ST Will IX be the end of the Skywalkers?

Rey Related was always the most interesting story to me: two grandchildren of Vader fighting for the galaxy. However, it is clearly not the story they wanted to tell, and I doubt it will be changed. It would be a weird reveal at this point. Although, I still think they haven't exactly done Rey Random right, making her propped up by the Skywalkers, lightsaber included.

 

I think you're mistaking me for someone else? I was just chiming in because your list wasn't complete. Cheers.

 

Nah I was just giving my thoughts on (1a) and (3) and was just quoting the post that had them.

 

I hope so.

 

As neither Rey or Kylo are Jedi/Sith - in the true sense from the PT, if they were to have a child - potentially the start of the "Grey" path, whilst maintaining a bloodline from the 9 episode saga so far, it would also give us a character born from 2 force sensitive characters.

Not saying it's where it should go, but it would be interesting!

 

"I was asked how I felt going forward. And I said, in my mind, the story finishes at Episode IX." —Daisy Ridley

When an actress cannot picture a future with her character it's usually for a real reason. Unlike the previous lead characters, Rey carries zero legacy. She's barely even a lead character! Her story doesn't hold the weight that Anakin or Luke's did because she's not as important as they were and it shows. Daisy Ridley must have realized this which is sad because she initially appeared to be a huge deal but then ended up being a total nobody. This new generation is really getting swindled, you can't blame Daisy for wanting to move on from Rey. It's like an entire heritage was denied to her.

 

I think Kylo Ren should survive this trilogy - leaving potential for a child by virtue of the fact that he's still alive. Could be with Rey, could be with someone else. Depends on what fits the narrative. I'm not into shipping. But Kylo Rey's child should continue the Solo name - he's not a Skywalker by name, so whatever future child he might potentially have would also not have the name Skywalker.

I'd like to see a canonical version of the Heir to the Empire trilogy told at some point which re-canonizes Mara Jade as Thrawn has been brought back into canon through Rebels. Only way I could see Luke having a child out there somewhere is if he had a brief romance with Mara Jade and unknowingly fathered a child. I'm not opposed to the idea, but I'm not pushing for it either. It all depends on how it's done.

I have some ideas for what I would do with a fourth trilogy regarding the Skywalkers which wouldn't necessarily be dependent upon children.

In any case, I still think Luke should return like Gandalf the white to train up a new generation of Jedi - he could be more of a Jedi Council / Yoda type character in a fourth trilogy.

 

You know what's funny, people forget this is a Space Opera. You know, like a Soap Opera or Serial. Shocking twists like "No, I am your father" and the hammy acting in the PT. I mean it's also a Serial so yeah, soap story telling comes with the area. So suddenly having a missing brother or sister, or even an evil twin is part of the tropes in Serials. Remember Star Wars was going to be based on Buck Rogers.

Which is really weird because the Skywalkers are as synonymous to Star Wars as the Potters are to Harry Potter. It seems odd to me that one of the reason why Star Wars is so rooted for people is because, unlike say Star Trek, it's because of the family connection. There used to be more stories like that but because we needed the "everyone can be a hero" idea in writing for some reason. So you have the Potters and the Skywalkers and now the Starks as being the whole Family saga idea. And there's nothing wrong with that.

Which is horrible in some ways. I mean I get the fear of being stereotyped, but it's a unfortunate that she's being over shadowed in TLJ for Ben, which it would have made more sense to make the villain not related and have Ben helping them out.

 

Sad thing is that there are appaerntly a LOT of people who want the Skywalkers to end. If you are a SW fan, I'm not sure why that would be the case.

At the current time, until I see how IX pans out, it is difficult for me to watch any of the SW movies and acknowledge the slightest hint that the intention is to kill off the family. Part of me just wants to pretend the ST doesn't exist since at the moment, no matter how you look at it, the entire Skywalker family is a curse. Kylo Ren is NOT the hope for the Skywalker family but rather the nail in the family's coffin. He's not a legacy but a disease. He is the villain and there is currently nobody to carry that legacy when he sacrifices himself for his OWN evil which never had to happen in the first place ESPECIALLY when it was spun so that Luke helped to create and spread that disease.

And for Rey, a nobody, to be Kylo's apologist and only "cheerleader" is kind of sickening. It would have made MUCH more sense if they made Rey a mysterious Skywalker that could never have known it until she reaches her destiny herself, rather than feeling like she was entitled to it (like Ben Solo did). Or that Rey never knew that she followed a line of Jedi like Luke found out (although she prematurely found out that she was strong in the Force anyway so it didn't matter who her parents were).

