ST The New Definitely Not Improved Even More Horrible Than The Last Two Rumors Thread

Palpatine was already an active participant by virtue of the fact that he was the (living) de facto leader of the Empire as established in ANH. He was further established as Vader's master and a powerful Force user in TESB. Plagueis was killed already, he's nothing but a footnote in Palpatine's career and was only mentioned to entice Anakin and give some additional background for Sidious.

There's a very good reason why the creatives involved at Lucasfilm are so dismissive of this obsession over Plagueis; he's an esoteric non-character with even less relevance in this story than Nien Nunb. Personally, I don't even understand the fascination over Plagueis outside of how he relates to Palpatine.

 

Oh, damn. That’s the first time I read that. Great concept! Would have made for a great twist there too. No idea how they’d end that with Rey & Kylo but there would have been options.

The other option, which would have felt very Marvel, would have been to just show one of these Acolytes being given an update at the very end of VIII and running down stairs and declaring. “He did it. Kylo Ren killed Snoke” to body on a slab who then said “Excellent. Everything is proceeding as I have forseen. Soon, Rey will be mine.”

WIPE TO CREDITS

Instead they will kind of try to have that type of scene near the start of IX it seems with Kylo finding him instead.

 

Your take on Plagueis seems right. There might be a second reason Plagueis was mentioned and that's to setup Palpatine's ability to cheat death. Maybe Palpatine died and was brought back to life by Plagueis. Having died and been brought back to life gave Palpatine insight on how to cheat death for himself, something Plagueis couldn't do.

 

Gotta love it. Plagueis in the ST should never happen because he's barely a footnote mentioned in the Saga, but Palpatine can have a secret family never once mentioned before.

 

I can imagine where Plagueis could have worked. So long as it’s paid off in a significant way. That’s the thing with Rey Palpatine. It doesn’t just make the ST enormously more interesting but it also makes the entire saga more interesting. That’s why it’s worth it. Even if it all should have been set up better. The pros in the provided drama, the thematic terrain, and the way it allows new fans of Star Wars via the ST to want to go back and learn more about the grandparents outweighs the cons of it not being set up as well as it should have been.

 

How can something have a good pay off, when there's nothing set up for that pay off?

 

That isn't good writing either. I understand why they did it, of course, to give the contemporary protagonists a personal connection to the primary villain, but the method they chose was contrived and misbegotten.

 

The setup in this case was the mystery of Rey herself and why her powers were so formidable opposite the grandson of Darth Vader, and why her force awakening and dark side moments seemed so different than Luke’s journey prior, and why these two seemed to become so fascinated in the other. So it pays all of those questions off for some of us. Among other interesting aspects.

 

According to Lucas, Luke "chose" his destiny.

 

Oh I'm not saying it is. Just commenting on the excuses, really.

That's not a set up for Rey Palpatine. That's a set up for Rey Kenobi or Rey Skywalker or Rey Smith. Meanwhile, Palpatine's family is never mentioned ever. So where's the pay off? How can I be paid off when I never knew this was the set up...

 

DP

 

By sheer will of indescriminate enthusiasm, apparently.

 

Even if Palpatine wasn’t back it was a lineage option and a relatively popular one at that dating back to TFA. And it was always grandparental with the idea being that like Jon Snow a secret line we didn’t know existed was learned of and rattled her world.

On a certain level any relevant lineage tie reveal for IX would involve some new backstory we hadn’t been privy to prior. This one is just more interesting than the others because it connects her to the biggest villain in the entire saga and gets into things like force lightning and realizing that all of those old ships and walkers she spent time in were her grandfathers. He was the boogie man in those stories she loved. He was the Master to Kylo Ren’s idol and the ruler of the galaxy and maybe she really was made to be bad and maybe she really should get with Kylo Ren as a result. More interesting questions enter the mind related to the end game. It makes the third act way more fascinating for the unspoiled who are seeing the last Skywalker in Kylo Ren getting better and becoming Ben and Rey becoming more unhinged and losing her control in fits of rage and more dark side. How will she handle the manipulations of this master manipulator? Unless they were planning to bring Vader back from the dead ReySky lacked that additional element and would have just made it Rey vs Kylo at the end again and everyone would know how that would go if she was the pure light side Skywalker facing the evil cousin.

They made the right choice. They just should have set it up better.

 

You're rewriting history. The set up from the beginning of the ST wasn't about grandpas, it was "what happened to Vader's grandkid(s)?". The story was about the Skywalker lineage, based somewhat on the two sides of Anakin/Vader. The story (and the saga) was never about Palpatine being a grandpa, or at the very least never showed that set up.

 

I think you misinterpreted me there. I meant only that Rey Palpatine was a relatively popular theory in the TFA days and that when it was discussed nobody thought Palpatine was her father and assumed, like Kenobi theory, that she’d be a granddaughter opposite Darth Vader’s grandson if it happened.

 

When the ST was announced, were people excited about the prospect of Palpatine returning?

 

Is Rey for sure the real Grand Daughter of Palpatine? Like Palpatine had children and one of them is the mother or father of Rey? Woof.

I'd be fine if Palpatine created Rey through other nefarious and Force related means.

It was one of the first rumors I read about the ST in 2011.

 

Well...it would seem the leakers are adamant that she is his real granddaughter. But I ain't buying it...yet.

I think either:
A: Palpatine is lying, just as he did with Anakin and Luke, when trying to seduce him.
B: They shot an ending with Rey Palpatine reveal, which was always meant to be a simple fake out.
C: She's not his granddaughter in the natural sense. He created her, or at least pretends to have had.
D: She's a Skywalker. Palpatine's daughter and Luke are the 'rents. Luke doesn't even know.
E: We never find out what Rey's surname actually is until she chooses the last name of Skywalker.

 

A rumor does not mean excitement. Ender's POV rests on why he thinks the Palpatine think works to enrich the saga as a whole. I just don't see it but that's primarily because I don't see Palpatine as anything more than a foil for the main characters of the saga. Making Rey his granddaughter in the last film of a 9 film series doesn't change that.

 

I think there are plenty of clues in the saga that Palpatine created Anakin...it was at leasr a very nearly used Theory.. that has probably been pencilled in for a long time...my feeling anyway

 

What if the Force created Anakin - the Chosen One - as an answer to something unnatural that Palpatine had done; Create life. Only while he thinks he created Anakin, he actually created Rey. Which took much longer than he anticipated.

 

Palpatine killing Snoke in TLJ would have been brilliant, because it would have given the audience a momentary ability to actually cheer for Palpatine, in the same sense that the audience got to enjoy watching Vader kill Imperial officers.

If they had just brought Palpatine in during the final scene of TLJ, instead of broom boy, it would have solved half the problems.

 

It helps the wait between films to feel more setup but I really don’t see an enormous difference between an end of film reveal in film 2 of a trilogy of at the very start of film 3 of a trilogy when viewing the entire trilogy as one large story.

 

Or Kylo kills Snoke, they have their fight with the PG...and then the room starts to tremble and a hauntingly familiar voice echoes through the chamber "You cannot defeat me". Then instead of going to broom boy, we go to Exogol. We see the floating cube thing, and gaze at a deformed Palpatine laying on some weird techno-bed, who now awakens.

That's a cliffhanger. And I have no doubt would have gotten butts into seats.