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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

CT Should Star Wars have only been one film?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by Chief Chirpa, Sep 4, 2018.

  1. Chief Chirpa

    Chief Chirpa Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2018
    I was having a discussion with a friend who is a big
    Star Wars fan and he disagrees with me. I want to float my ideas here just to see if there are any fans who actually agree with me. My apologees if this has already been discussed at length before.

    Let me also preface this by saying I was a big fan when I was a kid in the 80s and I had all the toys etc. These days I can't really say the new films have captured my imagination. I'm not just some troll, I just want to see if anyone else thinks I have a valid point...

    I believe that there should only have ever been the 1 star wars film, the first film. It's a great film and all subsequent films only serve to diminish the greatness of the original. It is a complete story and does not need furthering in any way. Ignoring that Darth Vader was not killed at the end, though a baddie needs only to be defeated in my opinion he doesn't necessarily have to perish. This is to leave the film open to a completely unnecessary sequal.

    This is the way the rest of the series spoil the original-
    1. In the original film Darth Vader is not Lukes father. Darth Vader killed betrayed and murdered Luke's father. I'll get into this debate if necessary but it's probably been said before.
    2. Luke and Leia are presented as a pairing. Han does not fancy Leia. There is a great scene where Han and Luke talk about Leia in the Millenium Falcon. The meaning of this scene is clearly that Luke fancies Leia and Han does not. All changes to this dynamic after the original film are simply to make the plot work thereafter and are not present in any form in the original.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. cubman987

    cubman987 Friendly Neighborhood Saga/Music/Fun & Games Mod star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2014
    Hi @Chief Chirpa welcome to the boards! I changed the title of the thread to better reflect what your post and the thread is about.

    As for my opinion - I think Star Wars certainly COULD have been one film and worked just fine. As you mentioned Vader survived, and so did the Emperor and the Empire itself - but if no other Star Wars movie had been made I think you could assume that the destruction of the Death Star was the beginning of the end for the Empire and just viewed the movie as such

    That said I'm very happy that we got the sequels, especially since Empire is my favorite

    This is true but personally I have no problem with how things turned out, in fact, Vader revealing he is Luke's father is my all time favorite movie moment.

    I'm not sure I completely agree here - mostly I don't think Leia has any interest in Luke at all so I never saw them as being a couple or destined to be as such. That said the Han - Leia relationship really isn't hinted at much if at all in ANH, so you are correct there, but again, I'm very happy with how it turned out!
    .
     
  3. Chief Chirpa

    Chief Chirpa Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2018
    Yeah, I agree there doesn't seem to be any chemistry.

    Are Jedis supposed to abstain from such relations? I can't think of an example where one of them has a wife and Annekin has to keep his relationship a secret, though he is by nature a rule breaker.
     
  4. oierem

    oierem Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 18, 2009
     
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  5. PymParticles

    PymParticles Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2014
    I think Star Wars, the 1977 Best Picture, Best Director, and Best Original Screenplay nominee, would be more highly regarded as a singular piece of cinematic art if the rest of the franchise hadn't sprung up around it. I also don't think it would take nearly as much blame as it does for "breaking" the Hollywood movie model and creating the blockbuster trend that continues to the present day.

    However, I don't think Star Wars as a "big thing" would have anywhere near the same degree of cultural staying power or continued influence if it was limited to the one film. That, more than anything, is Star Wars' true value, and I think it would be a shame to lose, because despite the toxicity we've witnessed in the fandom in recent years (which admittedly has been present for some time) I truly believe that the world is a slightly better place because this stupid story about space magic exists.

    If The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi hadn't been released, both of which played a crucial role in transforming what was a simple space fantasy action-adventure throwback into true modern pop mythology, then I don't think Star Wars would have taken root in the collective cultural consciousness in quite the same way. If the PT hadn't been released 19 years ago(!!!), and if the ST wasn't being released today, then I don't think we'd see parents sharing Star Wars with their kids so excitedly, and I don't think we'd see kids receiving it from their parents with so much enthusiasm. Star Wars, as a "big thing," is something that is very much alive and has a continuing relationship with our culture, and we're seeing the nature of that relationship change a little bit around the edges as it adapts to the modern world. It's one of the few things that seems to be a shared cultural fixation, and unlike most everything else, this fixation has persisted )with varying degrees of intensity) for over forty years.

