ST Can we talk about the vision?

I think this better explains what I meant. The saber is not a sentient being, but it belongs to the more worthy individual. We've certainly seen plenty of examples in literature of a weapon that can only be wielded by a certain individual.

 

The Force is manifestating it's will through the saber.

 

I like this way of explaining things. There really isn't any president for inanimate objects in Star Wars having a will of their own.

 

That vision was pretty packed. They could make an entire spin off film just from that vision.

 

I really like that way of thinking.

 

Which in its way weakens the physical explanations of the Force in the prequels.

 

Why? The force exerted its will through the midichlorians as well. Not sure I see a big disconnect. There was never a physical explanation of the force, merely an explanation of how the force made connections to living beings.

 

Just thought I'd bring up two issues, in case they haven't been discussed already:

Firstly, does anybody here know the mysterious dialogue (which sounds kind of like Obi-Wan Kenobi talking through a microphone) during Rey's vision, just as Kylo Ren kills the "warrior" with his red lightsaber?

This occurs at (time) 1:05:59 - 1:06:03 on my iTunes copy of The Force Awakens. I can't make it out using headphones. I'm just wondering if anyone else will have any better luck...

Secondly, what are everyone's thoughts about the "red light" that whoever drops Rey off on Jakku flies towards?

 

it's the starkiller eating the sun in the future. right after this she sees kylo in the snowy forest.

 

I don't know. It doesn't quite match up with...




If anything, the "red glow" appears to be closer to Han's large freighter/ship. But still, there's room for doubt...

 

you're kidding right? the vision is after han's ship. the vision here.



what happens. the sun disappears in the same shape and then everything turns red.



the sun disappears and the light turns dark, dark red. there is no debate.

 

It matches quite well with this shot, though:

 

I took a listen, and while it's hard to tell, you could be onto something. This is actually my very first post on JCF (!) - I generally live over on Tumblr, and had just ventured over here to see what the world looks like from another vantage point in the fandom. I mentioned your idea about the "whisper" to folks over there and people found it quite interesting. Someone created an enhanced audio file amplifying the moment you noted, and... you still can't really tell what's being said, or who is saying it, but there was lively conversation about what it might be.

 

I went back and looked at this part of the vision again, and I think you are right. We hear the sound of Kylo Ren's light saber turning on before the "clan leader"/KOR is killed, its crackle in the shot of the whole group in the rain, and then we hear the sound of it powering down as he turns towards Rey and advances on her. Nice find.

 

This is huge, can we have the precise minute:second where this can be heard?

 

There's a fellow underneath the orb. Looks suspiciously like this guy:

 

Now that we're nearly six months out from the initial release of the film, and have the benefit of the different TFA novelizations and the DVD release to look at and analyze, I'm curious; does anyone interpret the scene of Kylo Ren and the Knights of Ren in the rain as potentially being a scene from the future, not the past? Now that we know (courtesy of Bloodline) that Ben Solo turned sometime around age 23, how are people interpreting the knowledge of Rey's abandonment on Jakku as a very young child? Clearly the two events were separated in time, given the respective ages of the characters.

Looking back to the beginning of the posts on this topic, I see that people were immediately assuming that the "rain" scene in the vision was a rendering of whatever happened to end Luke's Jedi training project (and have assumed it was a massacre), and that Rey being abandoned on Jakku was connected to this event (the general feeling being that she was a survivor of said massacre). If the two events actually happened as much as nine years apart, what are the current theories about what the vision is showing us?

In reading people's posts here, it is interesting to me to see that the general belief seems to be that the Force vision is showing us glimpses of Rey's backstory. I have interpreted it as being at least as much about Ben Solo/Kylo Ren's backstory. Examples: Alan Dean Foster's novelization includes Rey seeing Ben as a young boy at the end of the corridor in the beginning of the vision (this was not in the film), we see Kylo and the Knights in the rain, and we see a foreshadowing of Kylo in the snow fight.

A simple side-by-side comparison of the "mystery box" in Maz's basement with the one Obi-Wan has in ANH tells us the two are not one and the same. I think I know whose box it was, but I'm new here and don't know the rules well. Since I don't know what level of speculation is acceptable, I'll refrain from saying any more.

 

Considering that the Vision was added by a request of Rian Johnson, I say it could / most probably is the future.

The vision also had some things that would happen in TFA later on, like the lightsaber fight in the snow.

 

- that's interesting! I hadn't heard that the whole vision bit was coming from Rian Johnson. Do you have a source for that? I'd love to see it. I've interpreted the whole vision as a literal rendering of one of JJ Abrams' "Mystery Boxes," and have written quite a bit about it on my blog.

 

Is it true you can hear Palpatine screaming in the background?

 

yes and "any jedi".

 

Guess I have to watch it again.

 

http://www.wired.com/2015/11/star-wars-force-awakens-jj-abrams-interview/

Rian has asked for a couple of things here and there that he needs for his story.

http://www.slashfilm.com/how-j-j-ab...aborated-to-create-the-future-of-star-wars/2/


Does Rian Johnson read the Force Awakens script and give notes, suggesting changes or additions for things he maybe wants to seed early for his film? Abrams says the process was somewhat collaborative:

There were a handful of things we talked about that were going to be helpful to him. Some were very easy to do, and some things were things that I didn’t want to do for other reasons, but I tried to be as accommodating as I could. And its so cool to see what happens next in a way that only someone as talented as Rian could do.​

 

Thanks for the links. I'd seen excerpts from the Wired interview but hadn't read the whole thing. I didn't see references to the vision scene in particular, but it was great to get a sense of how much Johnson saw and interacted with Abrams when TFA was being made. I've looked at that from the other side (Johnson's) in a way. Here's a link to Rian Johnson's interview in a Filmspotting podcast from 8/1/14 (his bit starts at about the 35 minute mark): https://secure-hwcdn.libsyn.com/p/f...65868279&hwt=627cb0e5917d545a0c94fd224c66ebdd

 

I assumed it was the past and was part of his temple massacre. But it may have been the future. I think Pablo clarified awhile back that the guy that gets cut down was just a warrior, not a Jedi, which made me second guess the Temple attack. I still assumed it was a past event. I guess I never considered it being the future.

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