ST What does the ST add to the Saga? What is its story purpose?

Well one thing to add is TPM was sorta carrying the weight of the entire Star Wars universe on it's shoulders, fairly or not.

TLJ wasn't.

Mando was a extreme success and brought in a whole bunch of people (Look at the explosion of Baby Yoda memes and how that has effected internet culture)

The Clone Wars Season 7 was reported to be the most streamed thing ever on streaming service was a massive hit.

Honestly outside of Solo, which also had a May release compared to a September release and poor marketing other Star Wars things have carried and boosted the franchise and the IP.

 

So I take it you didn't watch the movies then? I mean, he clearly did. As for TCW, yes, Anakin is an incredibly watered-down and boring version of what he was both in the films and the ancillary material that preceded TCW (which actually built upon how Anakin actually was in the films and were just stronger storytelling because of it).

Yes, his concept is very charming but if we're talking about actual narrative depth, he's pretty goddamn overrated. It's probably why a lot of the characters in the ST, while the actors involved in playing them may be charming, are actually pretty vapid when looked at from a writing perspective. It's why it is genuinely annoying when you look at something like TCW and see a bunch of incongruous character traits that simply aren't who Anakin is attached to him.

 

Agreed. I only watched the pilot/Clone Wars movie, at the cinema, and it put me off for good.
I was naively thinking it would show some aspects of the character that contributed to his fall... but it was so watered down... the only time it remotely came up was when he said to Ahsoka something like "I don't talk about my past". So disappointing.

 

"It is too late for me son."

 

And that's fine. It's just that it doesn't sit right with me whenever people say or even attempt the implication that TCW Anakin is an improved version of him when all he really is in that series is more palatable. Which I don't think is the same thing as the character being improved upon.

 

I think there was always going to be a significant difference between the two versions because in AOTC he is a teenager and still a Padawan and ROTS is the movie where he falls so you almost can`t count it because it just deliberately features an extreme to his character whereas TCW gave him his own Padawan, making him the master. Under that circumstances, he couldn`t occupy the role of belligerent teen anymore because that was now Ahsoka`s role. If the show didn`t make that choice, his character might as well have been a closer reading to something between movie versions of AOTC and early ROTS.

I did enjoy the novel about his Trials. Since that figured him working with what ended up being Corran Horn`s grandfather from Legends, I don´t even know if that story is still supposed to be canon, though.

 

I mean, that seems more like a case of people omitting those scenes and opting to misrepresent his character in their own critiques.

That's probably why the choice to make Ahsoka his apprentice was a complete mistake. After all, if we're going to cover Anakin during the war, that transitionary period is what TCW should have been concerned with. Just like how Republic and Genndy's Clone Wars series was.

 

I can understand that.

I liked the fact Lucas was involved too, I should really give the show a proper chance.

Tbh I don't watch AOTC as much as TPM and ROTS, which were both to me better incarnations of the tragic hero.

AOTC to me works more symbolically, it is quite dream-like. The characterisations I admit can be a little annoying at times.

 

@godisawesome

I mean I know a lot of people who say TCW Anakin is pretty much more Anakin then PT Anakin at this point on a personal level. Granted having 5 seasons on T.V (then added extra 2 via streaming) That's a lot of time spent with a character in a way most of the movie characters never had.

Don't underestimate the Clone Wars generation.

 

Lol. That is pretty good.

 

Agreed and I think that honestly that CAN change one perspective of the Prequel Trilogy and how one views it if they take TCW into account.

Seeing Anakin as that hero for not just A MOVIE...But A Movie (Lol) 7 seasons worth of Television, that has defiantly effected one's view of the character. I mean I always kinda knew that the PT Anakin and TCW Anakin don't really fit in that perfect smushing together of the two characters. But I do think that TCW in general (especially among younger viewers like myself) see the character very differently and sorta consider (as i said before) TCW Anakin, our Anakin. Making his fall to Vader even more tragic in a lot of ways. Or at least viewed differently.

 

I thought the acting for the most part was better in the ST than the PT. The prequels had some stand out performances, yes, but they were less consistent or frequent.

Watch and listen to Daisy Ridley more closely in TROS. Some really appropriate inflections and good visual acting.
Driver in TROS is really good as well.
John Boyega was charming all around, if underused. Harrison Ford brought his class as usual. Mark Hammill arguably improved on his performance (he was always believable though), despite much worse characterisation obviously.
And Ian McDiarmid, for the lesser amount we got, was less hammy than in the PT. Loved him in the PT and OT as well though.

Those are the first examples that come to mind. Maybe I don't understand the technical side of acting but to me to fault the acting of the ST compared to the PT seems a little disingenious.

 

Heh.
I might have a problem with that if it wasn't fiction, but it sounds appropriate in this context.

I think I saw the clip, when he fights Ahsoka, right? Correct me if I'm mistaken.

