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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Amph Better Call Saul (Spoilers within)

Discussion in 'Community' started by Jabbadabbado, Jan 12, 2015.

  1. Rew

    Rew Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 22, 2008
    So in case anyone's wondering who my cousin is, he was the skinny balding guy at Jimmy McGill's reinstatement hearing (the same one whom Jimmy later ran down and confronted on the stairs). Y'know--the guy possibly responsible for finalizing Jimmy's transformation into Saul Goodman. :p (His name is Michael Lanahan, and he even has his own IMDB page. He was in an episode of The Office a few years ago, as well as Life in Pieces.)
     
  2. Reynar_Tedros

    Reynar_Tedros Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 3, 2006
    I'm sure I wasn't the only one who noticed how similar the "Wiedersehen" written in yellow paint on the rock wall looked to the "Heisenberg" spray painted inside the White house at the end of Breaking Bad.

    This episode was outstanding. Jimmy and Kim's confrontation on the parking garage roof is up there with the series' best scenes. Bob and Rhea killed it.
     
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  3. Bob Saget from the 90's

    Bob Saget from the 90's Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Aug 27, 2018
    That is an interesting callback I didn't think of. For a second I thought the writing was something written in German by Kai, and that him and Mike were executing a plan to "accidentally" blow up Werner to resolve the loose end of his interactions at the bar. But that is kinda stupid and this show is smarter than that. Having Werner run off under Mike's watch will necessitate a response from Mike, one that has to be done to show Gus that Mike is his man through and through.

    Jimmy and Kim, whoa. Who knew that Saul Goodman was largely based upon's Jimmy own insecurities that he can't seem to shake. Yes he enjoys being a criminal and getting one over on people; and he likes the money who doesn't but really he just can't seem to shake the negative perception which his brother held for him. Which brings up an intriguing question. Did Chuck see Jimmy for what he really is, or does Chuck's feelings regarding Jimmy manifest itself in Jimmy's own actions? Both? And now he is transferring those emotions to Kim. Its all over now, there relationship. You can't come back from that much hurtful truth, but of course Jimmy and Kim will try to, making it even more tragic.

    This has been by far the best season of this show. Were in the endgame now.
     
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  4. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    The earlier misgivings Mike had about Kai were apparently an intentional misdirection by the show... this show and BB excel at that. Kai is fine; the problem with the crew turned out to be Werner himself. It's really a shame because Werner is a smart and nice guy who took this job out of love for engineering challenges and a huge payday. Mike liked him and they had a level of respect for each other. Werner getting too excited talking about engineering to strangers after having too many beers was the first sign of this potential problem, but really the biggest issue with him was there anyway; he has told Mike multiple times that this job is taking longer than expected, and he really misses his wife. It's really a shame now that Mike will have to catch him now before he leaves the country and prove to Gus that he can contain problems.
     
  5. DarthTunick

    DarthTunick SFTC VII + Deadpool BOFF star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 26, 2000




    That right there encapsulates Lalo's presence thus far; love that reaction from Nacho.


    -Conspiracy theory I like: Werner's conversation with his wife included some coded language that either forshadowed his escape, or aided it somehow.


    -The brief look of rage on Mike's face when he picks up Werner's letter in the trailer... incredible.


    -Jimmy & Kim are just sincere enough with each other to ensure that Jimmy will get back into practicing the law, no matter the emotional damage.


    -Hector's bell gets an interesting backstory!
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
  6. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    Yes, that gesture from Nacho was a perfect way of him responding to Gus' look. Gus isn't even annoyed with Nacho, since he knows Lalo didn't give Nacho a choice about going to the restaurant.
     
  7. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    I know what the last couple of questions were hinting at Jimmy's review board hearing; especially the part of "how inspired you?" And then of course Jimmy didn't reference Chuck but instead said, "Go Land Crabs!" I knew he blew his reinstatement right there. It's one of those instances where a person is not sorry in their part of an incident, but rather sorry they got caught and punished. Jimmy didn't lament or show any regret that caused Chuck to have a meltdown in court.

    I remember a scene where Chuck blamed Jimmy for there father's business failing because Jimmy was taking money from the register.