    You don't get that from just one film. So, although I'll readily concede that the subsequent sequels and prequels and spin-offs have taken away from the artistic integrity, if not the artistic value, of the original film, I think what we've gotten in return has far greater and more enduring value over all.
     
  6. Chief Chirpa

    Chief Chirpa Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2018
    I think I do probably agree with the above on the whole.

    Its just I don't feel I can say, "I like star wars" without also saying "but not jaja Binks".

    1 more thing I realised and sorry if this has been pointed out before...

    If chewy knew Yoda (episode 3), why didn't he mention it when Luke said he was going to meet him in episode 5? He could've said " he's like an ancient Kermit" then Luke would know what to expect. Just saying because some people believe 1 to 6 were all written together.
     
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  7. Alexrd

    Alexrd Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Yes.

    Luke never said anything about visiting Yoda to anyone.
     
  8. PymParticles

    PymParticles Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 1, 2014
    I mean, how many of us can say that we like the things we love 100% of the time, or that we like every aspect of that thing? I mean, I love Batman, but I don't need to justify with the caveat "but not Batman & Robin." Just focus on what you like, and kind of push what you don't by the wayside. And as much as I personally dislike Jar Jar, there are fans who like him and who consider The Phantom Menace to be their favorite film in the series. So at least for their sake, I'm glad it was made. Star Wars is better for being bigger and having something for everyone, even if not every thing is for everybody.
     
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  9. Binary_Sunset

    Binary_Sunset Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2000
    I agree with Chief Chirpa. The original film is a self-contained masterpiece of magic and pure joy. While I enjoy three additional SW films, none of them holds a candle to the 1977 classic.

    I first saw SW in the theater in June 1977 when I was 7 years old. Ever since, everything else with the "Star Wars" label seems more or less off to me, as though they were taking place in some alternate universe from the '77 film.
     
  10. SithOverlord101

    SithOverlord101 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 1, 2018
    No (ESB is the prime reason I oppose this - I found it to be a slightly better film than ANH).
     
  11. topgoalscorer_no11

    topgoalscorer_no11 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 23, 2001
    I've always held the opinion that the absolute masterpiece of the series is, and always will be, Star Wars.

    Everything stems from it. All that's good in Star Wars can be traced back there. It's a monumental and unlikely achievement in special effects, character etc. and builds a fully realised and totally coherent world. Check out the Sequel Trilogy to see how hard this is to do. No-one has matched it in film before or since - all other competitors in the 'fantasy universe' stakes are based on preexisting books or comics.

    You'd have to tear ESB, RotJ and RotS from my cold dead hands, however I will say this:

    In many ways everything that gets added to the Star Wars mix in terms of films, tv, novelisations etc simply serves to dilute the limitless playground for the imagination created by George Lucas and his merry band of collaborators back in the mid 70's. As a child, the original Star Wars was all I ever needed to take me far, far away.
     
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  12. Binary_Sunset

    Binary_Sunset Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2000
    Yep. My inchoate Star Wars imaginings in the late 1970s moved me more than anything else with the Star Wars label (except for the '77 film, of course).
     
  13. Blobofat

    Blobofat Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Dec 15, 2000
    TESB is the best SW film but nothing can ever beat the original Star Wars 1977. A game changer of pure wonder and the fact is you had to be there to really appreciate that. I hate it when people say that about things but I think in this case it's true. But I strongly disagree that it should be just one film. It presented a spectacular galaxy rich with possibilities and should be explored as such.
     
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  14. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    No. There is just no way you can fit all 3 movies together
     
  15. The Krynoid Man

    The Krynoid Man Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 24, 2015
    I somewhat agree. I think the later films took away from the mystique of the story. On the other hand, without the other films and spin off material the original film would probably be a cult favourite known by cinephiles and Sci-Fi enthusiasts but mostly forgotten by the mainstream. We also wouldn't have gotten Empire, which would be a shame.
     
  16. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003
    If we're basically talking about our personal "should haves," then I will say Star Wars should have continued on with Episode VII-IX only a few years after ROTJ came out. I would've been willing to wait for the prequels until Han Luke and Leia's part in the skywalker saga were completely done.

