PT Answered: How did Padmé die?

At the very very least, Anakin would expect to get himself killed if he doesn't obey Sidious. Without anyone to save Padme, she will eventually die in childbirth (or at least that's what he thinks). The baby(ies), IF he/she/they survive the birthing process, will have no parents.

 

That's the whole point. He thinks he has to join Sidious because otherwise he won't have the power to save Padme.

But where's the lack of choice here? He could choose not to join a genocidal maniac just for the chance of maybe preventing something which he doesn't even know for sure is going to happen.

Anakin's the freakin' Chosen One. Even if he couldn't defeat Sidious, I'm pretty sure he could at least defend himself and get away. He could whip out his comlink and warn the other Jedi spread across the galaxy to watch their backs, he could organize the Jedi over at the Temple, he could try to expose Sidious to the public, if all else fails he could lead a resistance...there are lots of things he could have done that would have almost certainly resulted in a better outcome than selling his soul, joining the dark side, and slicing up a bunch of kindergartners. Even if he dies trying any of this, that's still a better choice.

 

Keep in mind that he had just allowed Sidious to kill Mace. His mind is racing on a huge hamster wheel of panic mode. He’s not thinking clearly, if at all. Even if he could flee, he’s probably not gonna waltz back to the Temple as if nothing happened — his own conscience would be reminding him that he basically killed one of his own. The Jedi would find out sooner or later, and they most definitely would expel him. Imagine him trying to explain that to Padmé. “Hey, so, Master Windu was fighting a Sith Lord so I chopped off his hand and let the Sith Lord blast him out of the window.”

 

"Chosen One" is just some prophecy that Yoda believes was misread. It doesn't mean Anakin was already super powerful at the time of ROTS.
He's not going to leave that room as a living Jedi. The obvious options are to become either be a Sith or a pile of indiscernible body parts. His comlink? Sidious would blast it with force lightning before Anakin can even turn it on.

I'm not saying he has no way around this at all, just no other option that would make things turn out better for himself. The other options I can think of are:

1. He can commit suicide. That would leave Sidious with no Force-using servant for a while, so it would be easier for the resistance to overthrow his empire later. So this option would be slightly better for others, but he and Padme both die, and the baby(ies), if they survive, have no parents. And if Sidious interferes before Anakin could kill himself, I doubt Sidious would let him die a quick and easy death.

2. He could also try deception. Pretend to become a Sith. *Hopefully* Sidious doesn't immediately sense the lie. So Anakin leads the clones toward the Jedi Temple. When he's far away enough from Sidious (far enough that Sidious can't immediately kill him), pull out his comlink and inform Yoda of the situation. *Hopefully* Yoda is available to receive his message immediately (i.e. not dead already and not in deep sleep or in the midst of fighting). *Hopefully* Sidious wasn't cautious enough to tell the clones that if Anakin tries to escape or make contact with any Jedi, immediately shoot him. So the clones would have to report the situation to Sidious, receive the order to shoot Anakin, and then actually carry out the order, which should give Anakin enough time to get the main points across to Yoda before the clones shoot him (note: Anakin can not defeat or escape from thousands of clones). So there's a minuscule chance of saving the galaxy, but things will still turn out horribly for himself.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying what Anakin did was morally correct. I'm saying his suffering could not have been avoided by making an alternative choice.

Anakin seemed to think the Jedi would kill him for his involvement in Windu's death. Sidious said that once the Jedi learn what has transpired here, they will kill us, and Anakin agreed. I'm not sure if that's actually true or not. It's a purely academic question though. If he disobeyed Sidious, there's no way he would survive long enough for a Jedi to kill him.

 

^ Sidious would interfere the moment Anakin grabbed his lightsaber and ignited it. Whether he’d use it to kill himself or Sidious would be irrelevant. Just as with the comlink, he’d send it flying out of Anakin’s reach, leaving him vulnerable and 100% at Sidious’ mercy.

Honestly, Option #2 would’ve been the better choice as it would give Anakin time to warn the Jedi of the coup. The first one pretty much plays out as it does in the movie, only Anakin is dead.

