Author Topic: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (WARNING: Revolutions Spoilers)
masterskywalker  6085 posts
Registered: Nov '01
23685_Anakin
Date Posted: 5/15/03 8:38am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~* - Date Edited: 5/15/03 8:44am (2 edits total) Edited By: masterskywalker
Lord Gita, to Dp4m you should listen. wink

**SPOILERS!**








































4's right, the matrix's "loop" is to account for the weakness in the matrix's system, human choice. If people reject the matrix, the system doesn't work. The prophecy of the one is a shame designed to get the one, the only person capible of freeing humanity, under control by presenting him with a hostage crisis. Essentially, the only way the matrix survivies is if the one gives up his greatest power, choice. Neo, was the first to say bull****, to that system and now he's in uncharted territory. The machine allowed each Zion to exist because keeping the matrix cycle going is more important that dealing with a few renegade humans. Now it's sink or swim time, either humanity breaks out of its prison for the last time and regains its rightful place in the world, or will be wiped out forever. And no, Neo is NOT a program for the reasons mentioned above. The one is ALWAYS a human who subconciously rejects the matrix. His digidized code (what everyone in the matrix looks like to him green code, remember trinity code during her death? well she's certainly not a program)is what they need in the source to start the cycle again.

And bullseye, just because the real world is devastated, doesn't mean it's instant death for anyone that goes out side. It'd be like after a nuke holocaust (sans the raditation)What, you think this is super mario brothers and they're touching lava or something? tongue









































*End Spoilers*

 

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Gandalf the Grey  13259 posts
Registered: May '00
6170_Padme
Date Posted: 5/15/03 8:47am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
Would anyone mind if this was made into a spoiler thread?



SPOILERS











Isn't the only place habitable in the "real" world, Zion. So why in the hell were Neo, Trinity, Morphoeus, and Link running around in the sewer system at the end

Just because they can survive on that level doesn't mean it's habitable. Habitable implies that people can survive there for a while. I doubt that there’s a good water supply where they were, and the potential for random gases to fill the tunnels rather than oxygen.














END SPOILERS

 

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Meatypants  702 posts
Registered: May '02
46159_Robot Chicken: Palpatine Phone
Date Posted: 5/15/03 9:19am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~* - Date Edited: 5/15/03 9:22am (1 edits total) Edited By: Meatypants
I loved the movie. I loved the dancing/sex scene, because, like the Oracle, said, this love is fleeting. It's good to see some of their love before it goes away, or is taken away. And the dance scene works on a purely Ewok celebratory level. wink

Anyway, on to spoilers...


SPOILERS**********************














Zion is a firewall. Was this not implied, if not stated, by the Architect? He states that they allow Zion to exist for that 1% of humanity that will resist the Matrix. They never said that it was reality. So Zion is a firewall, just another level of the Matrix. This is why I think that Neo can use his Matrix abilities in Zion at the end. This would be the mindjob to end all mindjobs in Revolutions. Agree or disagree?

 

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weezer  13819 posts
Registered: May '01
43869_Midbie
Date Posted: 5/15/03 9:35am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~* - Date Edited: 5/15/03 9:37am (1 edits total) Edited By: weezer
You're the mod Gandolf, make it a spoiler thread if you want, it will save me from doing this:

Spoilers
















The firewall theory is interesting, it looks like it would have to be something similar as neo's powers work in the real world now. I think that was the best part, the fact that the "I am your Father" type twists came one right after another there at the end. I surprised that so many don't like the way that some themes are repeated from the first one. Maybe I've just gotten used to it from the PT. tongue

Edit: BTW, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that didn't see the rave/sex scene as a total waste of time.

 

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Lurking_Around  11694 posts
Registered: May '02
42104_Joruus C'baoth
Date Posted: 5/15/03 9:42am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
I've seen "Matrix: Reloaded". Not impressed at all. I'll probably do a longer review later, but for now the best thing tired ol' me can do is to point the few things I did like:

--The new character, Link the operator (or whatever his name is). I like the fact that they took the time to flesh him out, showing a human character, unlike the trio of uber-cool demigods like Neo, Morpheus and Trinity. Link's scenes in Zion are the only bright spots of what is otherwise the same ol generic dark "apocalyptic" city you'd see in all other sci-fis.

--No one can do bullet time like the directors of the Matrix movies. When they do it, it has a certain charm, and the angles are used well. When others do it, I feel like tearing my hair out laugh (and IMHO the worst use of "Matrix-style FX" is the movie 'Daredevil'. Awful, just awful).

