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Author	Topic: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
Mc-Lan Registered: Sep '03	Date Posted: 2/3/04 3:57pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	What is Nibiru? I heard someone talking abut it. This post made possible by Mc-Lan -----signature----- Support the MODS! I move for a Vote of No Confidence in Chancellor PhilipWise's leadership. Vote Now!!! Vote Now!!! Vote Now!!! "Sméagol popped out like Janet's right boob..."
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/3/04 4:15pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	Nibiru is the mythological 10th planet or Planet X. it has also been called Nemesis. it is supposed to be a planet with a very large orbit that brings it in close to Earth every eon or so. This is also supposed to be the planet where the nephilim come from, a word taken from the Bible mentioning giants that walked the Earth. UFO stuff basically. -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/3/04 4:16pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD - Date Edited: 2/3/04 4:18pm (1 edits total) Edited By: VadersLaMent
	OOPS! Double post. Damn AOL. -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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MasterAero Registered: Aug '02	Date Posted: 2/4/04 5:35am Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD - Date Edited: 2/4/04 5:37am (1 edits total) Edited By: MasterAero
	This is honestly getting interesting more so than it was. What I am not understanding here though is this; the CEV, formerly called OSP, what is to be NASA's new space ship, are they trying to get Kistler to make it? Are they throwing funds out to see who takes the ball and runs with it? Boeing and Lockheed are getting over a BILLION dollars for their heavy lift vehicle programs. Now, if I could just get NASA to trust ME with a few hundred million..... THe views expressed are my own and not necessarily the official position of any gov't agency The full mission of the CEV is still being debated. More than likely, it will have several missions. One will be to go back and forth from the station on top of ELV. (Right now, prob a delta or LM Atlas) The other mission will be to use the same spaceship either to take crew all the way to the moon and mars or just to take the crew to the lunar/mars vehicle already in Earth orbit. More than likely the CEV will fit into a modular design and for an ISS mission it will simply be the capsule/service module on top of an ELV. For lunar missions it will be part of a larger (undetermined) system that goes to the moon/mars. I hadn't really heard much about Kistler being considered for a launch vehicle. Its a pretty safe assumption that there's going to be a need for a heavy launch capability though. All these details are still being worked. (by me ) Also, these new terms like Project Constellation aren't necessarily the final nomenclature for the program...just a development term. Something catchier/cooler may be used when the project gets further along. EDIT: Lockheed and Boeing are the primary contractors to build the CEV. THat could change but i doubt it. -----signature----- My whole life all I've wanted to do is fly, bomb stuff, shoot people down.
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Yoda_yo_mama Registered: Dec '02	Date Posted: 2/4/04 5:38am Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	Pluto was called Planet X back in the day. How can they think there is a tenth planet when Pluto might not be a planet itself. It could be a piece of the Oort Cloud. -----signature----- Ward room #307 Go Spurs ! He is Risen !!!! I stayed spoiler free. And it was worth it ! Dark Lord
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HawkNC Title: FanForce RSA Oceania Registered: Oct '01	Date Posted: 2/4/04 5:39am Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	I <3 you, MasterAero. -----signature----- Use dp/dt -- Come now, do you really expect me to do coordinate substitution in my head while strapped to a centrifuge?
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MasterAero Registered: Aug '02	Date Posted: 2/4/04 5:52am Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	HawkNC. Its a good time to be a young engineer if you want to work at NASA. When I got out of school i had to wait a few years to get on cause they weren't hiring anyone. This recent legislation just passed should allow them to hire more younger college grads and mid level engineers. Since you're in college I'd highly recommend trying to get a co-op/internship if you can do that back and forth from Australia. Check this NASA site for more info about the bill. NASA -----signature----- My whole life all I've wanted to do is fly, bomb stuff, shoot people down.
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HawkNC Title: FanForce RSA Oceania Registered: Oct '01	Date Posted: 2/4/04 5:55am Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	Given that I'm in an entirely different country and all, an internship would be difficult to say the least. Cool as anything, but difficult. I'm trying to get enough money to do a semester in the US anyway, make a few contacts and get an idea of what the aerospace industry's like in the US. I'll end up in NASA yet, though, even if it's as a janitor. -----signature----- Use dp/dt -- Come now, do you really expect me to do coordinate substitution in my head while strapped to a centrifuge?
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MasterAero Registered: Aug '02	Date Posted: 2/4/04 12:37pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	From nasawatch: The actor who plays the captain on TV's Star Trek has said he thinks resources spent on sending people into space should be used on "getting this place right first". Patrick Stewart said Earth should be our focus rather than other planets. "I'm a bit of a wet blanket when it comes to the whole business of space travel," he said in a BBC interview." Editor's note: I guess they didn't get all of those Borg implants out after all. Its as if millions of trekkies suddendly cried out in fear. -----signature----- My whole life all I've wanted to do is fly, bomb stuff, shoot people down.