 

This is where your argument falls apart. You don't know he isn't going to leave that room as a living Jedi. You just assume he wouldn't be able to.

And yes, his suffering absolutely could have been avoided, even if it meant dying. Dying has nothing to do with suffering. Only the living suffer.

 

One advantage of Option #1 that I had in mind when writing it was that by dying quickly, Anakin can avoid torture for both himself and Padme (there's no point torturing her if Anakin isn't alive to know about it). But yeah good point, Sidious would blast away Anakin's lightsaber before he can do anything with it. So the only other option really is to try deception.

 

Ok then switch "his suffering" to "some form of horrible outcome for himself."

Anakin doesn't stand a chance against Sidious and he knows that. Sidious already demonstrated his full power to him when he blasted Mace with force lighting the second time.
That's why Anakin was terrified of Sidious:

In the OT when Vader tells Luke it is pointless to resist, it's probably because that's how he felt when he surrendered to Sidious.
He was in complete misery at the time:


He does not want to, but still does despite being told that Sidious doesn't even have the power to save Padme, because his options were extremely limited at this point. It was basically unconditional surrender.

 

Even if he did try Option #2, he knows he’s living on borrowed time. Either the Jedi think he’s a Sith and try to kill him (thus forcing him to kill them, thus destroying any chance he had of returning to them), or Anakin attempts to flee (somehow) and is killed by either the Clones or Palpatine. Even if, somehow, by some merest glimmer of a chance, he was able to escape both the Jedi and the Sith w/ the thousands of clones at his beck and call, that’s it. He’s a man on the run. He can no longer return to Coruscant. He’d probably have to find an Outer Rim planet to live on for the rest of his days and avoid any Imperial/Republic soldiers/Jedi survivors that could be looking for him.

There was absolutely no way out of this, and he knew it. ‘Chosen One’ doesn’t mean he’s a stupidly OP super-warrior that can tank a lightsaber and keep walking. It just means ‘The One Destined To Destroy The Sith’. It said nothing about toughness. And even then, Yoda admitted it could’ve been misread.

Look at those .gifs above my post. That’s not the look of a Chosen One, that’s the look of a man petrified and in a trap he cannot escape from. There was absolutely no way he was gonna be able to get back to where he was five minutes earlier.

 

Palpatine isn't invincible, nor is he omnipotent, nor is he omniscient. He can be defeated. Anakin had plenty of other options. He's the Chosen One.

 

Even IF we go by your understanding that Anakin stands a chance against Sidious, it's just a chance, not a certainty, right? If Anakin loses, then there will be a bad outcome for him. Likewise, with the dark path he ended up choosing, part of his bad outcomes only happened because he lost to Obi Wan. So regardless of which side he chooses, the outcome for him can be relatively better or worse depending on whether he wins or loses. So the bad outcomes he ended up with are a result of the situation and the fact that he lost, not because he chose the wrong side.

 

Sidious knew that Anakin's full potential outstripped his own. That's why if he had sensed the slightest bit of betrayal in Anakin, he would have gone in for the kill. Vader did have thoughts of betraying his master as early as Mustafar, making something of a leap after considering him one of his close friends such a short time ago.

Was he still angry at Palpatine's longtime deception? Did he somehow know in the back of his mind that Padme was still not safe? The ROTS novel implies this by disclosing his thoughts while standing on the balcony after the Separatist massacre. Could he possibly be angry after Palpatine's bait-and-switch reveal that "only one has achieved the power?"

Either way, Sidious most certainly had malicious intentions against Padme. While I don't believe he directly caused her death, I'm pretty sure he anticipated her reaction to Anakin's evil deeds, and beyond that, Anakin's response to Padme when she confronted him about it.

 

I believe Anakin could have defeated Palpatine. But I also believe that he wanted the latter alive because he was desperate to find a way to keep Padme alive. I suspect that he saw Palpatine as his best chance. By the time of Mace's death, I think he realized that he had went to far to go back.

 

More evidence that Anakin can't beat Sidious:

Sidious's full power Force lightning could blast a lightsaber out of Yoda's hands. Yoda could hold him off using that turquoise glowball thing, a bare-handed technique which no one else was ever shown to use. The Yoda/Sidious duel made the lightsaber as a weapon obsolete. The Obi Wan/Anakin duel depended on the lightsaber.

