Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by El_Machete12, Dec 21, 2012.
I guess you could say he was the David Copperfield of a Galaxy Far, Far, Away.....
Favorite Prequel movie?
Had to be number 3, because after that I new this garbage was finally over.
One man's trash, is another man's treasure.
Nice post here, HD.
I'm warming back up to ROTS a little more lately.
I dig all the movies, so it seems I will probably keep drifting from one to the next, and back again, with my love for one or the other waxing and waning quite freely.
The prequels, I mean. I really enjoy the originals, too, but not quite as much as I enjoy the prequels. I think it's all those colours that get me. Sure, LOTS of elements get me, but the palettes for each of the prequel films, and how they alter between films, are just extraordinary!!! I defy anyone to present ANY other blockbuster movie, made at any other time or place, with a tenth the density and majesty.
What really turns me onto Sith is appreciating it as the culmination of I and II -- and, for that matter, IV, V, and VI. This is an idea I pick up a bit in your post above. It's fine that it's well-made in its own right (as I certainly believe it is), but it's infinitely more appealing if you see it as this symphony of light and sound that owes its direct existence to five other movies in a tightly-integrated series (and an awesome plenitude of films if one is casting one's net over cinema generally).
It's also pretty darn exciting to go over its production history by immersing one's self in all the behind-the-scenes material and appreciating just what a trip this was for George Lucas to assemble. He'd marshaled all his technology and talent together for the commencement of III and was finally able to express his vision to very nearly the last syllable. He would face the least constraints and the least hassle making ROTS, and while some may disdain the (relative, not absolute) ease, it was an ease that he'd painstakingly earned over the course of three decades -- and it's fabulous to see and feel that ease on the screen, everything flowing in an epic collage of sound and colour ... a plot-driven movie, yes, but also an experience of almost pure sensation.
I was rewatching the Order 66 montage today. Its power, for me, remains undiminished, and it actually seems to get more poetic every new viewing I make of it. Anyway, today I happened to notice a visual feature I really enjoyed: the use of muggy/urine brown-yellow for the beginning of the montage on Utapau, which is reprised, somewhat (or given its grimmer intonation), with Aayla Secura on Felucia. I hadn't consciously made that connection before, but I was happy to finally perceive it on this new occasion. Just a small thing, really, but it goes back to what I just said about the colour palettes of these films. These movies are an incredible visual feast. It may only be an impression I'm recently (truly) appreciating.
You know... I love that whole detour to Utapau. And Obi-Wan/Grievous. Heck, just Grievous. The whole environment of Utapau, to me, is beautiful, I love Tion Medon (played by the awesome Bruce Spence), Boga, the sinkholes, the lighting, the music... all of it. And the depiction of a total war state when the clones arrive with some incredible wide shots is just dazzling. Lucas uses those shots sparingly, and with his inspiring economy, he makes them count. This is not necessarily something one can appreciate overnight; it takes time to recognize brilliance of this magnitude. ROTS and its artists were seriously deprived of an Oscar nom for visual effects -- no doubt. And it could have scooped noms in the areas of art direction, sound, and music, too. It's a real thing to sit down and have wash over you.
I've come to feel that one is practically turned into a god watching Star Wars -- the prequels, at least. You become like a cosmic overseer to a galactic tragedy. Scenes of war and strife (and the strife is often quiet, estranged, psychological, or para-psychological -- weird and remote) are presented to you, but not necessarily AT you. You're slightly held at a distance and encouraged to watch big things unfold from a skygod watchpoint. You can watch with pity, fear, amusement, or dread. Or total indifference. In this way, I agree with bashers, in the most superficial of ways, that the prequel movies are like a sort of demo reel for digital tech and effects, where musical orchestration and whatever else are on tap and one is completely provided for, but this deluge is also precisely what overloads a scene (in a good way), making it too much to adequately take in, allowing one to return and see new things on each return visit. I dunno. I'm like a king watching subjects in a grand war farce. As ugly as war is, and as much as Lucas wants the viewer to, hopefully, arrive at a more honest appraisal of society and power structures (in this way, his films are both contemporary and timeless), he's also turned centuries of stupidity and brutality into something epic, operatic, and beautiful.
