VIDEO Zelda Fans Come Hither...

Discussion in 'Games' started by alpha_red, May 11, 2004.

  1. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jul 9, 1999
    star 10
    That's the story of my life. :)
  2. Darth_Kevin Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 5
    Well, I?m going to have to go with the whole WW being an alternate reality theory. After all, at the end of OoT, you never actually let Ganondorf into the Sacred Realm, did you? I reckon this is where the new game will come in, as it looks so similar to OoT. Ganondorf will probably make his grab for power here, thereby making all the other games possible.

    That assumes that the game designers are paying as much attention to the overall timeline as we are, which is probably not the case.
  3. Darth_Omega Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    That assumes that the game designers are paying as much attention to the overall timeline as we are, which is probably not the case.

    Actually both Shigeru Miyamoto and Eiji *somethingsomething* have said that OoT has two endings. One following the Adult Link end the other one Child Link.
    The real question would be which one is the "alternative" timeline. TWW or MM?
    At first I thought it was TWW but then I got to realise that TWW only refers to the events of the OoT "Imprisoning War" but so does LttP so that means they're in the same universe? So conclusion TWW is in the main timeline.
    So MM would be in the 'alternative' timeline. Oh well I hope Legend of Zelda:2005, X or what ever have an answer to this.

    In a way, it's true- it still grants the wishes regadless of how pure ones heart is. Apparently the splitting is just a side-reaction (or perhaps has more to do with the essence of the Triforce, rather than the Triforce itself?).

    That is an interesting question, I never saw it that way.
    As I seem to recall from OoT the person will get the part he 'most' desire. In Ganondorf case, power. I've to beat OoT again.
  4. alpha_red Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2003
    star 5
    Actually both Shigeru Miyamoto and Eiji *somethingsomething* have said that OoT has two endings. One following the Adult Link end the other one Child Link.

    Link, please?

    The Triforce lore goes like this:

    The Triforce is a balance that weighs the three forces -- Power, Wisdom, and Courage. If one touches it and has the three forces in balance, that one shall gain the True Force to govern all. If the person's heart is not in balance, it will split into three pieces, one for each force. The person who touched it will be left with the piece representing the force that he/she most believes in. The others will go to pre-determined owners chosen by destiny.
  5. Darth_Omega Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    click scroll down a bit and you will see a part of the interview.
    As I said before "hundred years" comment is a mistranslation.

    Thanks for the explaination :)
  6. alpha_red Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2003
    star 5
    Miyamoto: This is pretty confusing for us, too.

    [Will Smith] Kay, we're ALL confused. [/Will Smith]
  7. Darth_Omega Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 6
    Well not really I understand it, it took me a while to 'get' it though.
  8. Darth_Kevin Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 5
    Maybe it is not alternate timelines, but alternate worlds. In ALttP there is a Light World and a Dark World. The Dark World was formerly the Golden Land and probably again so after ALttP.

    My analysis will primarily concern the overworld maps.

    Kakariko village appears in the ALttP Light World, as well as OoT. It seems to me that maybe Zelda1 and Zelda2 might actually occur in the Golden Land, i.e. an alternate world. Also, this explains why there are no common towns or the Deku tree or Kakariko village in Zelda1 and Zelda2. This idea is partially ruined by a few things in the names of towns/palaces in Zelda2 like Ruto, Saria and Rauru, which are names of characters in OoT and ALttP.

    The OoT overworld seems to be roughly the bottom half of the TWW overworld, with the Tower of the Gods being directly over the Hyrule Palace. ALttP seems to occur in the NW corner of the OoT overworld, but oriented differently.

    Considering the ending of TWW, my position would be that either Zelda1 and Zelda2 occur after TWW in New Hyrule, or they occur in different Worlds. Because of the Master Sword issue, I think ALttP needs to come after TWW.

    The different Worlds idea might also explain the Ganon issue. Maybe he keeps getting sent back and forth in a vicious circle of each world continuously banishing him to the other. Just some food for thought.