    I do not however, thing SW should've been only one film. I very much enjoy the episodic feel each one has, and the different things each one features. Although they fit nicely together into one storyline, every episode is a little unique and different, and I love that.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2018
  17. oierem

    oierem Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 18, 2009
    It WAS done. Lucas was clear about that in 1981-83. Each trilogy had each own characters, and only the droids would appear in all of them. OT was "his" Star Wars and he wanted other people to do the other parts.

    The idea that the ST would follow the lead characters of the OT came later, when Lucas lost any interest in doing it (and didn't want others doing it).
     
  18. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2003

    K so, I understand that. Of course I do. But (and I figured-perhaps mistakenly-that this was implied in my previous post), I was speaking in the context of a nine episode saga. Lucas' real life intentions set aside for the moment-cos that's not really what this thread is about, I would've rather seen Luke Leia and Han's story continued in VII-IX when they were younger, as opposed to when they're in their 50's and 60's. And then save the I-III for after their story completely resolves-to clarify-AFTER episode IX.

    This is a thread that encourages opinions-everyone here is giving theirs-and that is mine.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2018
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  19. Binary_Sunset

    Binary_Sunset Force Ghost star 5

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    Oct 28, 2000
    It wouldn't have even delayed the prequels:

    1986: Episode VII
    1989: Episode VIII
    1992: Episode IX
    1999: TPM
    2002: AOTC
    2005: ROTS
     
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  20. GregMcP

    GregMcP Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2015
    I was a child of those times.
    I was part of that great obsession.

    You perhaps don't understand the times. We wanted more. Kids absorbed it all. We danced to the Meco disco Star Wars theme. We watched the bad movie knockoffs, and despite it's deserved mockery, we ate up the Holiday Special because it was a little be more of the drug we needed.

    Absolutely yes, we needed another film.
     
  21. ezekiel22x

    ezekiel22x Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2002
    I'm torn given that I sympathize with Star Wars '77 purists but I also love the prequels. Maybe my perfect timeline is one where Star Wars was one and done and we got a modified PT that was its own separate SF project.
     
  22. GregMcP

    GregMcP Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2015
    Star Wars contains as many movies as you are comfortable with.

    I'm a big fan of Alien, and fans of that series acknowledge different numbers of movies. For many it's just two. And that's fine.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2018
  23. The Deuteragonist

    The Deuteragonist Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 25, 2018
    I honestly feel that Star Wars is one of the few movies that truly deserves to have the sequel that it's begging for. It's just so good that it would be almost criminal to not make more. It would be like falling in love in one night and then never seeing that person again. You'll be left wondering about what could have been. When I watch Star Wars (1977) with the idea in my mind that this is where the biggest cinematic phenomenon in history starts, I'm just like...yeah, I can see that. That said, I can also totally see someone saying that the Star Wars franchise should have ended at ROTJ. It's a great ending for all of the characters introduced in the original film.

    I will say that Star Wars (1977) does feel different from the rest of the movies in the franchise. It really is like it's own thing and it could have certainly been the only film released from the franchise. It's action-packed, full of wonder, and sci-fi/fantasy goodness, but there's no grand lightsaber fight or crazy reveal. SW would be remembered very different if it was only one movie. I don't think it would have been quite as popular either. Han Solo is the best character in the film and he and Vader would have probably been the main ones that would have gotten huge fanfare. Even still, while Darth Vader is cool and all, he doesn't become truly interesting until ESB. Also, Yoda is one of the best alien characters in cinema.

    Lastly, there's one thing that Star Wars does so well that is much better suited for a film series: character development. Luke's journey feels incomplete by the end of Star Wars (1977) and not capitalizing on that would have been a huge mistake, especially considering that it paid off by the end of Trilogy.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  24. Master_Lok

    Master_Lok Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Interesting question.

    Many fantastic answers I agree with.

    I adore the original movie, but also love Enpire Strikes Back. However, I think @The Deuteragonist made a great point with Luke’s story feels incomplete, even though the original SW could be a done in one too.

    And @GregMcP akso nailed it when he talked about being a kid wanting more. That was so true. I wanted so much more.

    So I am glad we got the OT, the PT and Rogue One. Maybe more films as well.
     
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  25. themoth

    themoth Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2015
    Bingo. Same with me and Predator. I’m fine with it just being the original and the sequel.