| Author |
Topic:
[GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Darth_Guy
Registered:
Aug '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:51pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Obi-Zahn Kenobi posted:
Basically, I am apprehensive about gay marriage because I don't want any churches getting in trouble for refusing to perform or recognize homosexual marriages. I mean, if marriage between a man and a man is a right, then if two men go to their local parish and ask their priest to perform a marriage for them, and he says, "Sure! It'll be swell." Then the diocese finds out about it and excommunicates the priest, does he not now have legal grounds to sue the Catholic church?
Er, as far as I know religious institutions are not forced to perform weddings for any heterosexual couple who requests it, so why would it be any different for homosexuals?
-----signature-----
Gravity has taken better men than me.
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
GrandAdmiralJello
Title:
Emperor
• EUC
• JCC
Registered:
Nov '00
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:51pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
|
OZK: Well, it shouldn't necessarily infringe on the churches involved and force them to perform those marriages, but yeah, I can see the concern.
-----signature-----
Roma Æterna|SPQR  Imperium Sine Fine "Moribus antiquis res stat Romana virisque" -Ennius, Annales "Tu regere imperio populos, Romanæ, memento;hæ tibi erunt artes; pascisque imponere morem, parcere subjectis et debellare superbos" -Virgil, Aeneid
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
DarthLassic007
Registered:
Nov '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:52pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Stay on topic. Stay on topic.
-----signature-----
Veni, Vidi, Vici. - Julius Caesar
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Obi-Zahn Kenobi
Registered:
Aug '99
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:54pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Darth_Guy posted:
Er, as far as I know religious institutions are not forced to perform weddings for any heterosexual couple who requests it, so why would it be any different for homosexuals?
Well, are religious institutions forced to perform interracial, heterosexual marriages else they lose their tax-exempt status or are open to lawsuit? I don't know the answer.
If not, there's nothing to worry about. But the fact is, almost any refusal to marry any homosexual couple will be on the basis that it's homosexual, and there will be a clear case for discrimination in pretty much every instance of refusal to perform the marriage (don't see how there wouldn't be, actually).
I mean, there's a difference. I can't discriminate against someone with my secular establishment (like a resturant or something) because of race, creed, gender, or sexual orientation. Why should religious institutions be allowed to do the same?
-----signature-----
life's a piece of ****, when you look at it
life's a laugh and death's a joke it's true
you'll see it's all a show, just keep 'em laughing as you go
just remember that the last laugh is on you!
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
lexu
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:56pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Obi-Zahn Kenobi posted:
Basically, I am apprehensive about gay marriage because I don't want any churches getting in trouble for refusing to perform or recognize homosexual marriages. I mean, if marriage between a man and a man is a right, then if two men go to their local parish and ask their priest to perform a marriage for them, and he says, "Sure! It'll be swell." Then the diocese finds out about it and excommunicates the priest, does he not now have legal grounds to sue the Catholic church?
Obviously, right now the precedent of the Boy Scouts holds. But I mean, what if it was a black man and a white woman, and a theoretically racist Catholic church excommunicated the priest for performing that marriage?
I don't want the government forcing religions to recognize gay marriage. If the government wants to recognize it, leave it up to the people.
They can refuse to perform services for a variety of reasons, including not being the right religion. If a Jewish person can't sue a Catholic Priest for refusing, why would a gay person be able to sue?
-----signature-----
as you talk to me, too much you're assuming
we don't always want what's right
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Darth_Guy
Registered:
Aug '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:56pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Well, I assume that at least some KKK members and neo-Nazis belong to churches that cater to their views... 
-----signature-----
Gravity has taken better men than me.
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
jp-30
Title: Ex-games Manager
Registered:
Dec '00
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:57pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Lord_Vivec posted:
I've found it funny why you guys care about my anger at marriage being used by the government? I support the right for same-sex couples to get the same rights and benefits as heterosexual couples. Isn't that enough for you?
The weird thing is that the sticking point seems to be the use of a single "sacred" word. I assume if we were to call civil unions, say, 'Murriages' (which afforded all a couple the same rights and benefits as a Marriage) then you would be totally OK with that?
Isn't that a bit... silly?