If Rey were a legacy, it would not be nearly as important to her as it would for the Skywalker family. If she were a Skywalker it could give closure to the family while also offering some hope for the future. If not for movies then books. Otherwise, while they can certainly still make stories about Rey. it truly is at the expense of Rey in the movies. At the moment, she is a great character with no true purpose in the whole saga. Leia could have communicated with Luke and R2 could still have shown Luke the message which had NOTHING to do with Rey. Rey carrying that torch from Luke doesn't really have a purpose. If this conflict ends, why does it matter if Rey continues it?

Like I said, it's hard to watch 1-6 and even acknowledge the existence of the ST until there is a clear purpose for it shown to us in IX. On its own, TLJ doesn't seem to push the story forward.

 

As Luke put it:

"It is time for the Jedi to end"

No Jedi=No Star Wars

so

what Luke said "It is time for Star Wars to end"

Couldn't agree more. Luke was the last person named or called Skywalker.

Leia is Organa

Ben is Solo

Rey is a nobody and she will never be a Jedi now as the Jedi are no more

There are also no Sith anymore as they died with Palps

So from my POV, these movies can now be called Star Barfs.

They contain the same ingredients as the Star Wars movies only they stink like hell and cause you nausea.

 

It is time for the Skywalkers to end.

 

I really hope it isn't. Please don't let them end like this... please.

If this is the route Disney goes down, I won't be able to follow. Star Wars without the Skywalkers means nothing to me. I mean... I enjoyed Rogue One, but my favorite scenes were ultimately Leia's and Vader's, it wouldn't have been worth it without them!

 

@cut-of-space What would you propose at this point for the Skywalkers not to end or at least have a legacy?

 

Sorry I don,t think a Tird triolgy will work with out them maybe lets see how 9 goes

 

God... I have no idea. I wish I knew, but I don't. Personally, I really want them to retcon Rey's parents being junkers and make Luke her father instead. But I know tons of fans would be pissed with that, especially if it's poorly written. Plus, Luke & Rey's relationship was awful in TLJ so now if it turns out that he was her father it would be very upsetting. It's like they set fire to all their bridges on purpose, I've never witnessed such destructive storytelling in all my life. I don't know how they're going to pull it off, but I'd prefer anything over the Skywalkers ending. I might even be able to tolerate Reylo, my least favorite pairing OF ALL TIME. If the Skywalkers really must end then it must be on a positive note and with the galaxy better off thanks to them. As it stands the Skywalkers have created more darkness than light and that doesn't sit well with me at all.

 

Yeah that's just another shame in TLJ. They killed the whole Luke/Rey thing. Rey never meant anything in Luke's world and there was no development.

I'm telling you, Eps 1-6 is a story that connects. The ST, where we currently stand, has no place in that and no overall meaning to any of it. It takes the OT3 to a dark place and unless JJ can concoct some sort of magical miracle, it's going to end up like that. Rey never needed Luke and Luke never benefited from Rey's visit. It was R2 and Yoda who told Luke what he should do. And also as we stand right now, Rey has no reason to redeem Kylo and has no reason to be the one to do it. There was absolutely no psychological catharsis and after ROTJ, this all looks to just damage the Skywalker name and the saga overall.

 

I hope I don't offend you, or even say anything that appears to contradict your points. I am feeling compelled to make a reply. And I will say things based on past references made by fans, as well as the handling of his character in the films. Plus I am also excluding The Clone Wars, Rebels, the novels, and ALL current Marvel series. Because lets face it... Luke Skywalker appearing on The Muppet Show, as well as singing "When You Wish Upon A Star" in the end, still makes him the best Skywalker ever.

First off... Anakin Skywalker. In 1977, nobody cared who he was. In 1983, many fans felt that he becoming Darth Vader was a cheap plot twist. In 1999, fans felt that it did very little to help flesh out who he was. In 2002, fans were offended how poorly the character was handled. And in 2005, fans mocked his transformation into Darth Vader. The end result is that it took both The Clone Wars TV series and a decade to have most fans change their opinions of the character.

And when it comes to Rey, you need to look at the details. Such as Kylo Ren reacted when he was informed about Rey being spotted. The fact he was in a very specific spot when the Knights of Ren slaughtered the remaining Jedi. How we are told nothing when it comes to her abandonment. Why Kylo Ren was obsessed with her becoming his pupil. And the other stuff, including key hints tied to Snoke's current backstory. Which is a good indication that she was being protected, not rejected.

But when it comes to Daisy... There can be a lot of factors going into her mind. Such as the "legacy curse" that many before her have been plagued with. Carrie Fisher, when it comes to this franchise, getting the worse of it. And then there is the "I want to do other things before I even consider being Rey again." Something that can go as far as how Daniel Radcliffe once openly stated that he does not want to reprise his role as Harry Potter these days. I mean... Stuff like that.