    And in the video clip below, Chuck tells Jimmy why he shouldn't be a lawyer, which is his antics and always looking to take the easy way out. Moreover, that the law is sacred and Jimmy really doesn't value it, and therefore people will get hurt.



    Yes, some of those insecure feelings that Jimmy had with Chuck had carried over into this relationship with Kim, and thus his need to have Kim share an office with him as it's a form of security and trust. It also carries the weight of professional respect and seeing each other as peers, which Chuck did not.

    But Kim, the ever loving and caring person, is still committed to Jimmy and is on his side, despite knowing that Jimmy blew his reinstatement hearing because he refused to be remorseful or show any consideration regarding Chuck.

    I like this Lalo character. He's very ominous. So much so, that Gus has a look of concern. There are very few characters that would be a cause for concern for Gus. So, there's a definite chess match that started between the two and Nacho will have to play his part as the pond. I do wonder about the conversation Lalo and Hector had regarding Gus. If Hector actually heard Gus talking to him while he was in the hospital.

    I do believe Werner's near death experience during the mishap of disconnected wires for the detonation caused him to want to see his wife. I'm sure they'll catch him in the next episode and he'll be a loose end that was tied up.
     
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  8. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    I wondered about that, but it's not like it's really a two-way conversation. Hector can't tell Lalo what Gus said to him. All he could do would be to ring the bell if Lalo actually asked him "did Gus visit your room and threaten you?".
     
  9. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    True. But at the end of the scene, Lalo comes out saying something to the effect of "Same old Hector wanting to kill everyone." Some how Hector communicated that he wanted certain people dead.
     
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  10. 3sm1r

    3sm1r Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2017
    Very cool episode.
    The only thing I don't like is Kim starting that path. She broke my heart, I preferred her before.
     
  11. TiniTinyTony

    TiniTinyTony JCC Super Bowl Pick 'Em Winner star 7 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Mar 9, 2003
    I wondered if Werner was even married as he doesn't wear his ring on his left hand. A fact I noticed in last week's episode. But then I googled and German men wear their wedding ring on their right hand so no theories from me.
     
  12. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Sep 13, 2007
    I hope Mike finds a way to not kill Werner if he catches him, while still retaining Gus’ confidence. I’m not sure how, but I just hope there’s a way. Mike has his own code of justice, so to speak, and I think killing Werner (a good man who misses his wife, and who is not “in the business”) might be too much for Mike to be OK with.
     
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  13. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    By Breaking Bad Mike was an outright monster-- doing whatever Gustavo Fring told him to do and shrugging off his boss's own monstrous deeds (e.g., Victor's death, threatening to kill an infant, manufacturing a highly addictive and dangerous stimulant). He may have rationalized it by labeling all of his victims bad people, but I wouldn't be surprised if something happened to Werner and/or his wife perhaps at the hands of another henchman like Tyrus.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
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  14. Diggy

    Diggy Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2013
    As far as where the characters end up, I think Mike is further away than Jimmy. Offing Werner will give him a nice boost, even though he’ll rationalize it per his code.

    On Jimmy/Chuck I think Chuck saw Jimmy for he really was, and didn’t create the monster. Unintentionally fed it, but didn’t create it. A big part of that was his outright jealousy of Jimmy, plus Chuck did love a bit of control and to push buttons.

    Having said that, I bet Chuck would have loved a straight as an arrow brother, which Jimmy never was.
     
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  15. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    Mike's gonna murder the bejesus outta the poor runaway German! He had to turn way more evil eventually, he doesn't have the level of decency in Breaking Bad that he does in Better Call Saul.

    The bell bit was good but felt one of the more prequel-y explain the origin of something scenes that this show tends to shy away from. But every once in awhile going full explain something fanservice isn't the worst thing ever.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
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  16. yankee8255

    yankee8255 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    May 31, 2005
    Just dropping in for my annual reminder that we hate Chuck because deep down we know that he's right about Jimmy.
     
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  17. Harpua

    Harpua Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2005
    Mike pretty much became a "monster" when his son was killed. He simply doesn't give a **** about anything but making money to support his family. He'll do anything, because he has nothing to lose.
     