    I may be off in some of the details, but I think the idea might have merit.
  9. Valyn Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2002
    star 8
    I would say that I can't believe you guys are still discussing/debating the Zelda timeline, but the sad thing is that I can indeed believe it. [face_plain]
  10. Emperor_Joe Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 4
  11. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    >>Considering the ending of TWW, my position would be that either Zelda1 and Zelda2 occur after TWW in New Hyrule, or they occur in different Worlds.<<

    Could "New Hyrule" not just be "Eastern Hyrule" as seen in Zelda 2? (the 'second continent', if you will)

    >>I would say that I can't believe you guys are still discussing/debating the Zelda timeline<<

    The Zelda timeline is probably the most discussed video game storyline-rleated topic ever, and given that there is no official answer, detailed discussions are usually the result. Especially when a new game is announced! ::)
  12. Soontir-Fel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 18, 2001
    star 5
    Do you think the "powers that be" sometimes go to websites and take the best explanation and make it offical?
  13. Emperor_Joe Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 4
  14. Night4554 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2000
    star 5
    It's like Janson says, You just wait until someone gives an explanation you like and pop in and say "Yup that was it all along".

    ¤Night
  15. DarthBobbalot Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2002
    star 5
    Is there a gba Zelda game coming out as well? I saw this thread at page one, and didnt see it there, so i never thought about it. But someone just told me today that there will be a GBA Zelda game coming out as well. Anyone have info on it?
  16. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Yes, it's called "The Minish Cap" and will feature around the theme of a living hat (which looks like Link's usual, but can offer advice and such) that can shrink Link down to very small sizes (so, some times you'll play as only a few pixels and other times the camera will zoom-in and you'll be in a "giant world").

    There's a tiny race called the Minish for Link to interact with in such environments.

    New items include a bottle that can suck in air and blast it back out at enemies, and mushrooms that stretch when exposed t a sucking motion so that Link can grab on and use them to fling across gaps.

    Also will likely have some more Four Swords action.
  17. Emperor_Joe Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 7, 2002
    star 4
  18. Darth_Kevin Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 5
    Could "New Hyrule" not just be "Eastern Hyrule" as seen in Zelda 2? (the 'second continent', if you will)

    I don't think that would work. Since Death Mountain is in "Western Hyrule", Zelda1 would then have to have occurred there. Thus if "Western Hyrule" is "Old Hyrule", then Zelda1 takes place in the same Hyrule as OoT and TWW. In that case I suppose things could different because the waters could have subsided, but it does not explain the absence of Deku or Kakariko, which appear in previous Zelda games, unless we propose that the "Water Subsided Hyrule" of Zelda 2 is not the entire OoT map, but maybe only the Northern half of the TWW map, thus Deku does not appear.

    Also, I think I am wrong with ALttP coming after TWW due to the appearance of the Kokiri people, unless the Kakariko of ALttP is "New Kakariko".
  19. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    >>Since Death Mountain is in "Western Hyrule", Zelda1 would then have to have occurred there.<<

    It did- the "Death Mountain Area" is supposed to be the area Zelda 1 took place in (and thus, by related geography, OOT, ALTTP and probably TWW). The rest of "Western Hyrule" is referred to, I believe, as "Northern Hyrule"- which is supported somewhat by ALTTP (you'll note when you are atop Death Mountain in ALTTP, you can see the countryside behind Death Mountain below you- this area presumably leads to where the Northern Palace in AOL will one day be).

    >>but it does not explain the absence of Deku or Kakariko, which appear in previous Zelda games, unless we propose that the "Water Subsided Hyrule" of Zelda 2 is not the entire OoT map, but maybe only the Northern half of the TWW map, thus Deku does not appear. <<

    My observation has been that the OOT/ALTTP/LOZ map are basicly the same- some areas are "offscreen"/"cropped" from others and such, but they roughly line up. That part is the Death Mountain area on the AOL map.
    TWW sort of roughly lines up with that area too, it seems.
  20. Darth_Kevin Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2001
    star 5
    >>Since Death Mountain is in "Western Hyrule", Zelda1 would then have to have occurred there.<<

    It did- the "Death Mountain Area" is supposed to be the area Zelda 1 took place in (and thus, by related geography, OOT, ALTTP and probably TWW). The rest of "Western Hyrule" is referred to, I believe, as "Northern Hyrule"- which is supported somewhat by ALTTP (you'll note when you are atop Death Mountain in ALTTP, you can see the countryside behind Death Mountain below you- this area presumably leads to where the Northern Palace in AOL will one day be).


