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Lit Relationships among Luke, Leia, Han and Jaina, Ben, Allana

Discussion in 'Expanded Universe' started by Ghost, Jul 3, 2012.

  1. Ghost Jedi Grand Master

    We basically have 6 living members of the Skywalker-Solo family:



    We could also include:

    *Tenel Ka
    *Tahiri (basically the wayward adopted kid at this point)

    The stories hardly ever explore the relationships between them anymore, the authors always split them off into the cliche groups. But surely the others interact with each other in some way?

    *Jaina, Ben, Allana... how does the "new generation" get along with each other?

    *What is Jaina like as an aunt to Allana? Does the shadow of Jacen's death hang over their relationship? Does Allana like being with Jaina? Do they ever spend time alone together?

    *How does Ben interact with Allana, and what does Allana think of Ben?

    *Now that they're both basically adults, do Ben and Jaina ever go on missions together? Are they close cousins? Are they distant cousins?

    *I think the only time we saw Allana interact with Luke, she was afraid of him. Luke later does his best to keep Allana's identity a secret from Abeloth, but how does he personally interact with her? What is their relationship like? Does Luke have a subconscious part of himself that thinks "she is the reason why my wife died." They could definitely bond and already have something big and unusual in common: they both have a father that fell to the dark side.

    *We always hear about how Ben looked up to Han as a kid, and has a lot in common with him. But will we ever see Ben and his Uncle Han really interact with each other? Will they ever team up?

    *Or how about Ben and his Aunt Leia? She's probably the closest thing he has to a mother-figure now, it would be nice to see Leia try to fulfill part of that role to Ben.

    *How are Luke and Han? Han and Leia are almost always together, and once every so often (but very rarely) we see just Luke and Han together again like the old times. That should happen more.

    *But what about Luke and Leia? They are now both fully-trained Jedi, they could go on a mission together, we've never really since them as a brother-sister Jedi team since Dark Empire.

    *Seeing just Luke, Leia, and Han team up for a mission, without any of the kids or Jedi extras, would also be nice.

    *What does Ben think of Tenel Ka, and Jag? What do they think of Ben? At least we know Ben and Tahiri have some sort of friendship, after Ben redeemed her.

    *What does Allana think of Uncle Jag, and Jag of her? Has she had any interaction with Tahiri, or is Tahiri secretly afraid she'll be a bad influence on Allana?

    *Has Ben heard stories of Chewbacca, of Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru, of who Padme was?

    *Has Allana heard stories of Mara, Chewbacca, and Anakin Solo? Or of Bail Organa and his wife?

    *It would be interesting and touching if Allana just recalled to Luke, in that very matter-of-fact way that kids do, that a lady frequently appears in her dreams to comfort her and give her strength, with Luke realizing from the details that it is Mara's Force ghost.


    I think refocusing the stories on the characters and their relationships with each other, breaking out of the cliche groups to explore new and interesting areas for our characters... it has a lot of potential and could revitalize the EU.

    What does everyone think?
  2. dp4m Jedi Grand Master

    I try not to think about Ben and Tahiri ever again...
  3. Ghost Jedi Grand Master

    Temporary insanity, from her quick descent to the dark side.

    *waves hand* You will forget it ever happened *waves hand*

    But seriously, there is so much wasted potential, they need to break up the cliche groups and focus on the characters and their relationships.

    I used to want them to introduce new main characters, but now I don't want them to introduce new main characters until they figure out how to improve their writing with the existing main characters.
  4. JediMara77 Jedi Master

    This is one of my biggest problems with the EU as a whole. There are so many missed opportunities to explore interpersonal relationships. One example is that Mara and Mirax are described as being close friends in the Dark Tide series, but they never expanded on that. Same with Luke and Wedge.

    I've always thought that Luke should be close with Karrde, but we hardly ever see him anymore.

    I would love to see a Luke and Leia story, whether it be going back in the timeline or around the Legacy era. It could be an interesting story to see them as Jedi Knights working together, with all the past events that have happened between them. It could another Mindor-type book.

    I really liked the times Jaina and Luke interacted in FotJ, and would love to see more of that. Same with Jaina and Ben.

    With so much tragedy that's befallen their family, they need each other more than ever. I hope the authors remember that.
    ChildofWinds and Ghost like this.
  5. Force Smuggler Jedi Grand Master

    Don't forget R2-D2 and C-3PO! I want to see those two interact some more. I also like when those two get on Han and Lando's nerves. Their story arc in NJO was great but now there isn't any droid growth. Speaking of Lando and Han, those two need an adventure together for old times sake.