With that said, it does not sound like Rey's "legacy" is the reason why she currently feels that way. Especially since there were reports of people demanding more merchandise (i.e. action figures) of her from 2015-2016. And her stand among the non-misogynist/non-sexist types have her more favored than Anakin. It simply sounds like atop of any other reasons she is currently facing... She wants a chance to "breathe". Even if it means not being Rey in a future set of trilogy films.

 

The Skywalkers were born from tragedy but will likely end with hope and a door left open to return to them in the future, and yes, that would mean Ben and Rey having a child. This does not make the child a true Skywalker though. In fact the Skywalker blood will fade even more with Rey being unrelated to Anakin's bloodline and Ben being part Solo. The saga already ended with Luke's death and Ben is more Solo than Skywalker. Like Snoke said, he will never be Vader. He has too much of his father's heart.

 

Quick question: How certain are you that Rey is not a Skywalker?

I am asking because The Force Awakens put her through a compressed version what both Anakin and Luke went through, including the fact that two versions of Obi-Wan being heard. Plus as I previously stated, there are signs that Ben knows who Rey truly is. Down to the fact that he knows that Darth Vader made the mistake of revealing the truth to Luke in The Empire Strikes Back. Because the whole reveal worked against him, and forced Darth Vader to return to the Light Side of the Force.

All I can suggest is that you use this as an excuse to re-watch The Force Awakens. Nothing more.

Look at how Kylo Ren acted the moment he was told Rey was spotted. His response had him know who they were talking about. And how his behavior changed near the end of the film. He went from thinking that she was a member of the Resistance to realizing who she was. If she was not a Skywalker, he would not be pulling the whole "Become my apprentice" shtick that Darth Vader did in both The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi. But he did, which means that we're not told everything so far.

But if I am wrong... May their child not become Darth Wambulance.

 

@Instant Force Talk
Hmm. Thanks for taking the time to post, most of your thoughts are making a lot of sense. I've always enjoyed Anakin's transformation into Vader but maybe that's just because I grew up with it and wasn't old enough to fixate on the flaws. Time helps put everything in perspective so maybe one day I'll be able to make peace with TLJ the way some older fans have made peace with the prequels. I hope you're right about Rey being protected... It is a strange coincidence that Luke's old pal Lor San Tekka would be on the same planet as her, right? There are plenty of clues like that. Then there's the fact that she physically looks similar to Anakin and Padme and Leia and Luke. I fell in love the idea of Rey as a Skywalker and a part of me still hasn't let that go. Daisy herself probably isn't bothered by the story choice at all, I'm just projecting my own frustrations onto her tbh.

 

We really don't know how force inheritance works. It seems that Ben is just as powerful as Anakin and Luke in the force.

 

I say, 'Let the Skywalkers end'. Let their tale inspire new generations as well as warn them. Let Rey be a nobody, who learned to stand tall with their guidance, and to keep moving forward from their failures. George Lucas intended for the Skywalker saga to end at 9...let's honor that vision. If the studio won't go for it, have Rey capture and imprison Kylo Ren, cut him off from the force. Allow them to have one final scene together where she hands him copies of the Jedi Text to read.

Rey: "Star over."

Then have her walk out and leave it ambiguous as to whether or not he listens. Show Rey and her surviving friends and family rebuilding the galaxy in the final shots of the last film. Make it clear they are all moving forward, learning from the past but not mired by it. Have Rey take Finn or Poe's hand, suggesting a romance but not explicitly showing it, that can be left to the imagination.

Then move on, do the side stories, have Rian Johnson's trilogy come out, and let Episode 9 Mark the final chapter in the Skywalker Saga.

 

At this point, it would still be easy to make her a Skywalker. I'm not saying it's a good idea or that they will do it, as TLJ's themes were pretty clear. However, if they suddenly have a change of heart and want the Skywalkers to live on (without Reylo because I still don't think that is happening), it's still an option. Just have her be the child Luke never knew he had; he could have had an affair while visiting Lor San Tekka on Jakku but left her, before he knew she was pregnant, because he didn't want attachments. Have the mother, who was economically burdened by the child, abandon her and dissolve into despair as Kylo described. That way what Kylo saw was the twisted truth, and that's why the mirror merged into one person before revealing Rey, because only her mother knew her. It's simple writing, not saying it will happen at or that it should.

It is a bit funny how some of those who love Rey Random is because she stands on her own without lineage. But, the ENTIRE explanation of her powers is defined by Kylo (a Skywalker) and his strength; a female character propped up by a male character, how lovely!

I read an interesting article about TLJ and Game of Thrones. I'll put the rest of this aside in spoiler tags just for those who aren't caught up on GOT/don't watch it but want to in the future.

Spoiler

In the article, it compared Rey to Jon Snow, how they were both nobodies with a big destiny. Both characters are rather defined by their families. It said the TLJ made the right choice by making Rey Random, while they did Jon wrong by revealing him to be the true heir to the iron throne. I am not commenting on this outcome specifically, but I want to comment on how they chose to execute the characters, and how I felt about each.