Anakin's relationship with Palpatine changed in three stages:

1. As soon as Anakin found out Palpatine was Darth Sidious, Anakin pulled out his lightsaber and wanted to kill him Their friendship ended right there, replaced by anger/hatred. However, Anakin still had residual trust in him, and Sidious was still acting friendly to Anakin, so Anakin actually believed what he said about saving Padme. This was the only reason Anakin cut off Windu's arm. Not because he was a friend, but because he was a tool to save Padme.

2. After Anakin cut off Windu's arm, Sidious immediately killed Windu with his full power Force lightning, revealing that he was previously faking weakness to trick Anakin into attacking Windu. Now the trust is also gone, and hatred increased. However, Sidious's deliberate demonstration of his full power created fear in Anakin. At this point, fear of Sidious was what kept Anakin with him. It wasn't a friendship. It was a strict, top-down relationship.

3. Then, Sidious reveals that he doesn't even have the power to save Padme. Sure, that increases Anakin's hatred of Sidious, but that's already irrelevant in terms of Anakin's actions. The fear is still there. In fact, Anakin became even more subservient. The way Sidious shamelessly reveals his deception, and intentional use of a term with a negative connotation ("to cheat death", instead of the previously used word "save") is implying that what Anakin just said ("just help me save Padme's life") is inappropriate for their new relationship. Anakin is not allowed to make demands; he can only obey orders and pray for mercy. Anakin understands, and in response goes onto his knees and pledges himself to Sidious. Then when Sidious gives him his new name, Anakin robotically responds with "Thank you, my master." He's obviously not enthusiastic about it, but he says what he is expected to say. I talked about this scene in the gif section of this post too in case anyone is interested.

 

Good point about Palpatine’s feigned weakness, I didn’t even think about that.

Therefore, in Anakin’s mind, if Palpatine lied about that, who was to say he wasn’t pretending to have the best of intentions in agreeing to help him save Padme?

 

Accidental double post

 

Probably so. It was a perfect trap. Lure Anakin in to do the unthinkable and then say ‘whoopsie, I don’t have that power’ whe it’s far too late for Anakin to change his mind. Anakin probably knew by now that Palpatine lied about everything, even his intentions to protect Padmé, but by this point, he had gone too far.

 

I'm cool with what we got but I'd also love to hear an actual medical theory/explanation for her death.

 

I always figured it was a combination of:

• Stress upon learning everything that had transpired in the last twenty-four hours.

• Lack of oxyge to the brain due to the Force Choke and being unconscious.

• Giving birth to twins.

The fact she was coherent enough to give the babies names and tell Obi-Wan that there was still good in Anakin is a damn miracle.

 

If this was the case, the droids would have been able to determine that it was the case. Lucas didn't put the medical droids' lines in the movie for no reason. What Padme was dying from was not a physical ailment.

 

Vader killed Padme. In every possible way

 

I remember leaving the movie theater after seeing RotS for the first time thinking that her life Force went into Anakin/Vader to keep him alive. Whether that was a gift from her, or Vader intentionally or unintentionally siphoning it, I don’t know. I didn’t get the feeling that it was an act performed by Sidious though.

 

Be gone, permabanned sock.

/heels

 

Just thinking about it now, I like the poethic justice idea- the ability to create life or keep life active would come at the price of losing another life. Like Plagueis managed to create Anakin, but the Force had to rebalance and take Plagueis' life as a result. Anakin wanted so keep Padmé alive, got corrupted and as a result nearly lost his life, only to regain it by losing Padmé.

That said, I do believe Padmé died of a broken heart, because that fits with the motifs GL used in his Saga.
But it's an interesting alternative to entertain.

Also, those people who think Padmé is just an unrealistically bad mother for giving up as her children are being born into a dangerous world she should protect them from should watch the recent Louis Theroux BBC documentary "Mothers on the Edge". It's about women having postpartum psychosis, which can result in suicide.

 

Vader killed padme