--"Misterrrrr Anderrrson!". I get a big silly grin on my face everytime Elrond...I mean, Agent Smith tongue said those words. Hugo Weaving's character still has a certain charm to it, despite the totally cartoonish fight scene (everyone knows the one I'm referring to, no?). Long live Agent Smith!!! (oops, was that a spoiler tongue ).

--Morpheus with katana slicing vehicle = coooooool!!! Sadly, that was the only use of weapons that I was impressed with.

And....those are the only good things I can speak of. Oh, and only ten people (including myself) stayed behind for the trailer. Tsk tsk.

So, in summary, X-2 is still the best summer movie of the year for me...so far. I'll just end this with those immortal words of Agent Smith...

"Misterrrr Anderrrson!"

grin

Oh, and I'll probably give it another viewing before I gather my thoughts and write a complete review...maybe.

 

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smauldookie  5439 posts
Registered: Mar '02
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:07am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
pc.ign.com

E3 2003: The Matrix Online

What was announced one year ago is now Ubi Soft's. Will you stay in Wonderland?



May 13, 2003 - Last E3 we learned that Monolith and EON (the company owned by the acclaimed Wachowski brothers) were busy developing a videogame rendition of the Matrix fiction in addition to what Shiny was doing with its own Enter the Matrix. That videogame, then tentatively dubbed The Matrix Online has grown to become...The Matrix Online. You guessed it, this E3 we're once again talking about a massively multiplayer title in the Matrix universe, only now it's coming from Ubi Soft (co-published by Warner Bros. Studios) sometime in the second half of 2004 following a late 2003 beta test. Basically, Ubi will distribute the Monolith developed MMO and manage the entire thing once it goes live, while Warner Bros. Studios will be responsible for overseeing story and content development.
Like the movies, The Matrix Online takes place in the zoo created by the machines to house unwitting humans for energy. Portrayed as a sprawling urban metropolis, the environment of Matrix Online will house thousands of players simultaneously. While the daft populous goes about its business, gamers will be waging the secret war (stabbing Agent Smith with a big stick or a car or something). It's man versus machine all over again.

Based on what little we know of the game, Matrix Online is going to be the next step in the Matrix fiction and is supposed to pick up right where the trilogy leaves off, which itself may be a spoiler (whoops, it appears the Matrix is still around after Revolutions, oh well). I wouldn't get too angry about having the films ruined for you. The story of this one is penned by the same folks responsible for the flicks, so if they're cool with saying what it's all about, we're cool with saying what it's all about. With that and the very nature of the game in mind, it's unlikely we'll see the kinds of presentation and production values we're seeing placed into Enter the Matrix. So, I wouldn't suddenly expect to see hours upon hours of actual new footage added to the game. But what we will see is a lot of action and a lot of classic Matrix suave in persistent world form.

Already, Matrix Online is boasting some impressive features. True to the films, the game revolves around intense action in an open urban setting that "stretches on for miles." This is all there to get the point of "this game is cool" across to players. To do this, expect the title to employ dozens of weapons and martial arts maneuvers that are all built off of the same Matrix-esque action seen in the films. How special effects popularized by the movie and new ones to be popularized by its sequels will be faithfully delivered in a real-time environment with limitless players remains to be seen, as does the exact nature of the combat system, but the basics all seem to be there.

Of course, what's an MMO game without character development and some lasting draw to continue playing? Improve your own character much? This is where Matrix Online gets clever. So you can build your own bad ass all wrapped up in ass cradling, tight, sexy leather. Yeah, yeah, yeah... But, you can also earn and obtain hundreds of different powers (there is no spoon). And, once you have these powers, you can trade them with other people just as if they were baseball cards! Whoa.


What's the point of all of this? To kick ass in a nearly infinite amount of generated "missions" that promise real, dramatic storyline "revelations." Here comes the first bit of skepticism. I've seen a load of behind the scenes Matrix documentaries, and according to every person interviewed, the trilogy tells the whole story. When asked about the potential of a fourth film, Keanu himself admitted, "The trilogy is it. I think we've told the story." How it's going to extend beyond this for pretty much ever and still remain intriguing and interesting is another unknown. If anyone can do it, Monolith and the Wachowski's own EON Entertainment sure can. Joel Silver, producer of the Matrix films, sure thinks the story and the game will be fine:
"The Wachowski Brothers' vision for The Matrix is one that extends far beyond the theatrical trilogy, and the world they have created is so rich that we've chosen to tell inter-connected Matrix-related stories in multiple mediums. Our goal in collaborating with Ubi Soft is to create a multiplayer online game that reflects the trilogy's highly stylized storytelling and innovative action, taking fans beyond the boundaries of the movie screen and into a 'persistent world' where they can fully explore the vast realm of the Matrix."
Yves Guillemot, President of Ubi Soft Entertainment, also chimes in with:

