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CT Any Former SE Haters Who Now Like the Special Edition?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by rpeugh, Dec 26, 2020.

  1. rpeugh

    rpeugh Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 2002
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  2. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

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    Jul 29, 2016
    I used to consider myself a purist, liking each film best the way they originally were released. Didn't have to do with whether or not I liked the PT, but I just felt the changes made the movie less authentic, though admittedly many were better for continuity.

    I've come to greater appreciate Lucas's role in making his unified saga just that, and that includes editing the movies for greater consistency. There wasn't one day when I decided I liked the SEs, it just happened over time.
     
  3. christophero30

    christophero30 Chosen One star 8

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    May 18, 2017
    I have mixed feelings about the SE, but I don't get worked up about it. ANH needed the visual upgrade the most. The Jabba scene just seems redundant. They just repeat lines from the Han Greedo scene. The droid desert scene before Mos Eisley is just jarring. ESB didn't need it imo. Don't like the Vader exposition near the end slowing down the film. And the Cloud City upgrades, while cool, kind of defeats the purpose of the claustrophobic corridors and maze like appearance of the place. But it's not a huge deal I still have the original ESB.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
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  4. darthvader88

    darthvader88 Jedi Master star 4

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    Apr 29, 2005
    I like all the movies and the many versions

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
     
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  5. antitoxicgamer

    antitoxicgamer Jedi Padawan star 2

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    Sep 9, 2020
    I remember reading somewhere that some of Han's dialogues were moved to Greedo scene when the Jabba's scene was cut.
     
  6. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord 9X Hangman Winner & 4X Wacky Wednesday Winner star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    At least in the novel, there is less redundancy:


    "Going somewhere, Solo?"
    The Corellian couldn't identify the voice, coming as it did through an electronic translator. But there was no problem recognizing the speaker or the gun it held stuck in Solo's side.
    The creature was roughly man-sized and bipedal, but its head was something out of delirium by way of an upset stomach. It had huge, dull-faceted eyes, bulbous on a pea-green face.
    A ridge of short spines crested the high skull, while nostrils and mouth were contained in a tapir-like snout.
    "As a matter of fact," Solo replied slowly, "I was just on my way to see your boss. You can tell Jabba I've got the money I owe him."
    "That's what you said yesterday—and last week—and the week prior to that. It's too late, Solo. I'm not going back to Jabba with another one of your stories."
    "But I've really got the money this time!" Solo protested.
    "Fine. I'll take it now, please."
    Solo sat down slowly. Jabba's minions were apt to be cursed with nervous trigger fingers. The alien took the seat across from him, the muzzle of the ugly little pistol never straying from Solo's chest.
    "I haven't got it here with me. Tell Jabba—"
    "It's too late, I think. Jabba would rather have your ship."
    "Over my dead body," Solo said unamiably.
    The alien was not impressed. "If you insist. Will you come outside with me, or must I finish it here?"
    "I don't think they'd like another killing in here," Solo pointed out.
    Something which might have been a laugh came from the creature's translator.
    "They'd hardly notice. Get up, Solo. I've been looking forward to this for a long time. You've embarrassed me in front of Jabba with your pious excuses for the last time."
    "I think you're right."
    Light and noise filled the little corner of the cantina, and when it had faded, all that remained of the unctuous alien was a smoking, slimy spot on the stone floor.
    Solo brought his hand and the smoking weapon it held out from beneath the table, drawing bemused stares from several of the cantina's patrons and clucking sounds from its more knowledgeable members. They had known the creature committed its fatal mistake in allowing Solo the chance to get his hands undercover.
    "It'll take a lot more than the likes of you to finish me off. Jabba the Hutt always did skimp when it came to hiring his hands."
    Leaving the booth, Solo flipped the bartender a handful of coins as he and Chewbacca moved off. "Sorry for the mess. I always was a rotten host."


    ...


    "Han, my boy, there are times when you disappoint me. I merely wish to know why you haven't paid me ... as you should have long ago. And why did you have to fry poor Greedo like that? After all you and I have been through together?"
    Solo grinned tightly. "Shove it, Jabba. There isn't enough sentiment in your body to warm an orphaned bacterium. As for Greedo, you sent him to kill me."
    "Why, Han," Jabba protested in surprise. "Why would I do that? You're the best smuggler in the business. You're too valuable to fry. Greedo was only relaying my natural concern at your delays. He wasn't going to kill you."
    "I think he thought he was. Next time don't send one of those hired twerps. If you've got something to say, come and say it yourself."

