Discussion in 'The Movies' started by epic, May 19, 2012.
And I will respectfully disagree. Though that fight was awesome.
Disagree as well, and I think that fight was overrated.
What you just said is like saying the only thing good about the OT is the binary sunset.
This thread, I imagine, will probably turn out to be a bit like the "Empire Strikes Back is Not Enjoyable" thread, since it's really based on an opinion that will cause people to discuss the merits of the film (or films) in question. That said, do you think you could elucidate a bit on your biggest grievances with the prequels? Or perhaps describe why you like the main lightsaber fight in TPM?
Personally, I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment (the music in the PT alone is stupendous), but there's not really much I can say on the matter. I love a variety of things in the PT (the characters, storyline, pacing, themes, symbolism, etc.) but it feels a bit directionless to talk about these things since there's really no outline of the prequels' faults in the original post.
Basically, you gotta give us more to work with, friend.
Although I admit the prequels would kind of suck without the existence of the OT, the movies are IMO an underrated addition to the saga. You've just got to watch ANH after viewing the prequels (while keeping an open mind) to see that the prequels complement the originals entirely. The positive vibe of Ep4 is exaggerated when you have just watched the end of the Jedi and the Republic one film earlier.
And does Vader's trap in ESB not have new context and irony when you see how he was turned? Basically he is one evil bastard for doing what was done to him personally. I mean that is kind of a mind-****.
Return of the Jedi always signed off the OT quite well, but after watching six movies the payoff is far grander. But I'm focusing too much on the Original Trilogy.
The prequels have a fair bit going for them. I'm not a huge fan of AOTC, but to be fair I can't think of more emotional moments than scenes like Shmi's death. The OT has a lot of emotional moments, but can you say it has anything as intense as that? The Phantom Menace, which I find is the most underrated of the saga, introduces elements, themes, characters and worlds beautifully. Qui-Gon is a great character, I think he is often overlooked by the casual viewer. His wisdom echoes, perhaps intentionally, teachings from Yoda in the OT. He does teach Yoda between trilogies afterall.
One of the things I love about Ep1 is lines like "There's always a bigger fish". It might sound corny, but Yoda in ESB says stuff like that all the time.
Palpatine (totally IMO) is more complex in Revenge of the Sith than Return of the Jedi. In Ep6, as cool a bad guy as he is, he is pretty one-dimensional. The prequels add layers to the character, I'm surprised anyone who liked the OT can not find something cool in Palpatine's dialogue, and Anakin's seduction.
All I can say is... you need to watch more closely
Yoda was one big disappointment for me in the prequels. The writers had him say complex stuff to make him sound "wise" but it ended up being stupid stuff if you actually listen to what he says.
"hmmmmmmm.. Caught on to me, have you? Hmmmm?"
Palpatine : "There is no use Master Yoda. You will not stop me, because you are me. We both are full of BS. Hehehe."
The PT has a lot of good things, but unfortunately a lot of bad things too. I'd hardly say it has only one good part though. pretty much the only good part in TPM, but not in the whole trilogy
TPM was OK. It was probably the last of the Star Wars films I feel any kind of nostalgia for, so I also have that bias too. The movie dragged big time for me once they get to Coruscant, but then picks up again once they get back to Naboo. I also never quite understood what the logic for the Trade Federation blockading Naboo is. I get that they are protesting taxes, but I don't know what side of the fence they're on. Are they turning it into a free trade zone and the Trade Federation are upset because they can't collect taxes? Or is the senate imposing taxes and the Trade Federation are protesting the fact that they have to pay taxes on trade now?
Also, Palpatine is using the whole ordeal to create an emergency so that he can become Chancellor right? So when Palpatine tells the Trade Federation to kill the Jedi, what would have happened had they succeeded? Jedi die --> they don't rescue Amidala --> Amidala dies "much sooner than her people" (Gunray's words) --> Amidala doesn't warn the senate about her crisis --> Palpatine doesn't get a sympathy vote and become Chancellor... So his plot was hinging on the fact that the Neimoidians would screw everything up?
OK, ignoring that. Once Palpatine is confident that he will become Chancellor due to a sympathy vote, why does he still want Amidala to sign the treaty, and why does he tell the Trade Federation to "wipe them out, all of them?" Palpatine's already going to get what he wants, so why does he send Maul after the Jedi? That battle served no purpose. If Maul won, and Amidala was captured and signed the treaty, then it would all become legal, and the "crisis" ends.
I'm currently reading Darth Plagueis, and I hear that it sheds a lot of light on what TPM and AOTC were about... but there's something wrong if Lucas needs to rely on books to explain the plots of his films, if he can't make it clear himself.
Exactly, the plot doesn't make any sense. The crawl says that the Trade Federation is blockading the Naboo planet to put pressure on the Senate as a form of protest.
Yet, in the movie, the Senate have no idea that a blockade is even going on and then the TF deny it to the Senate. A clear contradiction.
plus the podracing, tatoine, and all the battles with the droids, and the jedi council scenes.....
oh wait thats all of the movie!
TPM has too much talking and not enough doing, it serves a purpose in terms of setting up who characters are but it does little else IMO.
Disagree. Anakin vs Obiwan in RoTS is the best lightsaber duel in the PT.
I thought that was the most idiotic duel out of all 6 movies. I didn't think it could get worse than Obi/Anakin vs Dooku in AOTC but apparently I was wrong.
Please explain why you think it was idiotic. I would like your reasoning.
anakin vs obiwan was great, what are you talking about?
You don't know how wrong you are, OP.
I sense a parody thread.
I'm inclined to agree, though. I like the PT just for the spectacle. I like the story of the OT better, and in a way I wish I hadn't seen the PT to still have that sense of mystery about the past when watching it. Now when I watch the OT, I know all the backstory. Takes all the wonder out of it. Especially when that backstory, IMHO, turned out to be so lame.
The best thing IMO would be the OT with the production values of the PT. The battle of Hoth is horribly boring. Ironically, it is also the one that is the most adapted to videogame form, despite being the most boring of the three OT movie battles. Curious.