In Star Wars, we know one thing that motivates and defines Rey: her family. We don't see Rey's family. We don't see her family dynamic. We don't know their names. We don't know their faces. After TLJ, all we know is that they may have been alcoholic junkers who are dead. She joined the resistance...because? I don't know. I guess she finally let go of her past. But then, in TLJ, she suddenly regresses, and her parentage is all she cares about. So, if the character deeply cares about her family, then the audience must too or something gets lost in translation. However, the translation is lost as the whole thing is a big mystery with a lackluster reveal. We were told about how she cares about her family deeply, but they are so unimportant that the audience never gets to actually see them. Why? I guess so we could ponder "Who is she related to??" for a few years and subversion was a theme of TLJ. One of my favorite scenes from TFA was when little Rey is crying for her family to come back, because that is actually a shred of emotional character development, which ironically is later a jumbled by TLJ as apparently they never left Jakku. In short, I am not a fan with how they did the "random" reveal. If they would have given us a Related reveal, then we could have felt the dynamic, knew their names/faces, and see how the character develops. The audience was waiting for this--for some kind of dynamic, as it's so defining for her. I'm not saying that it had to have been Related; Random could have flown well, as I'll touch up with Jon. I get that they want to push the message that no one can be somebody; however, they still need to show us that a no one is somebody, worthy of a background especially when they are the main protagonist.

The best way would have been to develop her Random character from the beginning. Show us how her dead family shaped her over the course of TFA, not make it some big mystery and expect the audience to care when it is solved in a few passing sentences. The second best would have been to develop her over TLJ and show us what happened in some sort of flashback. Give a reason for the audience to care about the character. Now we are left with one movie to add to her character, which at this point, with the theme of TLJ, I'm not sure it should even be addressed anymore.

Let's compare the development to that of "random" Jon Snow.​

We meet Jon Snow's family in GOT right away. We see how he fits into the Stark family dynamic as Ned Stark's bastard. We see that his father (Ned Stark) loves him and that his half-siblings do too (minus sister Sansa who is a bit cold). Why is Sansa cold? Because we see that the Stark mother, Cat Stark, HATES him with a passion, telling him to "leave" the family as they are crying over an injured family member. They find wolf pups, initially only one for each of Stark children. Someone asks him something like "Well, what about you?" and he replies "I'm not a Stark." Later, they find one more and say something like "Look! The runt of the litter, I guess he's yours Snow." Seeing he has no place/future in the family, he joins the guard (using easier terms so that non-viewers can understand), which bounds him for a life of duty, so that he may have an actual purpose in life. He says that he wants to remain celibate, because he doesn't know if his mother is alive/what she does and he doesn't want to father someone to put him in his position. Although he does want to know who is mother is/if she is even alive, the character is not shrouded in mystery. Despite it all, he fiercely loves his family and takes pride in being the son of the honorable Ned Stark. All of this makes the audience feel compassion towards Jon and his position in his family. They don't have to survive (most of them don't), but seeing all this, we want to believe in the bastard rising to the top.

And, most importantly, all of this background character development that I've mentioned takes place over the first few episodes of GOT in Jon's scenes (and if you watch the show, you know how over-packed it with characters so they get little screen time per episode). My point being, this level of character development is not something that is unrealistic for a two-hour movie to develop.

Of course, we eventually find out that Jon was never Ned Stark's kid but rather his sister's, Lyanna Stark's, kid. He was never a bastard, as Lyanna married the Targaryen heir-to-the-throne before she died in childbirth. Everything that defines Jon is a lie. He is no bastard rising to the top; he has the strongest claim to the throne. At this point, I do not like the "non-random" reveal. However, it had been hinted at with all the Lyanna references throughout.

Anyway, I just thought it was an interesting comparison between the two characters, one who I would rather have had some sort of "birthright" (a term used in order to put the two in comparison) and the other who I would have preferred to stay random and how it was actually executed.

And I should state that, while not a fan of the overall impact, Jon's parentage reveal was handled with a flashback, showing Lyanna dying while handing Jon over to Ned. Even though I didn't like the result, it is one of the most powerful scenes in GOT.

Anyway, I still think they want to eradicate the Skywalkers. Rogue One was their test, and it passed.

 

Or Rey really stands on her own two feet and doesn't need her abilities, strengths and awesomeness qualified with a last minute need to tag her as a skywalker.

 

I never said that it was needed. I just said that they hadn't written themselves into anything yet. But I do not agree that Rey "stands on her own two feet." The whole explanation of her power was that as Kylo gets stronger, so does she. Therefore, she is at the level she is at because of Kylo, not because of Rey.