    In my original point, I postulated that the entire Zelda1/Zelda2 Hyrule was the "New Hyrule" after TWW. Thus if as you suggested "New Hyrule" was simply only the eastern continent, that would not work according to my theory since that would make the western continent that original Hyrule as in TWW and OoT, and thus not solving the Deku / Kakariko problems.

    I think I like your new idea better. If you reorient the Zelda2 overworld so that Death Mountain is to the south, then the Zelda1/Zelda2 Hyrule could be the area north of the ALttP Death Mountain. Thus OoT/ALttP/TWW occur in roughly the same overworld, each oriented differently. TWW Link established "New Hyrule" on the other side of Death Mountain, and Zelda1 and Zelda2 take place there. Therefore, the Deku, Kokiri and original palace remain in "Old Hyrule". The only problem that remains is the issue of the original Zelda being asleep in "New Hyrule" until Zelda2, where as we know the original Zelda would be from "Old Hyrule".
  21. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    >>I think I like your new idea better. If you reorient the Zelda2 overworld so that Death Mountain is to the south, then the Zelda1/Zelda2 Hyrule could be the area north of the ALttP Death Mountain.<<

    I'm not suggesting you reorient the Zelda 2 overworld. I'm suggesting that the entire Zelda 1/ALTTP/OOT overworld is the small area shown south of Spectacle Rock on this map (ignoring the artistic liberties):

    [image=http://www.raysrealm.net/comics/zcmap1.jpg]

    and looks like this in the Zelda 2 game at the bottom of this image:

    [image=http://faqsmedia.ign.com/faqs/image/fecalord_zelda2_west.gif] [image=http://home.earthlink.net/~djroemello/images/z2deathmt.jpg][image=http://www.fadedtwilight.org/Siren/Writings/Images/zelda2map-zoom.jpg]

    compared to the Z1, ALTTP and OOT overworlds:

    [image=http://www.monmouth.com/~colonel/videogames/zelda/detail.png] [image=http://www.tmsword.com/z3/lightworld.gif]
    [image=http://www.zeldaoot.coolfreepage.com/images/oot/images/ad_map.gif]

    With this theory, "New Hyrule" could be either the primary portion of the Z2 map north of Spectacle Rock and/or Eastern Hyrule.
  22. alpha_red Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2003
    star 5
    Hylian geography...

    Let's see.

    LttP Hyrule = expanded, rotated OOT Hyrule.

    Hyrule after that = mostly the same, actually, though some things have been changed around. Kakariko Village likely relocated after WW, since WW comes before LttP. In LttP, there are mountain highlands immediately to the east of the castle, and there appears to be some sort of ancient city there.

    That's about all I know about the geography of Zelda. I concern myself far more with the literary and religious applications and bases present within the games, as well as specific gameplay innovations and strategies. Geography = teh suck.

    Judging by past experience, whatever T2Q says I'll probably agree with.
  23. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    The geography, IMO, isn't too difficult, since most of the overworlds match up for the most part, with only an added river here or there over time. Only major changes is the village relocation and the volcano top to Death Mountain.

    I really gotta get around to finishing TWW so I can get a better idea of how the game does or doesn't fit in with my current observations.

    All I can say about my TWW geographical observations for now is that the Deku Tree, Tower of the Gods/Hyrule Castle, Spectacle Rck/Spectacle Island and Death Mountain/Dragon's Roost line up roughly, implying it is the same as ALTTP/OOT/LOZ- though the area covers only a small portion of TWW's map size, implying it contains land seen in the greater areas of the AOL map.
  24. Fettster Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 7, 2003
    star 3
    And of course Kakariko would relocate after Wind Waker. Think about it.
  25. alpha_red Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2003
    star 5
    That's what I just said.