Did Depa have it right? (Shatterpoint spoilers)

Basically, was Depa's basic philosophy more correct than that of the rest of the Jedi? Do the ends justify the means (drop a bomb on Geonosis and kill Dooku and the other Rebel leaders, along with Anakin and Padmé and Obi-Wan), or to go and try to rescue three individuals and allow a war to break out that would engulf the galaxy?

Now, the Jedi had no way of knowing exactly how things would fall out for certain, either way, but wouldn?t losing three innocent lives (even when one is possibly the Chosen One) be worth the chance of preventing galactic warfare? Or was Mace right in the end when he says that in his dreams he now does everything right, exactly as he had actually done?

 

Realistically, yes. But it's the whole problem of "To defeat the enemy, we must become the enemy." Jedi have ideals, and if they sacrificed them to win, then they'd cease to be Jedi. It's Mace's whole "I don't have to win, only to fight" thing - he's just got to do what's right, and do it on his own terms. If he fails, he fails, but he will have done the right thing, and that's what's important. If he were to win his objective by sacrificing who he is, he'd have lost.

 

I agree with Mace. The reason I feel this way is because say they did drop a bomb on the arena, thus killing Dooku, and Jango, plus Obi Wan, Padme and the Chosen One, Anakin. Yes that might have stopped the war right there. But the main bad guy would still be around in Palpatine, and he would just figure a way to get what he wanted anyway.

Now if this were done, you would still have the bad guy take over the galaxy and you wouldnt have a Chosen One to stop him.

So Depa was wrong, and Mace is right.

 

But oh, the irony if the trio had not survived

 

I think that Mastage is right, but I don't agree with the tactics of that, to fight someone, you have to strip off yr ideals. With bombing Geonosis, it might have ended the war, but what if it didn't?

 

I agree with JediTrilobite to a point. It would only have delayed the inevitable, because Palpatine/Darth Sidious would still be alive, and he was pulling the strings throughout the enitre Clone Wars. He would have found another apprentice and another means of decimating the Jedi Order to a more manageable number for him to deal with personally.

 

Plus, they'd be loosing several key Jedi, like the Choosen One and a senator.

If a bomb were to be dropped, it would also be horrible for public relations, which the Jedi don't need. It would get on the news that the Jedi bombed a 'sports' areana, two Jedi and a senator. Palpatine might have made the claim that the Jedi were wanting a war to fight in, and then removing their political powers.

 

No Depa didn't have it right. She wasn't thinking as a Jedi.

That whole scheme of thinking is like Anakin's thinking, and its no wonder he ended up as Darth Vader.

Its a catch 22 situation, you're damned if you do, damned if you don't.
The important thing is whether the Jedi themselves are confident that what happened was the right decision.
And by Mace's conclusion it seems he believes it was the right decision.

 

When you get right to it utiltarianism is a philosophy of war, either that or it is a philosophy well-suited to war. It isn't one that fits the Jedi ideals, which Depa gave up on.

What I am very happy to see is the recognition, finally, in SW, that in winning a war moral principles end up getting tarnished at the least if not destroyed or abandoned outright. (Yes DW went into this territory but with nowhere near the success of Shatterpoint.)

It is also interesting that the Jedi strategy is to fight a war of attrition, which is limited warfare; not dissimilar to the war fought against the Empire by the Rebellion. In both instances the fight was against a superior and better prepared adversary.

I also agree Palpatine would have created another scheme to gain the same end of a galactic war. After all, had the Naboo invasion succeeded he would have been Chancellor and had war, as it was he had to wait a decade and structure things more carefully.

JB

 

He might have eventually died of old age.

 

You really reckon there is no evading that eh? In SW?

JB

 

At that point nothing had happened, that would have justified dropping a bomb on Geonosis.

 

I chose no. On the surface, yes, it may be easy for one to agree with Depa's methods, but like Mastadge said earlier, this creates a paradox. Once Depa gave into her darker urges she ceased to be a Jedi, and obviously the Jedi do not live by the principles that took her over on Haruun Kal. If this scenario was posed to a clone trooper or another non Jedi Id probably say yes, but in regards to a Jedi, no way.

 

I'm waiting for someone to parallel this to Hiroshima.....

 

The ends may escalate things to something potentially more dangerous as you're justifying the means.

 

I agree. Palpatine would probably charge the Jedi with killing civilians.

 

Yeah, I think she had the right idea. A military leader has to choose between what he thinks will be safest for his troops. Bombing would've saved more people without question. 200 jedi and tons of clones died, along with seperatist that they wanted dead in either situation. So basically, they wasted those lives. 3 is never greater than 200, no matter how you do the math. And while they may not have expected those losses, they knew more than 3 people were bound to die. Anyway, if anakin is so damn chosen, he should be able to find a way out of imminent death. otherwise he's all hype

 

No; as Mace said, if they used that strategy, they would cease to be Jedi. Although it was probably more costly long-term to do it Mace's way instead of the way Depa would have him have done it, it was done for the sake of principle and is therefore right. A victory at the sake of principle, even one that saves countless lives, is no victory at all.

-Paul

 

If the only way to beat evil is to become evil, then evil still wins.

And in this case, 3 > 200. Anakin Skywalker is the Chosen One (or maybe his father ), and the fate of the galaxy rests on his shoulders. If he doesn't get a chance to save the galaxy, the entire galaxy is screwed.

 

Hear hear. It's kind of like not revealing a crime that you know about, you didn't do it, but because you didn't report it, you aid that criminal

 

Another point to consider is, up to the battle of Geonosis, the Separatists hadn't made any open attacks on the Republic. If the Republic just went in and blasted the planet it would probably convince many more systems to leave the Republic since they are attacking without provocation.