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  18. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

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    Sep 19, 2002
    I did like Kim the way she was before but I also found it to be a very good and unexpected twist. Myself and I think many others expected Kim to somehow break Jimmy's heart which sends him down the Saul Goodman path. But having Kim play an active role of turning Jimmy into Saul Goodman I think can be much more interesting even if kinda wrecks our liking Kim so much.
     
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  19. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Sep 13, 2007
    Thinking about the Mike discussion some more, I'm still not convinced that he's a "monster" in the traditional sense that absolutely nothing is off-limits. I still think he has that code of justice that I mentioned before. He's ruthless, yes, and becomes more so during BB, but I can't think of any time when he kills or hurts anyone who is not a "bad" person that is "in the business"... everyone is a dealer, a hitman, etc. (and that includes the corrupt cops who killed his son). So I still think that Werner falls outside of that acceptable range for him, even though Werner broke his trust by running. He'll have to find some way to take care of the situation and not lose Gus' confidence in him. Should be interesting.
     
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  20. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    I never considered Mike a "monster" even in Breaking Bad. He definitely was the "muscle" and "enforcer" but not a monster. And what I mean by that is, never doled out any punishment or violence that wasn't warranted. He's a person that could be reasoned with, as demonstrated throughout Better Call Saul. If Werner meets his fate, it was his own fault as he was warned and knows what kind of people he's in business with. Werner escaping knew he was taking a chance with his life. So, if he dies, he dies.

    As for Kim, I knew her next con with Jimmy would be a "victimless" crime. I'm sure she'll get another Mesa Verde award for getting the Lubbock, Texas branch blue prints approved.
     
  21. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    what was Kim doodling on her coffee mug? "2nd Best Lawyer Again" or something? I think selling out to Mesa Verde has really done a number on her where she almost wants to do crazy stuff. Also she won Mesa Verdre pretty much over Chuck's dead body so may be some guilt there.

    But Werner is dead meat I'm thinking. It'll be like when poor Jessie had to cap whatshisname under orders from Walt. this is a big piece of Mike's soul going away probably.
     
  22. Reynar_Tedros

    Reynar_Tedros Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 3, 2006
    No half measures.

    It was a celebratory gift for Jimmy, as was the briefcase engraved with his initials, assuming of course he would be reinstated. She was referring to the cup she gave him in season two that said World's 2nd Best Lawyer, jokingly inferring of course that she is the first. The "again" part is because he's getting reinstated, or so they think.

    I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Chuck is threatened by Jimmy, envious even, and knows that when his younger brother puts his mind to something, he can do anything he wants using a combination of his intelligence (which Chuck has) and charm (which Chuck lacks). Jimmy wants to be a great lawyer like the brother he so admired since childhood, but Chuck loves being top dog and exploits the flaws in Jimmy's character to ensure he continues being his own worst enemy. Chuck was obviously a deeply flawed character himself. I hated him because he was wrong about Jimmy, and did everything he could to make himself right. The tragedy is that he succeeds.
     
  23. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    I think Chuck was "right" about Jimmy in that that's the person his brother was when Chuck bailed him out and took him to Albuquerque. But beyond getting him a mail room job he did nothing to help Jimmy become a better person and actively sabotaged his attempts. Both brothers are deeply insecure especially with regards to each other.
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2018
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  24. 3sm1r

    3sm1r Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Dec 27, 2017
    Yeah that was brilliant. I was really convinced that Kai would be killed in zero time. I am positively surprised.

    @Luke02
    I agree, I'm sure they will give me something that is way better than what I hope/expect, as usual. It's what I love of the show: things don't go as I would tell, but still I'm always satisfied.
     
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  25. Darth Chiznuk

    Darth Chiznuk Superninja of Future Films star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 31, 2012
    So in the end I think it was Lalo who sealed Werner's fate. Werner is a loose end that Gus can't have around because Lalo can track him down and find out what Gus is doing. And Werner would end up dead anyway. Mike knows Gus is right too. He tries to change his mind for Werner's sake but knows he can't be left alive.

    And Saul Goodman has arrived! ^:)^