"Imagine if the Matrix existed today, if millions of people could enter a simulation so convincing, so real, that they believed it to be an actual place. Ubi Soft and Warner Bros. Studios will bring the Matrix universe to life -- enabling gamers throughout the world to participate in the continuously evolving world of The Matrix Online."
There's no doubt that the prospect is great. But then that's the same thing we all thought about Enter the Matrix, which really hasn't turned out as expected. Here's the problem: The Matrix is all about style, visual splendor, and extremely fast, extremely fluid action whether it be with guns, swords, or fists. Translating all of this into a singleplayer action title is difficult enough, but doing it and doing it right for an MMO is going to be an insanely difficult task. Monolith has talent, for sure. The creators of NOLF, Shogo, Aliens vs. Predator 2 and TRON 2.0 are no slouches when it comes to delivering quality games. Keep in mind that all of those titles are first-person shooters heavy on ranged combat. The Matrix demands third-person action heavy on melee combat. Normally we'd still believe Monolith was more than up to the task; however, is massively multiplayer technology really at a state to deliver the seamless, fluid action experience with dozens, hundreds, or even thousands of players that gamers are going to want, demand and expect of a title branded with the mighty Matrix name? Classic MMO "just shut up and hit the A key" to fight mentality won't cut it, nor will lag and stuttering issues. At this point it's impossible to tell whether the technology and design are there to deliver what you have in mind.

One thing is certain, add this to Shadowbane and Uru and Ubi's growing focus on an online gaming world should become pretty apparent. MMO Matrix seems like an instant money machine -- of yeah. So did Sims Online -- oh no. How it will turn out in the end is anybody's guess, but with a franchise this big and a developer this talented, it's impossible not to be optimistic.

We'll be sure to come back later on in the show to deliver more details on The Matrix Online. Of course, after that we'll be back with all the tender loving care only the lady in red can provide until this baby launches in 2004.


-- Ivan Sulic

pc.ign.com

 

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JediMaster22  36356 posts
Registered: Oct '99
48661_YJCC (61909)
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:20am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~* - Date Edited: 5/15/03 10:23am (3 edits total) Edited By: JediMaster22
I saw Matrix Reloaded!!!

As much as I rooted for X-men 2's success, Matrix reloaded was a Great entertaining movie that... steals my X-citement for X2, Today! Hell, I'd see it again this weekend!

Let's say, this movie had everything a red-blooded man like me wanted.

Let's start off with the Unbelievable fight sequences. They were very long, very awesome, and it made me VERY VERY happy. grin

Second, Clevages, you get that from a bunch of Hot woman in this movie, mainly Monica Bellucci's!! grin

Third, Plot twists and Suspense. Just clever - I felt! This movie IS Cool cool I can't deny that no matter what!

Too bad X-men 2 will be compared a lackster by many now, but it isn't! sad

Oh, stay AFTER the Credits! Matrix Revolution trailer will show if you do that. You don't really wanna to miss the exciting preview for the conclusion wink

 

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KaineDamo  5008 posts
Registered: Mar '02
14706_AT-AT
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:34am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
I would mind if this were turned into a spoiler thread! I can't see the movie till next week!

 

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Gandalf the Grey  13259 posts
Registered: May '00
6170_Padme
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:39am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
Until and unless someone complains, this is now a spoiler thread.

 

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Meatypants  702 posts
Registered: May '02
46159_Robot Chicken: Palpatine Phone
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:39am Subject: RE: *~ Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix Discussion Thread ~*
"Edit: BTW, I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that didn't see the rave/sex scene as a total waste of time."

I liked it for many reasons.

1. Because it works on an Ewok level, as a great celebratory moment. This is the last dance of Zion.

2. The sex scene is a great follow-up to the romance established in Matrix.

3. As Persephone said, "that love is fleeting." Getting to see the love shared by this couple, as well as the love of the Zionites for their "reality," we know that it's probably going to be yanked away from them. And Persphone's lines only make more sense when we learn of this being the 6th Matrix/Zion.

4. While everyone considers Cypher villainous for embracing the Matrix, no one accuses the Zionites for doing the same thing. What if it is a firewall, a failsafe? What if they're just as enslaved as they were before? What does that say about they pride and their tendency to kill "enemies" in the Matrix, just for not embracing their case? I think that Morpheus, as well as the Zionites, might have some retribution to pay for their pride. And this scene shows a lot of that.