That's what I get fired up by watching the prequels... the endless density and scale of everything. There's a real grandeur to Lucas' command of the cinema frame and all the tools that have been built or refined to expand what he can do within that frame or around it. There is an entire library of human ingenuity here. And because Lucas took cinema from chemical to digital more fully than any other person in the history of the medium, he is, in some sense, the most important person in the history of that medium, whether others want to credit him with this achievement or not. The prequels are also quite honest in showing some of the birthing pains that inevitably accompany the crossing of a threshold, even as slick and as anodyne -- in some ways -- as they invariably are ... and BECAUSE they are these things also! That rousing, kaleidoscopic mix -- it's insane.
But it really all goes back to the colours. Digital cinema is about colour. It's about other things, too, but colour stands out to me -- in the prequels, anyway -- because, if you're an artist in love with colour, then you can really do anything you please when digital technology is at your disposal. The limitations of old are wilting away and a new era of cinema has begun. It began most fully with the prequels, however, and there's nothing I feel rightly compares. Not with all the elements the prequels have on show. Because they're locked in a dialectic with the OT, another trilogy with an established grammar, they can't help calling attention to themselves at every turn, and that means everything they do, or don't do, is peculiarly heightened. No other film series has this call-and-response construction of the Star Wars saga. It makes the elements more beautiful and the whole thing entirely unique.
It would actually be pretty strange if the series somehow was left hanging on AOTC. Imagine that film bombed for some reason. Or Lucas passed away before he could get to ROTS. Episode III might never have come into being; the final piece would never have been revealed. Someone could have tried to fashion a conclusion, but it would have been the most shallow object in a universe of shallow objects. That Lucas got to go all the way and bring his space epic to a close is not something that should be underestimated in a world of broken dreams and paths not traveled. The glimpse of that truth is what finally beatifies ROTS and makes it into the magnificent brute it is. Its lyric is, in some sense, the sweetest, since it took the longest time for it to be heard.
Can't really put it as well as ^Cryogenic did before me, but ROTS is definitely my favourite of the Prequels.
ROTS was just massive. By the end of the Palpatine rescue/Battle over Coruscant, I felt like I was watching a great Star Wars film, one that was already surpassing AOTC and TPM. It was the Pacing of the thing - felt like an adventure again (like the OT, don't hate me haha).
Like the poster above me says, the colour palette exploded onto the screen - this was a gorgeous film to look at.
The music was immense, the action was immense. The war backdrop was brilliantly captured and not over the top - at the centre of this war was a very personal tale.
When everything goes down hill for the good guys, the sense of loss - that massive sense of loss - was felt throughout. No just loss of lives, but the loss of hope. Anakin succumbing to the Dark Side, Palpatine seizing power, the fall of the Jedi.
One spectacular moment I didn't even think would happen: the last ditch effort our only two heroes left in the picture, Obi-Wan and Yoda, mount against the Sith. I mean, I knew Obi-Wan was going to face Anakin/Vader but I didn't expect to even see Yoda walk into the Emperor's office and just lay it down the way he did. Love the way the scene between Yoda and Obi-Wan was filmed - Obi-Wan kneeling and Yoda walking away from him, looking over his shoulder to tell Obi-Wan to basically go kill Darth Vader. Why so good? TPM, last scene between Obi-Wan and Yoda - Obi-Wan kneeling and Yoda declaring Anakin Skywalker will be his apprentice (his responsibility). Great juxtaposition.
And Yoda facing the Emperor? Every line spoken between the two was just...can't even put it into words how cool the line "At an end your rule is. And not short enough it was." is haha so damn cool.
After all the tragedy, all the grief and tormoil, finally, we're left with Luke on Tatooine and a new hope is born! Cue the twin sunsets!