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/4/04 3:16pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	^That is why, when it all boils down, Shatner is the superior ST Captain as he does support and is interested in space travel. He is also of course, a sci fi author and his most recent book was a summary of furturistic technology. But I still like Stewart. About Kistler: For the test missions envisioned by NASA, the K-1 would have a payload capability of approximately 7,000 pounds up-mass and 2,000 pounds down-mass to the International Space Station (ISS). Also intended to be demonstrated are autonomous rendezvous and proximity operations (ARPO) with ISS. After five demonstrations of the K-1, NASA anticipates using the vehicle for APRO ISS resupply after 2006. NASA has decided to make the work sole-source to Kistler without competitive bids because the Agency knows of no other businesses which could perform the work. Such alternative businesses have until February 14 to identify themselves to NASA for potential competitive bidding before the Kistler contract changes are binding. ^That from sciscoops.com. Eleswhere is says that this contract is an information only contract and not a launch contract. NASA could in fact go with another company for launch services. In other news, the X-43 had a test while being carried on a B-52 bomber. This was called a captive carry evaluation in that it did not separate. The scramjet is due for its flight test on the 21st of this month. So far the Hubble Space telescope is still doomed. NASA has said they will not perform another service mission but would be open to approve options of someone else wants to do it. Anyone have an extra billion dollars laying around?? If you want to look at the budget for NASA in detail you can go HERE This is the request and not the approval. I have not looked at it yet but I will in the coming days. -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/5/04 12:35pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	Ok Congress, the ball is in your court: NASA's Moon-Mars Plans Take Shape By Robert Roy Britt Senior Science Writer posted: 06:30 am ET 05 February 2004 Planning for NASA's return to the Moon is now in full swing and officials expect to meet the tight timetable of putting a robot there by 2008. Meanwhile, the focus of robotic Mars missions will soon shift to further prepare for human exploration. As analysts had expected, a stark financial and resource refocusing is underway at NASA in which robotic efforts will be planned less for pure science and more for supporting future human spaceflight. The first mission to the Moon will likely be an orbiter that generates NASA's first digital map of the pockmarked world, officials said Wednesday. It will be a reconnaissance craft designed to help prepare for a return of astronauts as early as 2015, as envisioned last month by President George W. Bush. The second new lunar foray, in 2009, will be with a robotic lander whose goals are not yet clear. "These missions will not be driven by science," said Ed Weiler, associate administrator for the NASA’s Office of Space Science. "They will be driven by preparations for human landings." The initial robotic journey back to the Moon will nonetheless yield "a lot of science," Weiler said, but "we are going to the Moon to prepare to go to Mars, where we will do the real science." I cringe a little at comments like that. Once again, the Moon makes for a nice stepping stone, but it is also a world unto itself. Paying for the vision Some geologists are eager for human exploration of Mars in order to conduct an investigation more thorough than what can be accomplished with robots. Some say only humans will be able to determine whether Mars does or ever did harbor life, and only humans can turn all the pages of the complex book of geology written in Martian rocks. Critics argue you can send dozens of robots for the price of one manned mission. Weiler and his colleagues spoke to reporters Wednesday in a conference call, explaining details of the President's 2005 budget request that has just been sent to Congress. In that request is additional funding for NASA, lifting the agency's budget from $15.38 billion to $16.24 billion. It also details how existing funds will be redirected to support the White House goal of returning astronauts to the Moon and eventually putting people on Mars. Astronomers and planetary scientists have worried that the president's new vision might cause casualties in robotic and telescopic programs. "Space science is alive and well," Weiler declared. "We have healthy budget increases. In comparison to the rest of the government we obviously have nothing to complain about." However, NASA remains firm, he said, on a decision not to service the Hubble Space Telescope. That conclusion was reached based on concern for astronaut safety, not budget issues, the agency maintains. Hubble could last into 2008 but almost surely not beyond. As mentioned in a previous post, NASA can give permission to anyone else who wants to try and service it themselves, but they won't pay fo rit or take any responsibility for it or any repairs. Robotic alternatives have been suggested, but NASA doesn't want to touch it. Back to the Moon The 2005 NASA spending request -- less than 1 percent of the overall federal budget -- must be approved by Congress and could be picked apart. Space policy analysts say Bush and NASA must convince lawmakers and the public that the added cost of sending people beyond low-Earth orbit is worthwhile. Space science would get $4.07 billion, up from $3.97 billion in 2004. Earth science would drop from $1.61 billion to $1.49 billion. Biological science research would rise from $985 million to $1.05 billion. The remainder of the budget would be spent mostly on human spaceflight efforts, including the shuttle program, the space station, and research into a new vehicle capable of flying astronauts to the Moon. Bush has called for a phase-out of the shuttles after space station construction is completed. Then money from both those projects would be diverted to the new vision. In the new NASA, robotic missions must more closely relate to the overall effort to put people on other worlds. Weiler pointed out that prior to the Apollo missions, robots photographed the Moon from above and landers explored the surface. A similar but more expedited robotic campaign will be carried out this time. NASA often plans robotic