    Jabba shook his head and his jowls shook — lazy, fleshy echoes of his mock sorrow. "Han, Han—if only you hadn't had to dump that shipment of spice! You understand … I just can't make an exception. Where would I be if every pilot who smuggled for me dumped his shipment at the first sign of an Imperial warship? And then simply showed empty pockets when I demanded recompense? It's not good business. I can be generous and forgiving—but not to the point of bankruptcy."
    "You know, even I get boarded sometimes, Jabba. Did you think I dumped that spice because I got tired of its smell? I wanted to deliver it as much as you wanted to receive it. I had no choice." Again the sardonic smile. "As you say, I'm too valuable to fry. But I've got a charter now and I can pay you back, plus a little extra. I just need some more time. I can give you a thousand on account, the rest in three weeks."
    The gross form seemed to consider, then directed his next words not to Solo but to his hirelings. "Put your blasters away." His gaze and a predatory smile turned to the wary Corellian.
    "Han, my boy, I'm only doing this because you're the best and I'll need you again sometime. So, out of the greatness of my soul and a forgiving heart—and for an extra, say, twenty percent—I'll give you a little more time." The voice nearly cracked with restraint. "But this is the last time. If you disappoint me again, if you trample my generosity in your mocking laughter, I'll put a price on your head so large you won't be able to go near a civilized system for the rest of your life, because on every one your name and face will be known to men who'll gladly cut your guts out for one-tenth of what I'll promise them."
    "I'm glad we both have my best interests at heart," replied Solo pleasantly as he and Chewbacca started past the staring eyes of the Hutt's hired guns. "Don't worry, Jabba, I'll pay you. But not because you threaten me. I'll pay you because…it's my pleasure."


    Compare to


    Going somewhere, Solo?

    "Yes, Greedo, as a matter of fact I was just going to see your boss. Tell Jabba that I've got his money."
    It's too late, you should have paid him when you had the chance. Jabba's put a price on your head so large every bounty hunter in the galaxy will be looking for you. I'm lucky I found you first.
    "Yeah, but this time I've got the money."
    If you give it to me, I might forget I found you.
    "I don't have it with me. Tell Jabba--"
    Jabba's through with you. He has no time for smugglers who drop their shipments at the first sign of an Imperial cruiser.
    "Even I get boarded sometimes. Do you think I had a choice?"
    You can tell that to Jabba. He may only take your ship.
    "Over my dead body."
    That's the idea. I've been looking forward to this for a long time.
    "Yes, I'll bet you have."

    The underlined bits in the movie version, aren't in the book version of the Greedo scene, but are in the book version of the Jabba scene.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
  7. StardustSoldier

    StardustSoldier Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Jun 24, 2019
    I never hated the SE or anything. It was the 1997 versions that I grew up with as a kid; at the time I didn't even really know about the changes. Only as the years went by that I gradually learned about them.
    This is similar to how I feel. It's not influenced by my feelings about the PT (which I like) for me either. But as far as the OT is concerned, I think overall I am more partial to the original versions these days. Although a few of the SE changes I do think were a genuine improvement, and there is a part of me that wishes we could've still retained those few changes. But most of the changes, even the ones I dislike, aren't that big of a deal to me. My issue is less with the altered versions in themselves, and moreso the fact that the original versions aren't officially available any more.
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2020
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  8. darthfettus2015

    darthfettus2015 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 15, 2012
    i was managing a cinema at the time and was just overjoyed to be showing the films a seminal moment for me.. changes never bothered me.. some i preferred
     
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  9. oierem

    oierem Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 18, 2009
    That's exactly right: Han's line "even I get boarded at times... do you think I had a choice?" is directly lifted from the Jabba scene, and you can even tell the audio difference if you listen closely.

    Cloud City was never meant to be claustrophobic. It was just a result of reusing the same set over and over again and not being able to use mate paintings. But even then, Lucas (I think, gotta check that) lamented how Cloud City turned out.


    My opinion about the changes... is that it's not such a big deal! Fans make a big fuzz out of the SE, but the truth is that 95% of the movies are still exactly the same. The editing and lenght of the movies hardly changes at all. There is literally one added scene. There are mostly cosmetic changes, and I like most (if not all) of them.
     
  10. StardustSoldier

    StardustSoldier Jedi Knight star 1

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    Jun 24, 2019
    Vader's added "Noooo!!", the Han/Greedo thing, and (to a lesser extent) "Jedi Rocks" were the only changes that legitimately bothered me. Most of the others I thought were for the better, or else I was largely indifferent to. Again I prefer the original versions overall, but they're still great movies no matter what. :)
     
  11. Alexrd

    Alexrd Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2009
    Not just Lucas, but Kershner as well:

     
  12. oierem

    oierem Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 18, 2009
    I watched the SE of ANH before the original version, so none of the changes bothered me at all - in fact, when I finally watched the original version, I found some of the effects really dated.
    I watched the original versions of Empire and Jedi many many times before the SE, so the changes were noticeable, but I remember liking most of them. I did miss the original Ewok celebration song (because I really liked the original) but I really like the new version as well, so, no harm done.
     
  13. antitoxicgamer

    antitoxicgamer Jedi Padawan star 2

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    Sep 9, 2020
    I never had any problem with the special editions.

    George Lucas kept making them because they were quite profitable and when your product is profitable then it means that fans like more.(Similar to Transformers movies that are so successful that they have made lots of movies for it in the past decade.)