It is such a great ride, a rollercoaster of a film. The emotion hit strong with this chapter, the action, the dialogue, the stakes is all huge.
And as the poster above stated - it is such a great tale, George Lucas completing this saga, from start to finish. What a triumph in the end, there's just massive respect for the guy.
I will say this for AOTC - really loved Obi-Wan's detective story throughout. Felt like I was watching Noir in space and that's always awesome. That was so unexpected, it was definitely one of the finest aspects of all 6 films.
I gotta say that Episode 1 was my favourite.
I think that Qui Gon Jinn had somethin' to do with it.......
ROTS is very watchable , I've watched it many times more than the other 2 , it keeps moving , I enjoy a lot of AOTC but it drags , and then TPM comes a loooong way down after .
its a shame because if TPM had been good it would've set up the next 2 really well , I mean I'd already like the characters , but because TPM is such a bad start the trilogy never really recovers .
ROTS cause the other 2 just aren't very good to begin with....sorry
I'd rank them in the order of:
Palpatine is my favorite character and I felt he really stole the show. I loved seeing Yoda vs. Palpatine, loved Palpatine putting doubts in Anakin's head regarding the Jedi and how he manipulated that situation, loved that we finally got to see Palpatine more as he is in the Classic Trilogy, delighting and free to be evil.
I liked that Anakin and Obi-Wan were finally portrayed as friends.
I loved how Order 66 was handled and the tone shift following it.
Really my only complaints were: the cause of Padme's death and how quickly and completely Anakin fell in so short of a time.
The cast really hadn't developed any kind of chemistry yet, didn't like Jar Jar, and felt like everything was too convenient and easy for Palpatine.
Other than that a fun movie.
I like the action sequences of this film and that's about it. Though I can't un-see that the Jedi in the arena battle are just recycled footage being used over and over and over again.
For me, it's ROTS. The film is nothing short of poetry at times. Sure, there's that one cringe-worthy scene between Anakin and Padme ("It's only because I'm sooo in love with you!"). But other than that, the film has so many elements that are so shocking and revolutionary that puts it on a much higher level than either AOTC or TPM.
Most of the film can still play through my mind. I think of Anakin marching up the steps of the Jedi Temple with thousands of clones behind him. I think of him opening his blade on the younglings. I think of him betraying Mace Windu for his new Sith master. All of these things play through my mind when you simply say: "Revenge of the Sith."
I don't have moments like that with The Phantom Menace or Attack of the Clones. If you were to say "The Phantom Menace," I might think of Qui-Gon dying, but that's it. With Attack of the Clones, I'd probably think of the sandy desert on Geonosis. But no true moments of *power*. I would put the march on the Jedi Academy in the top 5 moments of the entire saga (only to be bested by moments such as "I love you, "I know" and "I am your father.")
ROTS by a millionfold. In 140 minutes, this Star Wars artery ensnares us in the boards of Humanity’s fall, criss-crossing central saga themes in the unfolding. We see the fruition of Palpatine’s exploitation on innocence, self-deception and the loss of authenticity, destruction in the name of preservation, death by non-acceptance and self-fulfilling prophecies…. The final domino sequence of light symbols (The Jedi, Senate, and more specifically & profoundly, Anakin) and their connectivity (social and personal relationships) plunging to Apocalypse Cliff.
To me ROTS is a beautiful tapestry of Descent that surpasses TPM’s plantation of disharmonious seeds and AOTC’s solidification on those roots.
My favorite prequel movie is definitely ROTS. It's my favorite in the whole saga, in fact. Has been for a long time. It was a great way to round everything out. In this movie, every scene just carries so much emotional weight, and the movie is full of spectacular fast-paced action sequences with top of the line CGI and practical effects. ROTS is the darkest in the saga by far, in my opinion. At the end of the film, it comes down to a tragic climax and ends with a very bittersweet tone, showing the rise of the Empire and the birth of Luke and Leia. TPM and AOTC are certainly great films, but ROTS is just amazing in my opinion.
