The Mandalorian The Mandalorian 2.05 - Chapter 13 - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

And like right in time - seems like Ahsoka was leaving Corvus within the week. I can't imagine Ahsoka was even on Corvus for that long as she was just collecting information from a magistrate, and it had to take at least a few days for Din to make it from Mon Cala to Navarro to Corvus. Ahsoka is clearly on the move and after something so their connection has to basically be constant.

 

If they bring in ghost Yoda, I think I'd prefer cgi, not puppet.

I'm very excited to see what they come up with for Tython, assuming Din and Grogu do end up getting there this season. It annoyed me that the ST replaced it with Ach-to given its legendary status, but maybe it was for the best as Filoni has proven to be a much better world builder than Abrams or Johnson imo.

 

I don't know - I've only ever been a casual SW fan - all the trilogies and read an occasional article but only because of this last episode did I decide to start posting on a SW forum. I got into TM when several co-workers mentioned how good it was and because, well, Baby Yoda.

I thought Episode 2 of this season was pretty weak but everything else has made me think about SW more than I honestly have time for, even made me scratch the itch by speeding through 10-20 hours of TCW and Rebels episodes the last weekish.

I don't think this was a 10/10 episode. I'd give it an 8/10 and would have raised it a point to 9/10 if he had said "This is the Way" in response to "May the Force be with you", but hard for me to look at what we've gotten so far and be disappointed.

I do 100% agree that the direction from the last 3 episodes could quickly spiral out of control and negatively affect the series as a whole. That being said - this is "The Mandalorian" and it also cannot stay isolated from the greater story of Mandalore forever.

 

The ghosts are definitely possible especially if Ahsoka shows back up as we know you need no training to see the ghosts. You probably have to be force sensitive

 

I think this episode was mostly a pilot for an Ahsoka/Sabine live action series. A lot of lore got dropped, but I think most of it will be followed up there, not in The Mandalorian. In particular, I think Thrawn will be the recurring, over-arching villain in the Ahsoka/Sabine show, not in The Mandalorian. I think Gideon will continue being the main villain in TM, through at least the end of Season 3-- he might very well lose a fight to Mando and lose the Darksaber before then, but I don't think he'll die.

I gave this episode a 10, not because I thought it was perfect, but because I thought it was as close to perfect as I can ever really expect out of a TV show. But one of my nitpicks is that TM continues to make the universe smaller, not larger. Every time they give us fanservice, or make reference to existing lore, the universe seems that much smaller. It's like a small town where everyone knows each other, and every now and then a new kid moves into town. I was really hoping they'd go in the other direction, and have Mando heading off into the unknown regions, or wild space, or whatever. Once he's out of the defined Star Wars part of the galaxy, everything's on the table, and every new reveal makes it seem like a universe of infinite possibilities. As it is now, I'm convinced that the answer to every puzzle, and the center of every plot twist, will be something in existing lore, which I just really wish wasn't the case.

 

I'm not very excited by more ghost Yoda, but Filoni has done it before. To me, THAT would be something that begins to feel like fan service. We already have a baby Yoda, do we really need double the Yoda?

 

I disagree. For me, go with the puppet and Frank Oz if they are using Yoda. It looked phenomenal in TLJ and was one of my favorite scenes in that movie. The CG Yoda in the prequels was not great. I expect Luke or Ezra to show up though if they get to the planet this season.

 

Sure it can look great, but that's not the problem. The problem is overusing Yoda, who is dead. Isn't baby Yoda enough?

It begins to grow boring when we see certain characters too much. I really do hope they do something different if they decide to bring in a Jedi character, and I think I'm fully behind the idea of a brand new character.

I think the show needs to have another wise character like Kuiil added. I think his presence has been missed, but filling that space with Yoda is too easy, too directly on the nose.

