main
side
curve
  1. ATTENTION: All leaks and rumors MUST be spoiler tagged. Information from official sources or the big trades do NOT need to be tagged

Kenobi A Vader vs Kenobi duel between eps 3 & 4 - Does it breaks canon?

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Current and Future Shows' started by Jedi_Sith_Smuggler_Droid, Jun 5, 2022.

?

A Vader vs Kenobi duel between eps 3 & 4 - Does it breaks canon?

  1. No

  2. Yes

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Jedi_Sith_Smuggler_Droid

    Jedi_Sith_Smuggler_Droid Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 13, 2014
    Does Darth Vader and Obi-Wan dueling between Revenge of the Sith and A New Hope break canon?

    Please discuss.
     
    CampOfSorgan and cwustudent like this.
  2. Darth_Accipiter

    Darth_Accipiter Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2015
    I think this is an important discussion so I hope the moderators keep it a separate thread from the general Obi Wan discussion.

    No, I don't think it breaks canon. "When I left you I was but the learner, now I am the Master" does not necessarily have to refer to their master/student relationship but their overall understanding of and command over the force, and also their dueling skills. And it's Vader speaking from an arrogant perspective. And there is obviously going to be another confrontation. A quick bit of dialogue between the two during their next confrontation can set things right. Like, Obi Wan can simply say

    "You still have much to learn" in a mirror to Episode II where Yoda schools Dooku.

    Or Obi Wan can simply defeat Vader again in lightsaber combat, clearly demonstrating that Vader has more to learn to defeat a Jedi Master of Obi Wan's caliber.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2022
    RetropME and Emperor Ferus like this.
  3. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2014
    I believe canon is more fluid now, that it can pick from legends and retcon as it pleases. I think if storytellers are to have freedom, we will need to view canon as what the main story is and characters must fall in prism of who they are, but details can change that aren’t defining and orthodoxy; i.e. some lines in a duel can be reinterpreted.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2022
  4. Jedi_Sith_Smuggler_Droid

    Jedi_Sith_Smuggler_Droid Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Mar 13, 2014
    Could a mod please give this the orange Kenobi marker?
     
    cwustudent likes this.
  5. The Chalk Jedi

    The Chalk Jedi Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2019
    Why would it break canon?
     
    cwustudent and darth_mccartney like this.
  6. themoth

    themoth Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2015
    No, it doesn’t break canon.
     
    cwustudent and darth_mccartney like this.
  7. Jordan1Kenobi

    Jordan1Kenobi SWC 100 Day Star Wars Challenge Host star 6 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Sep 30, 2012
    Not at all.
     
    darth_mccartney likes this.
  8. Vader0706

    Vader0706 Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2017
  9. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    It might change the way we view their ANH encounter from here on out- but I feel like that duel feels anticlimactic compared to ROTS- I feel like their final encounter should capture that scope of energy and emotion.

    I don't think that Episode 3 of Kenobi succeeded in that, but maybe that's me being greedy.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2022
  10. themoth

    themoth Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2015
    We also need to wait and see how the rematch goes in a couple episodes time.
     
    Shaak Ti, Darkslayer, Dandelo and 2 others like this.
  11. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval Admin & TV Screaming Service star 9 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Yes.
     
  12. Lord-Skywalker

    Lord-Skywalker Hangman Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 2002
    It doesn’t break canon. It creates new canon.
     
  13. darth_mccartney

    darth_mccartney Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 3, 2008
    Maybe this isn't the last time they duel in this series though!
     
    Emperor Ferus likes this.
  14. Jordan1Kenobi

    Jordan1Kenobi SWC 100 Day Star Wars Challenge Host star 6 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Sep 30, 2012
    They are 100% going to duel again by the end of this series. And it’s going to blow everyone’s socks off!
     
    Darth Dnej and Sproj like this.
  15. SmokeMonster4815162342

    SmokeMonster4815162342 Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 31, 2015
    “When I left you” doesn’t mean “when we last met”, just like…for example, when someone says when they left their ex-husband, or their ex-boss, it doesn’t refer to the last time they saw each other.

    It can instead refer to him leaving Obiwan for the dark side, aka ROTS, where he was still the learner since he got his ass kicked.

    “Now I am the master” can be Anakin referring to how Obiwan lost the last time they fought, and/or it can refer to how Anakin believes Obiwan is going to lose now.

