ST C'mon, Let's Keep a Little Optimism Here - The Gusher's Sanctuary

I love the fact 8 is subversive and cynical and 9 is kiychen sink star wars on steroids

 

Yes, it has the same rhythm to me as TESB leading up to ROTJ.

 

Long-term, it will be Rian Johnson’s entry that history is most favorable to. Not only because of how IX smoothed out the end messages he was exploring but didn’t quite nail for enough people, or because of how Poe’s leadership arc leads places, or how Reylo leads places, or because of how Rey’s parents chose to become nobodies who sold her to protect her, or because seeing Luke in IX on Ahch-To bury the hatchet with Rey helps make his arc in VIII smoother, but because it’s the most critically acclaimed of the 3 from a rising writer/director who is continuing to win over more fans to his subversive take on story, genre dissection, thematic exploration, and character.

The Rise of Skywalker helps make The Last Jedi seems even more pivotal a turning point in the discovery of who Rey won’t be related to (Luke) and where the dynamic between Rey & Ben will move to than it did now. Luke’s final words to Ben related to Han literally happen and Leia becomes the force mentor to Rey VIII suggested she could be.

VII & IX will be the most fun to the most people the way ANH & ROTJ are but VIII will remain the entry best positioned to grow in respect and acclaim long-term the way Empire did now that the saga is over and as critics long-term continue to build lists and influence the narratives for the future generations of film goers and Disney + streamers who will be wondering which of the 3 have the most artistic merit and decided what the main dynamic between the light sider and dark sider would be while providing the first hints of a possible grandparental reveal ahead.

 

I hear a lot of fans calling TLJ and TROS "a mess" but I think over time people will see just how carefully these movies were made. It's clear that, on the whole, the ST was supposed to please fans and make money, but the fact they let Rian Johnson create such a challenging, unexpected middle chapter shows that Lucasfilm still actually cares about art and filmmaking.

 

My only issue with TLJ is it didn't really have a cliff hanger. It was a good movie. And maybe if Johnson directs the next one it would flow from it better. But I don't think it did a great job on what happens next. I mean in some ways maybe it did, but then Abrams really doesn't run with those themes he almost starts a new movie. I don't know if it will ever be known but there had to be a basic outline for this trilogy . I would think. Love to know if they got anywhere close to doing it.

 

This is so depressing.

Save the cliff hangers for TV shows. Movies should be resolved.

 

Yea but I don't think so in a trilogy like this. Cliffhanger might not be the right word. But I think it should have set up the next movie better. Although I guess the next movie could be to blame for that. I just know at the end of TLJ I was like ok, we are sort of back to neutral here. Rey is powerful. Ben is mad. Not an awful ending but nothing that really had you jumping for part 3.

 

The biggest problem with TLJ was that it didn't commit to the ideas it introduced, it offers them but goes nowhere with them. By the end of the movie the status quo is reset to the end of TFA.

With TROS they were forced to commit because it was the finale and they were always going to take more flack for that.

 

I am sure that time will be gracious to the ST even more than it was to the PT.

 

I guess if we've heard Palp's maniac laughter at the end of TLJ, it probably would have given us an idea where we are heading with it.

 

Whoop. Guess you didn't like Empire?

 

Guys this isn't the TLJ forum or thread. This is TROS, lets keep it about that. Thnx!

 

edited - off topic

 

I thought it was pretty interesting that Rey is closest to turning to the dark side when Ben Solo is at his most "light" at any point in the trilogy.
The yin yang thing. Push-pull. Powerful light, powerful dark. I wonder if the "swap" was intentional.


More generally I thought the visuals for the action scenes in this film were top notch. Gave me a thrill at least.

Another little detail; what do you guys make of the music used when Rey is in the ruined throne room - it is Anakin's unmasking scene music.

 

That's actually one of my favorite moments because that music immediately took me to ROTJ and I felt the connection with Vader and Luke and Vader's own redemption. John Williams was a genius to use that music there.

 

True, I vaguely thought similar.
That music was always a little eery despite being a happier scene. Fitting.
The climactic duel begins there in both films as well.

Also notice Kylo gets stabbed with the same saber he stabbed Han with.
Han when he is reaching out to Kylo on Leia's request, Kylo by his own saber when Leia reaches out to him again.

Trippy.

 

Just saw it a second time and I loved it even more. It's my favorite of the sequel trilogy.

"There are more of us, Poe. There are more of us!"

 

Yeah, the music is very haunting. It's hauntingly beautiful. It has an air of tragedy to it, but there's some softness to it too. It's the first time Luke gets to see his father. It's the first time Rey sees the place where it all happened. As I said, JW is a genius!

 

Well said.
To be honest, JW's music is probably the biggest reason I became such a big fan of ROTS in '05.
It really sells the narrative, it is such an enhancer.


On the general thread topic, what are the theories on Leia disappearing the same time as Ben Solo? Was she attached to him and giving him the strength to be "Ben" that whole time?

 

My theory is that she fought to stay in an inbetween phase between death and the force afterlife as long as she possibly could sensing that Ben would die but be in a position to join the light when he did and wanted to help make sure he had a spiritual guide to make it there and that both found each other and went together as mother and son.

 

One of the reasons I have embraced and love Rey as Palpatine’s Granddaughter is how close she comes to the dark side. Much more than Luke ever did. Those sequences of her and Kylo at the remains of the Death Star are incredible. Daisy is amazing! The vision of fighting Darth Rey is payoff of seeing her own reflection in her vision in TLJ. Or the drama and shock of Rey releasing lightning. None of those scenes would have happened if she was really a “Nobody”.

 

“They chose to be nobodies. They sold you to protect you... from him.”

The ultimate build off of the VIII reveal. Love it. It works nicely with what was revealed and makes it feel like a partial truth but now we get the big reveal.

 

Her anger during her training when Kylo seems to interfere was fairly intense.

 

That is a good point, that works.

But what about the "drinking money" part?

 

Of course that's what Plutt would have been told.