 

I think Ahsoka and Sabine and Ezra and Bo Katan are fine, and I hope to see more of them in the future. I don't think that makes the galaxy smaller. They are associated all between them, and it would make sense for the Mandalorian to come across their path eventually, considering that he has been literally looking for other Mandalorians for 3 episodes in the 2nd season. It's not like there are 2 billion Mandalorians in the galaxy, it is absolutely natural for Mando to find Bo Katan, then be led to Ahsoka because of his quest for the Jedi, then be led to Sabine Wren and hopefully the endgame for the TV show will be the Liberation of Mandalore.

But Yoda as a Force Ghost? Why? I don't think Force Ghosts should just appear casually in SW. But only when there is something important to say. That used to be the way in the OT and even in TCW/Rebels. I don't see the reason why we should have everyone and their mom appear as Force Ghosts all the time personally.

I predict, and hope, that it will be a new Jedi on Tython, or someone who has survived Order 66, or Luke, though he is not my first choice. Make it legit. If it serves the story and makes sense, I am all for it.

 

I actually like the idea of Yoda showing up as a cameo and giving direction to the kid to find his own path and either Yoda or someone else gives him a Jedi training routine, it is up to Grogu though how or when he wants to become a Jedi.

Also, I don't think Ahsoka was giving up on him, I think her further direction was actually a test of sorts. Remember at the end of Clone Wars, she had realised the errors of the Jedi and basically becoming a soldier unwittingly. Through Rebels, she saw Kanan and his attachment to Syndulla and that actually not being a negative thing. Plus, the force sensitive kids being chased by the inquisitors, so she is aware of the dangers of forcing a kid, especially with attachment issues into training. Obviously, the outcome of Anakin is a massive concern too.

So, why not test him out and see what he CHOOSES to do at Tython? If he CHOOSES to reach out, then she might well show up again and either train him or direct him to an Ezra / Luke / other who she knows wants to and can do the job.

The sort of knowing smile at the end made me think she knows more than she was letting on and wants to attempt a new way of Jedi training by learning from the errors of the past.

 

It is mostly from hope that I say this w/ a tiny bit of reasoning thrown in.
It would serve the story and the fans if the Jedi who shows up at the stone does so from beyond.

It can not be Luke because of the massacre and his lack of hope in the ST.

Who better to restore Grogu’s faith than the one who caused his fear.
Yes ! The chosen one himself, Anakin Skywalker.

It serves the fans obviously. But also moves the story in a positive direction, 1) it allows for Grogu to stay w/ Din. 2) it frees up Luke and/or any other jedi for other stories/shows. 3) if done properly it explains why Anakin has been absent, he has been protecting & nurturing Grogu from beyond.
It is impossible for it to be Luke because of the emotions he has for his former master Yoda

In real world scenarios it would be great. Disney makes money, fans get an explanation as to why Anakin was absent from the sequel trilogy. Disney makes even more money when Anakin delivers Grogu to Rey to finally be trained as a Jedi in the next trilogy.

 

Realistically speaking, it's going to be hard to get too far down the line with Grogu being an active agent who is training and non-passively propelling the story forward until he starts speaking - we're at least a droid away from that unless we move several years forward into the future.

 

Well, at least you’re unique. You must be the only person in the world to criticize that opening scene.

 

It will be Ezra for a season 3 tease in the final episode. Grogu connects with Ezra through the Force and we all poop ourselves. It definitely wont be Luke. In a perfect world it woulda been but you all know that story...

 

Although, as a much bigger lurker than poster on these boards, I can tell you I could have predicted he would dislike it....

 

I want it to be Gungi:

 

I loved his light sabre.

 

This was an easy 10 for me.

This episode....wow! It was chock full of info. First the beginning seeing Ahsoka in live-action...AMAZING and w/the twin white lightsabers. Secondly we finally find out the Child's name, Grogu, which is cool since we had been saying the Child or Baby Yoda solely for his look, which was understandable. The fight scenes w/Ahsoka and...Elspeth? were awesome, again seeing Ahsoka in live-action was something else. Rosario Dawson did an amazing job. The real shocker was the Thrawn reveal. Now, no I don't expect to see him in this season but maybe it's a set up for something w/her in the future. I don't know, I don't care I just love fan service so sue me.