missions over the course of a decade or so. Now scheduling is on a comparative fast track. "We've got a pretty good idea of what we want to do with the first Moon mission," Weiler said, adding that he's confident the orbiter can be ready in four years. "This will be the first digital recon mission of the Moon," he said. In addition to high-resolution photographs, the orbiter will likely work to map lunar resources, such as water ice that is suspected of hiding in permanently shadowed craters. Frozen water would be a key resource for any future Moon base, providing drinking water and, when broken down into hydrogen, fuel for return flights or missions beyond the Moon. Another probe took a sensor reading of the north pole of the Moon and did not find any large traces of water in those craters. Perhaps a closer look may reveal the final answer. The initial lunar craft might also include a radiation detector. Ironically, NASA knows more about the potentially harmful radiation environment at Mars than it does with the Moon. A follow-up lander mission, in 2009, may or may not include a rover, Weiler said. New focus at Mars Mars missions will begin shifting focus early in the next decade, said Orlando Figueroa, one of Weiler's top lieutenants and the NASA official in charge of exploring the Moon and planets. So far, Mars missions have been geared toward the search for water, as well as understanding the climate, atmosphere and environment as a whole. The new budget provides more money to examine safety issues at the red planet, "so we can begin preparing in a more focused way" for sending humans, Figueroa said. He added that in 2011, the focus starts to shift from looking for water to looking for organic compounds, signs of life or signatures of the seeds of life. Money has also now been set aside to prepare for a sample return mission to Mars. That effort, on the drawing boards for some time and once scheduled for launch as early as 2003, had not been adequately funded in terms of dealing with analysis of whatever is brought back. Funding to develop new technology for that effort is now written into the 2005 budget request. Figueroa said a Mars sample return would launch in 2013 at the earliest. He said it would likely involve a static lander and not a roving craft. I can understand the want for this not just for the sample but for a demnostration of technology. Personally I'd rather see money spent getting people there and such, but this could be interesting to see. These missions, as well as the current rovers on Mars, will all generate a picture of the red planet that will help officials decide where to send humans, how they will survive, and what they'll need to take with them. No timetable has been set for putting astronauts on Mars, though. The president called for continual reevaluation of short-term spaceflight goals as technology improves and funding is secured in the years to come. The White House vision was, at least in part, designed to get a flailing space agency back on track after the Space Shuttle Columbia disaster. Many space policy experts have long said NASA has been largely directionless for three decades and that money was being wasted running circles around Earth. Robotic failures also plagued the agency in the late 1990s. Weiler said NASA's back-to-back failures in 1999, of the Mars Climate Orbiter and Mars Polar Lander, were blessings in disguise. Had those missions succeeded, NASA would not have had the funding necessary to proceed with other missions on the ambitious red planet schedule that had been in place, he said. The failure led to a restructuring of the entire Mars program, with which he is now pleased. "Sometimes failures are good things," Weiler said. Er, the Mars Polar Lander probably had a great chance of finding traces of past life. Had that succeeded there would probably not even be a debate of wether or not we should go to Mars and wether or not we could afford it. Once again we see the critics comments raise their heads about manned vs robotic missions. Once again I quote Niven : "The dinosaurs are extinct because they did not have a space program." -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/7/04 1:27pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	A quick pic of Mars: And a quick link for exploring mars: ExploreMarsNow.org ^It's in the headpost now too, along with a few other new links. Enjoy! -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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merlin Registered: May '99	Date Posted: 2/7/04 1:46pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	I thought Sean O'Keefe said that an automated mission to retrieve the hubble was a possibitiy. I'd love to see it in a museum. But then again, I said the same thing about MIR. -----signature----- Dal Shakka Mel!
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/7/04 2:08pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	He says it's a possibility but recently NASA has said it would approve any service mission but they will have nothing to do with it finacially or responsibly. As far as they are concerned it is over and done with when it burns up in Earth's atmosphere sometime in the next decade. Meanwhile, Hubble is still hard at work: A collision of two galaxies has left a merged star system with an unusual appearance as well as bizarre internal motions. Messier 64 (M64) has a spectacular dark band of absorbing dust in front of the galaxy's bright nucleus, giving rise to its nicknames of the "Black Eye" or "Evil Eye" galaxy. -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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VadersLaMent Registered: Apr '02	Date Posted: 2/10/04 2:20pm Subject: RE: SPACE SCIENCE THREAD
	Bush's Space Panel Seeks Public Input President Bush's new space advisory commission for getting humans to the Moon and Mars has launched a web site seeking public input with the promise of reading all comments. Full story and bios MoontoMars.org Click on the 'contact us' button for your message. I sent a few brief comments about private ventures, Kistler, SSTO and 2STO, and quoted Niven about extinct dinosuars. -----signature----- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic-Arthur C. Clarke Any sufficiently advanced extraterrestrial intelligence is indistinguishable from God-Michael Shermer I'm a sexy shoeless GOD OF WAR! #347 on SLG's List Of Sexy Men
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