She had a few clunky moments in TLJ yeah. For some reason she is much better under JJ Imo, both TFA and TROS were convincing performances.
Like TFA;
The origin scenes early on were pretty immersive and charming, and she seemed genuine with Finn and Han. And Ridley plays the more stressed out moments well as far as I can see, such as the forceback and interrogation scenes.

TLJ she wasn't atrocious or anything, but I know you understand this subject a lot better than me
I get that the writing was less driven for her character.

TROS I know I am biased, being a big fan of her interactions with Kylo, but I thought it was her best performance in the trilogy.
Her scenes with Driver sold it for me... that progression from fear and suspicion... to anger... to sadness... then almost elation with Ben on Exegol. Adam Driver helps a lot too, I loved his brief appearance as Ben. Like watch the range of expression conveyed by Driver when Rey dies and he then brings her back. That made me understand why his fans praise him so much.

And I liked Daisy's inflections generally as I said, I think she's talented. Her scenes with Leia and the other good guys had the right amount of feeling and humour, and she also sold the Jedi-in-the-making physicality of the role Imo.

Yeah. At least Finn was still likeable in the film, which I attribute to Boyega. I like a lot of the Kylo scenes in TLJ (it is Rey and Luke that causes problems for me) but that is probably largely because of the acting and RJ putting a lot (or too much) focus on him. But yes, the acting is actually a high point of the trilogy I think.

Ive said it enough, but the PT was epic in scope. Less traditionally human characters, but they are much more allegorical and symbolic, and watching 1-6 was pretty mindblowing in '05. They are much more ambitious than the ST.

 

I think maybe your conflating ‘acting’ with dialogue/delivery. And I can assure you that I ‘sincerely’ believe that the ST isn’t any better than the PT in this department... The ST consciously tries to make the dialogue more contemporary (“you got a cute boyfriend?”) etc. and the delivery of dialogue is quicker (certainly in the Abrams films)... and ‘quicker’ doesn’t equate to ‘better’, neither in terms of dialogue, delivery or editing. Whereas the PT is much more stylised, the delivery much slower, but the ST isn’t going to win any awards in the acting/dialogue department is it? The difference between the ST and PT (in terms of dialogue and delivery) is much more in terms of style rather than quality per se. But where the PT scores higher for me is that the PT’s dialogue is functional in serving a much better story, whereas the ST dialogue often doesn’t go anywhere...

 

This popped up in my Facebook feed this morning... I can’t imagine Disney/Lucasfilm would do it, but the more I read it, the more I thought a ‘multiverse’ concept is a way for them to not only draw a line through the ST, but retcon the PT and OT too...

Mods - let me know if I’m allowed to link. If not, I’ll remove and paraphrase.
https://cosmicbook.news/disney-resetting-star-wars-erasing-last-jedi

 

I guess?

I just know Hayden sells Anakin's turn for a good chunk of ROTS, but when Obi-Wan shows up on Mustafar the vocal deliveries suddenly go all over the place. From Palpatine's office (Mace's death) up until that moment on Mustafar he own it Imo, especially visually. Just the first moment that comes to mind. They could have used a retake.

I know the styles are very different dude. I think you presume my level of experience with the PT.

 

I’d agree with that, but I think it’s more likely to be the ADR process. It appears that, on the face of it, the PT has more extensive use of it than both the OT and ST. It is, for me, quite obvious in the Mace/Palp/Anakin scene and ‘Battle of the Heroes’. It’s incongruous in places, but may just be how it’s mixed.

 

I had to look that abbreviation up

That may be a big part of it.

I know with the reshot turn and everything they were heavily editing the whole film very late in the process. And I even had a strong hunch that some of the actors re-recorded lines for the dvd version compared to the original film cut we saw at the cinemas.
For example if you have a rip of the cinema version (I used to in '05) and watch the first Palpatine and Mace conversation at the beginning of the second act, the dvd cut has a completely reshot version of Ian McDiarmid's performance. Unsure why. Kind of spun me out when I first watched the dvd.
Another one is Vader watching the symbolic eclipse on Mustafar had different scoring slightly - that horn instrument "DaDaa!" was initially timed for the shot of the eclipse itself... and they shifted it a few seconds earlier to the shot of Vader on the balcony for the dvd. Different feel slightly.

But anyway my initial point was really the deliveries from Hayden shouting at Obi-Wan and Padme. Like "You brought him here to kill me" sounded a bit awkward to me. Whereas moments earlier with just Padme I thought the performance was better - the contrast yet eery similarity to pre-turn Anakin. It gave me chills.
The interesting part was Vader's reaction to Padme suggesting Obi-Wan's help - she suggested it to Anakin during their conversation after his first dream, and while both times he refuses, there is so much contrast in Anakin to Vader's reactions.
Blue and calm, Anakin sadly and sternly stating they don't need his help. Compared to the Mustafar scene - it's red and smokey and Anakin merely smiles condescendingly. It really demonstrates he aint the same guy.