 

We have had Boba Fett, Bo-Katan and Ahsoka and you think that the arrival of Ezra will be the money shot of the series finale?

 

Yay! Ahsoka! Love the costume and her sabers but not wild about montrals/head-tails and cheek markings. Didn't like how she knows what happens with Anakin and Barriss, when Jedi don't deal with their mental health and feelings; and she knows how much detached Jedi inadvertently hurt people (Luminara with Trace and Rafa [and Barriss], Yoda with Anakin) and still she spouts Old Order dogma when she knows she and the Jedi were wrong. She seemed fearful about what might go wrong when, for better and for worse, Ahsoka has that fearlessness and, even when is scared, is still willing to punch above her weight and do the hard thing. I don't mind that she won't train Grogu, I just hated that such a dogmatic line that could have been uttered by Windu/Yoda came out of her mouth when she's seen the dangers of attachment and detachment, both. It's real to her.

Appreciate the aesthetic of the final duel but some rando knocking a blade from Ahsoka's hand? Fighting her that closely? Ridiculous.

Loved seeing Morai and even hearing her screech again - and the music. Hoping that somewhere along the way, there's some mention of Ahsoka not being a Jedi and Din being like, ... wait, what?

Sorry to say, I gave it 7/10 because I felt like I was hearing from an early TCW Ahsoka who hadn't seen the abuses and failures of the Jedi Order or an Ahsoka who hasn't thought much about things she's experienced. She seemed much more reflective in the Ahsoka novel (about how they should have listened) and Rebels than two decades later [from the novel] where, to me, she seems to have regressed. A 'better' reason not to train him could have been given without much more time involved - even 'the Force has other plans for us both'. Din and Grogu didn't have much to do, so *shrug* 7/10

Very much want to see Tython but she really should have warned them about that place. :-D


EDIT: Oh yeah. Props to whoever said this episode should have been titled, 'The Citizen'

 

Let Favreau and Filoni plan and write all Star Wars content!

 

Ahsoka is absolutely right not to detach Grogu from Mando. That’s what started Anakin on the wrong path. Detaching him from his mother at too old an age, and then training him despite his strong attachments to his mother (and then Padme). Her decision not to train Grogru/ separate him from
Din Djarin is absolutely 100% in line with the lessons we’re supposed to have learned from the prequels. It’s perfect.

Regarding the “rando” with the beskar spear, we have absolutely no idea what her skill level is. She’s tied to Thrawn, is clearly a martial arts master, and is part of some mysterious order, going by the tattoo on her forehead. Instead of dismissing her as a “rando,” why not consider that perhaps Favreau and Filoni are further expanding the universe to include really powerful martial artists that can go toe to toe with Jedi? And also that Ahsoka was clearly playing by some honor system whereby she tacitly agreed not to use her force powers against the woman? Lastly, what if as a Thrawn acolyte...she was somehow blocking Ahsoka’s access to the force in her inner sanctum?

Maybe those were ysalamiri in the pond....?

 

I think the honor system is closer to the mark, I don't think the lady would have been more talkative about Thrawn if Ahsoka only disarmed her with a cheap shot using force push or whatever.

 

Given the resounding success of the Grogu puppet, I imagine they’ll understandably go with a Yoda puppet. With some CGI touches, ala Grogu, justified further by the fact that he’s a ghost. The best humanoid non-droid creations, I’ve found, are puppet-CGI hybrids. So that’s what I advocate for. Go with whatever methods achieve the best result. Don’t be wedded to one method or another just because that’s your general preference.

 

The Magistrate probably got her training from that non-Force sensitive rando that effortlessly survived a one-on-one with Anakin Skywalker (who, unlike Ahsoka, had no reason to hold back)...

Spoiler

Hondo - the capturer of Dooku and pirate of Felucia.