Indiana Jones and the Temple Of Doom Fans

In my defence, what I was trying to suggest was that the Nazis, as an entity, were a realistic, believable adversary for Indiana Jones (when compared directly to the garishly coloured, comic-book Thuggee of Temple of Doom) You are right, in that individually, they were a bit hammy, although not all were non-German, Wolf Kahler who played Dieter is German born if I remember rightly. Ron Lacey (Toht) Anthony Higgins (Gobler) and Pat Roach (Mechanic) are all English, as is Paul Freeman who played Belloq.

You are right though, the Nazis in Raiders are a bit more authentic than their very cartoon-like counterparts in The Last Crusade.

 

For me thats not a factor that I even think about. I first saw Raiders when I was 10 years old, the authenticity of anyone's accent in that film was the last thing on my mind and I still don't notice it now. Its make believe and they convinced me they were playing Germans, Peruvians, Egyptians, Chinese or whatever nationality they featured in the films. Its certainly not a factor in me thinking TOD has the edge because of who they used in that film.

 

I think that's part of the appeal for me: I really enjoy it when a series takes a detour from its usual baseline (which for this franchise is Raiders and Crusade) to give you something completely different. I liked it when the Star Wars novels took a break from the usual Rebel/Imperial and Jedi/Sith conflicts and brought in the Yuuzhan Vong, I liked the couple of movies where James Bond took a break from girls of the week and seriously considered settling down, I liked it when the heroes of Stargate took a break from fighting aliens every now and then to get mixed up in the spy/conspiracy storyline of the rogue NID, I liked it when the heroes of Leverage took a break from their usual Robin Hooding to go up against a Bond villain. It doesn't always work; most people thought we really didn't need to see James Bond in space like we did in Moonraker. But ideally, it keeps the viewer entertained by showing him something he hasn't seen before, and it keeps the heroes' life interesting by forcing them to deal with a challenge that isn't like their usual fare.

 

It'd be great if Indy 5 took a cue from TOD and tried to be something more different and unique. I'm hopeful with a new director onboard we might get just that. I don't know if James Mangold has ever said if he likes TOD, but Spielberg has always been vocal in his disdain for it and definitely never wants to make another like it. He's even said when he made TLC he did so to apologize for TOD, which always make me shake my head.

 

"Apologize"???? How could a filmmaker fall this low? This comment makes my personal ranking of TOD even higher above Raiders and TLC. I won't even mention Crystal Skull. Why didn't he apologize for THAT?

 

It seems the backlash TOD got at the time really got to him and affected him badly. I'm sure the accusations of it being racist and culturally insensitive didn't help, either. I recall he said when he made TLC he wanted to amend for TOD. To me, he's got zero to apologize for. He made an incredible movie that I feel is still my go-to Indy movie for pure enjoyment.

 

I forgot to say but Spielberg even publicly disowned TOD. It's a shame how he hates the film so much and no doubt his vocal disdain for it has only added to the backlash it's gotten. People are like "even Spielberg hates Temple Of Doom, it must be terrible" which is unfortunate.

 

I wish I had created something so awesome, that's all I can say.

 

It says something that TOD is a movie still talked about 35 years after the fact.

 

I've said before on here that TOD's biggest crime is just that it follows arguably the best action adventure film ever. TOD is way above many of its peers and sets the bar so high in many ways and if that was a film in its own right it would be lauded much more than it is IMO, but it often gets compared back to Raiders and its change in tone from what Raiders was.

 

I actually think that is one of its strengths. It is so tonally different to Raiders of the Lost Ark that it is hard to compare one against the other. The only commonalities between the two are Indiana Jones himself, and John Williams' music. Everything else feels like it is from another franchise altogether. So with that in mind, I always rate them as joint first place, because I feel that they go together and complement each other.

 

I agree with you totally. I just think that back then the change in tone wasn't what was expected, hence the bad reviews.

 

It's one of those sequels, like Empire at the time, that wasn't well recieved because it was very different from the original, and yet, it has aged better BECAUSE it's different..

 

I love both films and saw them both many times in the theater. Trust me ESB was received better.

 

Do you mean aged better as a film in its own right or aged better in comparison to Raiders or Empire?

IMO when you look at many sequels to big hits they usually follow the same formula. But sequels that stand out and for me have stood the test of time are Empire, TOD, Aliens and T2. All with a different tone to the original.

 

I just mean nowadays both Temple and Empire are appreatiated because they dared to be different (which is the very same reason that made them less successful at the time).

 

They are all examples of how to make a great sequel. They all stay true to their source material and honour it, but at the same time go off in new directions and / or build upon and expand it.

 

That's the key word here. To me TOD surpassed Raiders in so many ways. It's what T2 is to the original. Much better in almost every aspect. Over the top, for sure, and even more exaggerated, but so much more fun to watch.

 

There’s the beauty of these films we all can pick out something different to each other that we love about them. For me Raiders is my favourite, don’t get me wrong I love Temple of Doom and how different it is, but Raiders is just perfect in every way.

On a side note I was going through my old books tonight and in the official storybook based on the movie, just as Indy goes to get Willie some fruit in the palace he sees Chattar Lal talking to a mysterious hooded figure in a hallway, this figure turns out to be Mola Ram. Does anyone know if this a cut scene?

 

Probably. The storybooks were often completed before the film was fully edited, like the early Biggs scenes in ANH.

 

A lot of the times novelizations and storybooks often include scenes not in the final version of the movie because the writers use the original scripts before the changes. It's always very interesting to compare and contrast them.

 

I think Temple of Doom sets out its pulpy roots from the opening scene when they switched the titles font used in Raiders of the Lost ark to the now familiar comic book style.

 

This was the first Indy movie I saw at the cinema and really thought it was a really good follow up to Raiders so I have a soft spot for this film. I did find it slightly more gruesome than Raiders when I first saw it but what I didnt realise until the internet age that it was cut here in the UK and had been watching a slightly watered down version it was only me importing that I saw the full version in all its glory on DVD now thankfully uncut here on Blu Ray.

 

TLJ: "So you're saying there's a chance?"

 

I have no doubt TLJ will be the best regarded film of the ST in the future.