Darth Vader".

 

Obi Wan calls him "Darth Vader" in ANH, and so does Leia (to his face). I think that it points to a lack of familiarity or previous connection. She's speaking about him as a historical figure that she's heard about, whereas Leia, Luke, and Han were there in the moment. Like I could see her referring to "Kylo Ren" as just "Kylo" or "Ren" from now on, which would be the equivalency as the OT heroes saying "Vader."

Also the thing about Kylo's abilities is that they're not really "new powers." They're simply new variations of powers that we've already seen before, powers used in a different way basically. Also the Rebels TV show indirectly implies that Vader might very well be able to do the mind-probe as well (which would line up with his line from ANH).

 

I agree that they are really new variations of powers we've seen before. Also, we already know Vader can do the mind probe, separate from the ANH line... see my earlier points about him reading Luke's thoughts in ROTJ.

 

I think Kylo will surpass Vader by 8 because Vader wasn't able to ever reach his full potential meanwhile Kylo is still discovering his. I hope Snoke's training will give him that edge.

 

I wonder why Vader didn't mind probe Leia in the DS. Maybe by ANH they still haven't come up with the ESB idea that the Force would allow one to read minds.

 

But the ANH line we're referring to is, "Her resistance to the mind probe is considerable. It will be some time before we can extract any information from her."

 

Also we got this scene in Rebels season 1 (I'll put it in spoiler tags just in case):

Spoiler

Notice anything, familiar about this hmm? And it's heavily implied that the GI's "master" was Vader himself. So this, combined with the ANH lines, would seem to imply that Vader is capable of using the mind-probe (and teaching it to others as well), even if you remove the ROTJ stuff from the equation.

 

The mind probe Vader is talking about, was that actual physical device, or him using the Force to probe the minds of others like he did in ESB and RotJ?