    I also agree that Luke and Leia need a mission together. I have no idea what they would do together but they should do something together. I want to see Luke and Han do something after LOTF since they were at odds at the beginning of that series. I also wish Droma, Lowie or Lumpy had stayed on as Han's co-pilot.

    I also want Corran and Tahiri to have a Master/Padawan relationship. I liked how they interacted back in the NJO. If Anakin had lived he would have been Corran's padawan as well. One good thing about FOTJ is that Jysella and Valin had bigger roles.

    While Jacen's Hermit act annoyed me in the early stages of NJO I found Ben's plight interesting in DNT. He was hesitant to use the force because of the war and Abeloth. If he had become a smuggler jedi that would have been different.

    I hated Raynar and Alema in DNT but I liked them in FOTJ and LOTF respectively.

    Wedge, Iella and their kids need a bigger role. Gavin Darklighter does as well.

    A Ben and Jaina mission would be epic especially if it was shown after LOTF of them getting over Jacen's death.
  6. Havac Moderator of Your Temporary Lit Substitute

    Yeah, the character writing has been extremely thin lately, in favor of a lot of Jedi assaults and formulaic shuntings-aside of major characters. There's action, and there's poorly-constructed plot, but we have very little feel for these people as characters anymore. It's sad.
  7. JediMatteus Jedi Master

    This is one of my biggest problems with the EU as a whole

    yes this is the one thing that bantam did right most of the time. last time i saw any interpersonal relationships on any scale, ironically is sacrifice, when mara got with Jaina, Ben and Leia.
  8. JediMatteus Jedi Master

    whatever happened to luke and r2. Luke just got to old and distant?
  9. GenAntilles Jedi Master

    This is a big problem. Characters are always paired up with certain characters. Luke is always with Ben. Han is always with Leia. Jaina is always with Jag and or Zek. Alanna is always with Han and Leia.

    Honestly my dream novels would be Ben and Corran Horn investigating a crime, or Luke and Leia going on a mission together by themselves and getting to show us all what the Skywalker twins can do. A novel with Ben and Han tracking down someone or something from Han's past. Wedge and Jag going off on a diplomatic mission together that goes bad and they end up in dogfights and old school starfighter hijinks. Leia and Tahiri having good quality time together and finally working through all their Anakin/Jacen grief once and for all. Jaina and Allana getting to know one another more, maybe even becoming Jaina's apprentice(GOOD GRIEF GIVE HER AN APPRENTICE ALREADY)
  10. ChildofWinds Jedi Master

    I agree with what just about everyone else here has already said. We don't see enough of the relationships among the characters, and we don't see the characters working in different pairings for missions anymore. Action seems to be the major focus in most of the books, and the stories are mostly plot-driven rather than character driven, which often causes head-scratching actions and decisions by the characters that really don't fit and seem way out of character.
    Ghost likes this.
  11. Maverick1015 Jedi Master

    I would say that the biggest problem with the lack of personal relationships between the characters is too much focus on continuous action. All of Solo-Skywalker family never stop and breath as this series gets going and the relationships between them remain static for several books.
    GenAntilles and Ghost like this.
  12. GenAntilles Jedi Master

    Yeah, what this era really needs is some solo novels. Like I said a detective novel with Coran and Ben. A starfighter novel with Jag and Wedge, maybe even Jaina too. The only time we see the Skywalker-Solo Clan and friends does not need to be whenever a new galactic disaster happens that is covered in a 9 book series.
  13. cthugha-temp Jedi Master

    This. So much potential there... also a "slower" novel focusing on Jaina and her relationship to basically everyone else. I think at these points she is (or could be) maybe the most interesting character in the main cast, but I still feel she doesn't really have that much of her own profile besides being, well, a sword.

    Oh, and this thread's title made me think of this... :oops:
    GenAntilles likes this.
  14. Nobody Jedi Master

    Yeah, we really need to see some more family scenes in the novels. And not just brief meetings to exchange notes on the disaster of the month, but actual relaxation together. We saw a bit of this in Outcast, even if it was only as a prelude for Han deciding to support Corellia against the GA (and Leia going along with it as she has nothing better to do apparently).

    Its one of the reasons I hated FotJ a lot. Ben didn't really have much time with anyone other than Jacen before LotF (since the novels couldn't even let Ben have a normal childhood as when we met a talking Ben in DNT it turns out he was somewhat estranged from the rest of the Force using family), then after that he was "investigating" Mara's death and then best not to think what he was up to in Invincible. I was hoping to see him as a young Jedi Knight, since after he realizes how far gone Jacen is, he is then basically either off on his own or attached to his father... and Luke Skywalker casts a very big shadow. I was hoping to see him off on his own, but instead FotJ did the exact opposite and basically had Luke and Ben together for almost the entire series... and that led to nothing new really. Yeah, Vestara joined them, but its not like we had Luke reminiscing about old girlfriends, since most of them are dead (and FotJ especially seemed to go out of its way to kill off old Luke girlfriends) and trying to teach his son about dating, since she was a Sith, so they had to worry more about her killing them than just hurting her feelings.