    And anyways, the entire PT “breaks” canon all the time (we’re just used to it now).
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2022
    Shaak Ti, Valiowk, cwustudent and 2 others like this.
  16. Generational Fan

    Generational Fan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 21, 2015
    I don't think so; in fact, it could potentially enhance Kenobi's words in ROTJ.

    I think they need to square off one more time before ANH for Kenobi to try and appeal to any remaining humanity or hope that Anakin has left. It would really put a strong emphasis on Obi-Wan's belief that Anakin is "more machine now, twisted and evil".

    Because for those words to make true sense in every aspect of them, Kenobi would have to know and feel that Anakin is more machine. Because before this series, as we know, Obi-Wan's last vision of Anakin was him burning on Mustafar. He may of seen Vader's image on the holonet in the comic's, but only the true appreciation for what Anakin has become is to see him in person. And Anakin wasn't a machine on Mustafar in ROTS.

    So another battle enhance's Obi-Wan's words with his true belief that Anakin cannot be saved.
     
  17. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval Admin & TV Screaming Service star 9 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Wait does anyone actually believe that this series ends with the title character crawling away after being burned and the next few episodes are going to be him in Bacta and then saying, "Well that was terrifying. No more for me, thanks" and popping off to avoid his scary enemies... end credits?
     
    Shaak Ti and Riv_Shiel like this.
  18. Lady_Skywalker87

    Lady_Skywalker87 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 4, 2008
    To me it doesn't..but I can see why people may think that.

    Then again, TCW and in a much pleasant manner, Fantastic Beasts taught me to chillax about canon. At the end of the day is about how one chooses to assimilate the new information presented.

    Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk
     
    RokurGepta likes this.
  19. Ancient Whills

    Ancient Whills Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2011
    No. I want to see how Obi-Wan tried to reach out to Anakin as Vader mentioned in RotJ.
     
    cwustudent, Darth Dnej and Sproj like this.
  20. Sproj

    Sproj Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 18, 2019
    If one rigidly sticks to their own head canon where in said head canon, a re-match cannot happen, then nothing will make this series ok, nothing at all, it is impossible.

    If one is open-minded and is happy to see what we get before making a judgment, then no at present it does not break canon.

    At this point in time, we do not know how this ends, so a judgement cannot yet be made and I personally am really excited to see where it goes.
     
  21. CloneBlooper

    CloneBlooper Jedi Grand Master star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 20, 2002
    No, I don’t believe canon has been altered because of the events of the new show, but having said that; I live a canon free life, and it’s liberating. No faceless cooperate shills or tweeting story group twerps are going to tell me which narratives I’m supposed to follow. Nor do I need smug YouTube ‘lore’ aficionados mansplaining to me why Glup Shi*to is an integral part of the GFFA. That might be a slightly different topic, but it’s kinda related. So yeah…sod canon, and everything it represents.

    Fight the power!
     
  22. dogprivilege

    dogprivilege Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    I think a more important question is "Does this re-match add to the character/saga story in a meaningful way?" And in this case I think it does. Like, IMO the ROTS-ANH transition for these characters works fine as is, but the ANH confrontation really isn't quite the satisfying follow-up you'd want for these two characters after the entire PT. Seeing Obi Wan react to what Vader has become, how he processes the events of ROTS, and how Vader seeks revenge fleshes out these characters in new ways that I think really adds to and rounds out the overall story.
     
    Shaak Ti and Lady_Skywalker87 like this.
  23. Kato Sai

    Kato Sai Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2014
    I gotta say, Kenobi received a burn of the soul from Owen, “like you trained his father?” and then by Vader literally. Owen and Vader truly are half brothers.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2022
    Shaak Ti likes this.
  24. Erkan12

    Erkan12 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2013
    I think yes it does.

    ''When I left you I was but the learner, now I am the master!''.

    How can you say Vader was the learner from their last fight? He beat Kenobi.

    Obviously Kenobi should've bested him instead, so Vader can remember it as a learner, not as a master.

    The only way to fix this Kenobi and Vader duels again, and Kenobi beats Vader like he did on Mustafar. So Vader can remember it that he was the learner.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2022
    ConservativeJedi321 and Kato Sai like this.
  25. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval Admin & TV Screaming Service star 9 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    I doubt that happens. From what I read on here it seems to make much more sense that Obi Wan lost that fight and will spend the rest of his show recovering and living in fear and doubt and eventually giving up and then the end credits role.

    It makes more and more plausible sense the more you reread it.