-----signature-----
`1234567890-=
qwertyuiop[]
asdfghjkl;'\
\zxcvbnm,./
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Lord_Vivec
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:58pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
jp-30 posted:
Lord_Vivec posted:
I've found it funny why you guys care about my anger at marriage being used by the government? I support the right for same-sex couples to get the same rights and benefits as heterosexual couples. Isn't that enough for you?
The weird thing is that the sticking point seems to be the use of a single "sacred" word. I assume if we were to call civil unions, say, 'Murriages' (which afforded all a couple the same rights and benefits as a Marriage) then you would be totally OK with that?
Isn't that a bit... silly?
I suppose it's silly to you, but not to me.
-----signature-----
Lord Sithis, Dark Lord of Entropy  Senator of the Disciples of Lady Lumiya and Lord Shadowspawn Sith Governor of the Imperial Knights! Resistance is futile! Sinrebirth for Sith Emperor '08  Iron Gauntlet of the Sith
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
ellybeanjay
Registered:
Jul '00
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:58pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Lord_Vivec posted:
harpuah posted:
Good job turning it around... but I meant... what religion are YOU referring to.
I was referring to the Catholic Church, which coined the term "matrimony." I am unfamiliar what other religions call it, if they even have one.
So if you're not catholic, and do not get the sacrament of marriage as the church provides, then you're not really married in any sense, including legally?
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Obi-Zahn Kenobi
Registered:
Aug '99
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:58pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
lexu posted:
They can refuse to perform services for a variety of reasons, including not being the right religion. If a Jewish person can't sue a Catholic Priest for refusing, why would a gay person be able to sue?
Because the gay person is being discriminated against solely on the basis of his homosexuality.
-----signature-----
life's a piece of ****, when you look at it
life's a laugh and death's a joke it's true
you'll see it's all a show, just keep 'em laughing as you go
just remember that the last laugh is on you!
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Darth_Guy
Registered:
Aug '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 10:59pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
|
You can't refuse a Jewish person service in a restaurant without being sued, so there's still that...
-----signature-----
Gravity has taken better men than me.
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
lexu
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
5/15 11:00pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Lord_Vivec posted:
jp-30 posted:
Lord_Vivec posted:
I've found it funny why you guys care about my anger at marriage being used by the government? I support the right for same-sex couples to get the same rights and benefits as heterosexual couples. Isn't that enough for you?
The weird thing is that the sticking point seems to be the use of a single "sacred" word. I assume if we were to call civil unions, say, 'Murriages' (which afforded all a couple the same rights and benefits as a Marriage) then you would be totally OK with that?
Isn't that a bit... silly?
I suppose it's silly to you, but not to me.
On pain of irrationality...
-----signature-----
as you talk to me, too much you're assuming
we don't always want what's right
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Lord_Vivec
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
5/15 11:00pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Darth_Guy posted:
You can't refuse a Jewish person service in a restaurant without being sued, so there's still that...
What services could a Jewish person get in a church?
-----signature-----
Lord Sithis, Dark Lord of Entropy Senator of the Disciples of Lady Lumiya and Lord Shadowspawn Sith Governor of the Imperial Knights! Resistance is futile! Sinrebirth for Sith Emperor '08 Iron Gauntlet of the Sith
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
ellybeanjay
Registered:
Jul '00
|
Date Posted:
5/15 11:01pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Obi-Zahn Kenobi posted:
lexu posted:
They can refuse to perform services for a variety of reasons, including not being the right religion. If a Jewish person can't sue a Catholic Priest for refusing, why would a gay person be able to sue?
Because the gay person is being discriminated against solely on the basis of his homosexuality.
But homosexuality would be just as protected a class as religion is, so why would one be held over the other?
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
dp4m
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Nov '01
|
Date Posted:
5/15 11:01pm
Subject:
RE: [GOOOOOOOOO CALI] California lifts gay marriage ban
|
Darth_Guy posted:
You can't refuse a Jewish person service in a restaurant without being sued, so there's still that...
Hey! I--- no, well, I guess that's true...
-----signature-----
"Looks like you're about to get pwned" - Eric Cartman
"On another note, 'diplomacy' is one of the most versatile words in the player character arsenal. It covers pretty much any conceivable action in any imaginable scenario." - Darths & Droids
|
|
|
Quote Reply |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