    Worse yet, with Luke and Ben off on their own, nothing really interesting or entertaining happens on Coruscant for the rest of the series. I'm not sure if all the authors just failed at coming up with something for the characters on Coruscant to do (a particularly big problem for Han and Leia at their age, and with Han being just about the only non-Jedi main character left these days), or they really did plan to just have Luke and Ben as the main characters and separated them from the unimportant rest of the cast (the novel covers seem to support this with how Luke has the front spot literally a third of the time and both Ben and Vestara appear twice at least and everyone else is relegated to the backcover, if they appear at all). Even Jaina barely spent any time with them before always going back to Coruscant, ugh. I sometimes hoped that if Ben was back on Coruscant that would improve the Coruscant plot, but I doubt it. And Luke didn't even bother to bring R2 along.

    LotF failed with this too with Allana- with how the Solos rescued Allana and then realized she is their granddaughter and then... nothing. That was in Fury and I don't think Revelation bothered with that plot (though that was probably for the best, her characterization would probably have been mangled like most of the rest of the characters in that book), and by Invincible everyone was just gearing up for the twin duel, and after that, poof, series is over with plenty of leftover plot threads (and FotJ didn't clean up most of those plots either).

    I noted in another thread that there's not really any... cooldown moments. TUF set the bar very high with all the characters gathering for a drink and discussing stuff afterwards, but neither Invincible or Apocalypse had anything close to that. Its not like we get scenes like Luke quietly mourning Mara. No, instead Luke goes off and kills the wrong person, then is brooding, then its back to war and then the war is over and- that's it. No epilogue, not much character interaction at all. Like how in Invincible I think Jaina woke up after her duel, wondered what kind of practical joke her parents were playing on her with that ridiculous holonet news story about the new GA Chief of State, then she is introduced to Amelia and... that's it, its over.

    Actually, speaking of the Skywalker-Solo family, whatever happened to Jacen's body? They burned Mara's, or at least planned to, before she somehow made it vanish when Jacen entered the room (only for everyone to misinterpret the clue), but not sure if they said what happened to Jacen's. Jaina risked a lot to retrieve Anakin Solo's body and give it a proper pyre, but not sure what they would do with Jacen's.

    More character moments would be great, but first they need to work on their characterization too and really need to work on their plots. But the novels always just focus on starting up one war, or GA takeover, then that ends and then the next book has about 40 pages of quiet time before its back to war. Not like the movies themselves had blasters firing or lightsabers clashing for 90% of the time.
    manisphere, Ghost and ChildofWinds like this.
  15. JediMatteus Jedi Master

    after reading the last few posts, it just makes me sick that there is tons of potential that will enever be filled. Maybe Star Wars is dying. If we don't see a new generation of movies or somehing i think star wars is done within 10 years
  16. lukemaraben Jedi Knight

    I haven't finished FOTJ yet (just have Apocalypse to go), but focusing on Skywalker/Solo family relationships seems like a good follow up book to the series.

    I agree mix the characters up a bit.

    I would love to see Luke, Han, and Leia all together again. Then maybe have Jaina and Ben on the side doing their own thing.
  17. Jedifirefly5 Jedi Master

    after reading the last few posts, it just makes me sick that there is tons of potential that will enever be filled. Maybe Star Wars is dying. If we don't see a new generation of movies or somehing i think star wars is done within 10 years

    That seems to be the plan. They have Darth Denning coming back to kill off 3-4 more of them, apparently, since that seems to be his job. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if he kills off Han slipping in the tub.
  18. Ghost Jedi Grand Master

    I wonder if CRUCIBLE will focus on the relationships between the Big 3, and SWORD OF THE JEDI will focus on the relationships between Jaina and the rest of the younger generation?

    If Luke/Han/Leia do leave the galaxy and the story for good in CRUCIBLE, as I'm thinking/hoping, then the one bad side would be we won't get any Allana/Luke, Ben/Leia, Ben/Han if that happens. Or Luke/Leia having adventures with their cousins on Naboo. Or maybe we could, in stories set before CRUCIBLE.
  19. Force Smuggler Jedi Grand Master

    Here's hoping
  20. Ghost Jedi Grand Master

    We shall see soon enough, I have hope!

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