    And internet backlash didn't mean anything for him. Since internet loves to hate everything popular.(Similar to the way that internet loves to hate Call Of Duty, GTA , Cyberpunk , Fortnite, FIFA etc.)
     
  14. FightoftheForgotten

    FightoftheForgotten Jedi Knight star 4

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    May 19, 2020
    SE's never bothered me. Lucas refusing to release restorations of the originals is what bothered me. The fans have since stepped up to the plate and now I have the originals in 1080p so I'm good now. I did see those laserdisc versions released in 2008 as a middle finger to the fans though.

    tl:dr Never hated the SE's but I did sort of grow to dislike Lucas.
     
  15. Darth Caliban

    Darth Caliban Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 2015
    No. Maybe i would think differently about this issue, if the OOT would finally get a decent release on Bluray.

    But maybe not.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2020
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  16. CampOfSorgan

    CampOfSorgan Jedi Master star 4

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    Apr 27, 2020
    Really don't like the SE change in TESB where Luke screams as he falls. Doesn't make any sense and sounds absolutely horrendous.

    Don't like Vader's temperamental "Bring my shuttle" being changed to the boring and overly elaborate "Alert my Star Destroyer to prepare for my arrival" either.
     
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  17. StardustSoldier

    StardustSoldier Jedi Knight star 1

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    Jun 24, 2019
    ^Oh, I forgot about those ones. Not the worst changes for me, but yeah, I agree with you there.
     
  18. Samuel Vimes

    Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Sep 4, 2012
    As some other have said, I don't mind the SE all that much. The lack of a proper release of the OOT is more of an issue.

    A few of the changes/additions are improvements, some a neutral, neither good nor bad and some are detriments.

    And some seem really pointless. Like removing "You are lucky you don't taste very good."
    Why remove that? I have read that the original audio had degraded but Lucafilm has some of the best people in the business, could they not fix it?
    Or how hard would it be to call Mark Hamill back and re-record the line?
    And some things seem done really cheap and fast. Like pasting Hayden into RotJ. Taking stuff from a costume fitting and not even telling him about it.
    He had to find out through the press.

    Bye for now.
    Old Stoneface.
     
  19. christophero30

    christophero30 Chosen One star 8

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    May 18, 2017
    I didn't know that about Hayden.
     
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  20. StardustSoldier

    StardustSoldier Jedi Knight star 1

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    Jun 24, 2019
    One SE change I do have a level of affection for is Obi-Wan's Krayt Dragon call from the 2011 Blu-ray version. It has got to be one of the most unintentionally funny things in all of Star Wars, but I love it for that reason. :p
     
  21. ezekiel22x

    ezekiel22x Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2002
    Never disliked them. I’ve went back and forth on some changes, though. I think I’m back to preferring the Ewok song over the SE update, although I still love the added planets and celebrations. I didn’t like Jabba in ANH for a long time but now it’s a little scene I look forward to while watching the film.

    Also I need to give a shoutout to the LaserDisc transfers. O-OT in all its less than pristine glory is a real nostalgic treat. Takes me back to the days when it was just about immersing one’s self into those three movies, and not so much anything about the ongoing fandom and all that comes with it.
     
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  22. SlashMan

    SlashMan Jedi Master star 4

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    Feb 5, 2012
    That was more or less how the scene was shot.

    This is one case where the pickup shots were added with the specific intent and knowledge that the Jabba scene was already deleted. The same thing was done when the introduction to General Grievous was redone for the final cut in Revenge of the Sith; the original deleted sequence could not be seamlessly added back in because of continuity errors and redundancy.

    Despite this, I actually loved the Jabba scene's inclusion in the Special Edition for what it was. There was no such thing as bonus features at the time, and contrary to revisionist history, the shiny new additions to the Special Editions offered further incentive to see the films again in theaters (having already been widely available on VHS by that time). The resentment to the SE really only started after the prequel hate was in vogue. This really became compounded when with the format change to DVD, the original versions of the film no longer were widely available. I think this has hurt the SE versions by preventing them from being judged on their own merits, and instead often being a scapegoat for the frustration over lack of original releases.

    I'd also add I was never a SE hater, but I go back and forth on a few things. I find that just about any super fan will have their own "choose your adventure" style preferences for which versions of scenes they prefer (my friend is a diehard Jedi Rocks fan).
     
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  23. Darth Caliban

    Darth Caliban Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 17, 2015
    The only change from the SE that i really like is the victory celebration at the end of ROTJ.

    But i still kinda miss Yub Nub.

    Maybe showing the victory celebration scene after the original ending before the credits would have been a better solution
     
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  24. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host star 9 VIP - Game Host

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    Nov 20, 2012
    I don't like any of the changes. I used to when I was young and full of joy, but now that I'm old and full of mold, I hate everything about it. I write angry letters to George Lucas every single day. In cursive.
     
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  25. StardustSoldier

    StardustSoldier Jedi Knight star 1

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    Jun 24, 2019
    Agreed, Darth Caliban. I loved seeing all the other planets celebrating as well, but as far as the songs go, I am a bit more partial to Yub Nub.
     
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