 

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JediMaster22  36356 posts
Registered: Oct '99
48661_YJCC (61909)
Date Posted: 5/15/03 10:57am Subject: RE: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (spoilers for Reloaded only) - Date Edited: 5/15/03 10:58am (1 edits total) Edited By: JediMaster22
Hey, don't ever forget: Sex sells wink

 

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Sau-Den  2111 posts
Registered: Aug '02
23962_Obi-Wan Kenobi
Date Posted: 5/15/03 11:00am Subject: RE: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (spoilers for Reloaded only) - Date Edited: 5/15/03 11:04am (1 edits total) Edited By: Sau-Den
Okay, I think I got it now, but how can it be a cycle really? Because Zion exists in the real world! Wouldn't the people who were chosen to survive and rebuild Zion like pass on what happened to others? Why wouldn't it go into some type of history and people would know about it?

EDIT: Also, I loved the cliff-hanger at the end! I mean it's a real cliff-hanger! Not like other movies that end the overall story put still try to let you know there is more to come (e.g. X-Men, Spider-man, AOTC), I really loved this movie, I think I liked it better than the first one, just the type of tone that it had was awesome, I liked the time they spent in Zion. I'm a sucker for apocolypic-type cities in sci-fi films. And the Burly Brawl was utterly amazing!

 

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Darth Blasphemous  2402 posts
Registered: Jun '99
6276_Darth Sidious
Date Posted: 5/15/03 11:31am Subject: RE: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (spoilers for Reloaded only)
Saw it last night and thought it rocked. It does suffer from the so-called Middle Child Syndrome, but that is what typically happens with trilogies. Like AOTC (actually moreso than AOTC), it entertained the hell out of me when it was at its best. In all honesty, its slow spots didn't drag near as much as AOTC IMO.

Overall, I'm happy with it and look forward to this November!

 

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Princess_Tina  10279 posts
Registered: May '01
14698_Padme
Date Posted: 5/15/03 11:33am Subject: RE: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (spoilers for Reloaded only)
Saw it last night too, it was a blast! grin

Of course it's a bit annoying to have the movie end with a cliffhanger (but then again, so did ESB!) but other than that it opened up the Matrix universe and it was great to see them try new and different things.

I really can't wait until "Revolutions" (there is a trailer for it after the credits of "Reloaded"), and I especially can't wait until the whole trilogy is out on DVD!! grin

 

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merlin  4083 posts
Registered: May '99
44383_Jawa
Date Posted: 5/15/03 11:33am Subject: RE: Matrix: Reloaded, Revolutions and Animatrix (spoilers for Reloaded only)
dp4m said:
Basically, what we learned is that the Architect built The Matrix. He built the FIRST Matrix as a perfect utopian paradise... and humans rejected it because we're, by nature, imperfect, flawed creatures -- because we require CHOICE. So there was a specific program created to analyze and understand human behavior -- what we know as the Oracle -- and she determined that humans would 99% accept the Matrix as long as they had a choice in the matter, even if the choice was at a deep subconscious level. HOWEVER, by programming this ability for choice into the system, it created an inherently imperfect subroutine -- since choice cannot accurately be predicted -- and that rounding error of sorts is what's called a "systemic anomaly," or The One. So the 1% of humans who reject The Matrix end up forming Zion and luring more people out of the Matrix, however -- this is a repeating process so Zion has been formed, and The One found, FIVE TIMES already. The machines have destroyed Zion and The One the same five times and have become "exceedingly good at it." So now the Architect gave Neo the choice -- continue with that recursive causality loop (i.e. Zion would be destroyed but the human race would continue), or save Trinity and confine the human race to extinction.


I was confused with the choice Neo made though. It looked to me that when he made the choice to go save Trinity, that all 5 other "Neos" made the same choice. All the other other Neos in the TV Screens behind him turned and went to the same door as he did. It makes more sense that they would have chosen the other door and picked the humans to form the new Zion, like the Achitect said. It fits with the storyline "It was HE that freed the first of us" -- Morpheus from the Matrix.

So that confused me. Did they ALL make the same choice? Then eventually go back to the Architect? They never showed that Trinity ACTUALLY died those 5 other times. They just show her getting shot, and SOMEONE hitting the car on the ground after the fall. But it wasn't clear if that was Trinity or the Agent. So I'm assuming that each neo, each time made the same choice.

And I agree with Meatypants about Zion and the other level of the Matrix. I had that same thought in the theater. I think the "real world" will just end up being another part of the matrix. "You ever get that feeling, when you don't know if you are awake or still dreaming?" -- Neo from the Matrix. But maybe Neo can actually start to save people from the real matrix this time?

 

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