It's not without its problems, but I say ROTS.
Probably AOTC as I have many memories With that particular one the best in terms of quality has to be ROTS Though.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Revenge of the Sith, no doubt. Everything about Anakin makes it really strong.
I never thought I'd say this, but I'm going to have to go with TPM. ROTS impressed me greatly at first, but over time I've gradually come to like it less and less. Actually, to put it more accurately, I've come to like less and less of it. The good bits of ROTS are great, but there are large chunks I just don't bother with any more. Pretty much any scene with General Grievous in it for starters. The initial battle scene / Palpatine rescue, though impressive visually no doubt, kind of bores me now. All that stuff with vulture droids, R2 squirting oil, Dooku somersaulting etc. Nah... TPM, however, while flawed to be sure, is something I can throw on and enjoy for a couple of hours from time to time. I enjoy immersing myself in pre-Empire GFFA and although I'm in the minority I find the political machinations, tax issues etc to be quite fascinating. The things which irritated me initially have become but minor distractions - Jar jar, Yoda's appearance, Yippee! etc. AOTC has its moments, few and far between, but continues to be my sixth favourite SW film by some margin.
The Phantom Menace!
Which is also my favorite of any Star Wars movie.
To me, everything about TPM is what Star Wars is. All the other ones have bits and pieces, but TPM is Star Wars as a whole. Additionally, it is almost exactly A New Hope 2.0 - thematically telling a very similar story, but done much, MUCH better in every way.
ROTS is the best, but The Phantom Menace is my favorite one to watch.
No love for Attack of the Clones!? It's so much the misunderstood experimental stepchild of the Star Wars saga and I LOVE it!
Pan up from the crawl, starship explodes, Jar Jar's back everyone!, awkward teenage Darth Vader, "that creep is gonna end up deep-fried.", Star Wars as a 30's French romance film - AND a 30's noir detective film, Kamino nuff said, stormtroopers as good guys, a Fett who *actually fights*(!!!), conveyor belts, arena pit monsters, 45 minutes of relentless combat, topped off with Yoda pulling a knife.
Weirdest Star Wars movie EVER, and for that I love it.
You nearly sold it to me there Eddie...
...but not quite...
I adore AOTC--it's just that ROTS edges it out, for me.
Let's put it this way:
AOTC is my worst Prequel film - but not my worst Star Wars film by a LONG shot!
I actually think AOTC is the best PT movie, as I agree with much that you stated. What I like about AOTC is that it is the only PT movie that really stays consistent with its story-telling when looking at the grander story of the PT.
What I mean is that TPM does not have enough red meat, and seems a bit foreign when looking at the 6 films. You have a young Anakin who will eventually be played by a new actor in the next 2 films, so it is very hard to relate to him. You have QuiGon, who is essentially the star of the movie (and a very good character) who dies and isn't even talked about in the OT movies. You have Obiwan, who is partly responsible for Anakin turning to the darkside, has a secondary role and very few interactions with his future Padawan. As for ROTS, it is the opposite of TPM where it tries to throw too much red meat at the viewer. The last hour feels more like a checklist of everything Lucas didn't have time to show, and could have been alot better if many of these plot points were delved into more.
AOTC strikes the right balance between TPM & ROTS. Whether you like it or not it takes it time to develop the romance of Anakin/Padme, as it builds through the first hour of the movie to the eventual moment of truth on Geonisis. Obiwan goes on a detective hunt, and explores a huge plot point that makes you look at the Stormtroopers and the Empire in a TOTALLY different way when watching the OT now. This all coincides with all of the parties meeting on Geonosis and we finally get to see The Clone Wars Battle, while Anakin/Padme marry at the end of the movie as he grabs her hand with his metal hand which foreshadows their future.
Sorry guys, IMO, AOTC is very underrated (probably because fans despise the romance), and ROTS is overrated simply because it has so many plot points we had wanted to see since 1983.
I agree with the first line, AOTC is underrated. However, I do not believe there is such a thing as an overrated Star Wars film