Discussion in 'Literature' started by Shmi52, Oct 31, 2000.
Tinian did show up. It was somewhere early on in the book. Daye showed up too.
I wonder what happened to both them and how they ended up where they are. Well, Kathy? How'd that happen?
Well Ms.Tyers,thank goodness they don't have that 15 minute only"time allotment for editing your posts or I'd be too late.
No thanks required though.My fault.I should've thought before I posted.
You analyzed Mara? COuld you you show your analysis or not? I am curious to see it. By the way, I also have sent my Mara analysis to Zahn, too, hoping for his response.
As for a more general NJO concern, I am disgusted how they have villified Kyp andbeing aggreesive. It has become a veritable punching bag, having Luke so upset with any aggression at all. I thought anger and fear is supposed to be the problem, and aggression with that the problem, not that itself. It is high time a Jedi is introduced who is very aggressive, yet not someone portrayed as "being stupid" like Kyp is. It would be nice to see an example where Luke's being overly cautious leads to more loss of life than a more aggressive approach, making it no longer a two-way street.
Also, whoever made Mara two-years younger than Luke makes things a bit more trickier for Mara's past. In ANH, Luke was 18, making Mara 16. By Endor, Mara was 20. SHe could not realistically have served Palpatine for too many years.
Also, I weary of hearing how powerful the Jedi are. It seems that one reason the old Jedi did not need blasters was meant to be their reliance on the Force, on the one hand dcreasing options, but on the other hand, increasing their reliance on the Force. given enough Stormtroopers, a Jedi can be overwhelmed. No one has ever come across that perspective, and it is high time that they did. Note that Luke never uses a blaster in ROTJ.
Somebody dredge up the HTTE sourcebook. I'm certain that the ages for Luke, Mara, and Leia are exactly the same in there.
"Also, whoever made Mara two-years younger than Luke makes things a bit more trickier for Mara's past. In ANH, Luke was 18, making Mara 16. By Endor, Mara was 20. SHe could not realistically have served Palpatine for too many years."
Actually, I think it works better. It helps explain why in VotF she feels she wasn't in the Dark Side -- Palpy just didn't have her as an adult for that many years -- and in the comic series Mara Jade: By the Emperor's Hand it doesn't seem as if Mara had been on too many missions before she was sent to kill Luke. In addition, her total faith in & devotion to Palpy is more easily explained (and forgiveable) in a teenager/young adult, and the sense of total loss that accompanied Palpy's death also works well for a younger adult. Also, females mature faster than males so a very young Mara could be just as capable as, say, a 14-year-old female senator And Anakin is 15 and the Solo twins 17...they're pretty capable, too
But that's just my opinion, and this is Kathy's thread so I'm bowing out.
Kathy, can I just say that Balance Point holds up just as well if not better on the second read And as for a soundtrack, I was listening to U2's new album, which works VERY well with this book.
In the HTTE Sourcebook it says that all three Luke, Leia and Mara were 28... I thought they'd be closer to 27 at that point... being 5 years after Return of the Jedi add to that 4 years that span the trilogy and them being 18 when it began...
The trilogy spanned five years.The Battle of Yavin was one year,and Endor happened four years later.
All this talk about age reminds me of one of the lines in BP - when Mara refers to herself in a self-deprecating way - calling herself an 'old lady'. Very cute.
I think the only 'source' for her age is Zahn. The other references are all speculative. And, as far as I know, Zahn never said her age. The closest we came was when Luke, in HTTE, first saw Mara and thought she looked 'around his own age'. Thats good enough for me.
I didn't realize that the Battle of Yavin counts as a year... I figured 3 years between Yavin and Hoth and 6 months to a year between Hoth and Endor... so I figured 4...
The battle of Hoth happened in the third year.Endor was the next year after.
OKay - we're all lit buffs here so I'm going to just quote the novels. Not the sourcebooks, the RPG stuff, comics - just the novelizatins of the films. It says, in the ANH book that Luke is 'twice the age of the ten year old vaporator'. In the ESB book, Luke was said to be 'barely 23 years old'. ROJ is tricky - but Han Solo is said to have been frozen for '6 of this desert planet's months'.
OKay - my kids are done with their homework and its time to get them to bed so I'll be shutting up for a while...
I tend to go by the published script to A New Hope, which I believe says that Luke is 18... I just like to picture him that age and go by the script.
Luke was 18 in ANH.
I need to answer these in batches --
Valin Halcyon -- it's great to know you felt you were "there" on Bburru. That's a real compliment. Thanks.
Commander Wright -- front = Jacen. Tank = Jaina.
boushh 2187 -- Thank you for reading the whole thread! That is getting to be quite a job, but it makes me feel like the time spent has been worthwhile.
Thanks for the p. 20 reference -- now I know what the question was (about Han & Leia). No, that particular incident never was shown in AoC. No, I don't want to speculate much more specifically than to say Han had been spending a lot of time in the tapcafes. People in that state sometimes do say things they don't even remember afterward --
Fair question about Leia's Force use, too. It's interpretive on my part. Let me take a stab at it.
Leia has made choices. One of the most bitterly frustrating things I've experienced about "maturity" (creak . . . ) is that there is no way I will ever get to do all the things I'd like -- and that I still could do, if only time and age weren't constraints (for example -- I simply could not join the military. They wouldn't have me.). Every time I make a major life choice, I choose NOT to do a whole lot of things that I maybe had the talent & interest to achieve. In the end, I'll be forced to look back on only one path I actually walked. I hope it'll be consistent and honorable.
That's what I see Leia having done -- having tried the warrior/saber/telekinesis role and decided it did not suit her as well as the diplomatic role. And the diplomatic role was sorely needed.
I really do wonder how all this will change now.
Matthew Trias -- good point. So if the Jedi were sworn to uphold peace and justice, and Leia is doing that (imagine a truly Force-sensitive candidate in the electoral race of your choice?!) -- could that be what Luke meant? -- That being a Jedi isn't all Xwing battles and saber duels, but is sometimes serving the galaxy in more subtle ways?
CoK -- Yes, that's what I was trying to say about Leia.
Mm, DL -- from the viewpoint of my (creak) somewhat advanced age, I think CoK has a point.
boushh2187 -- I also suspect Leia's varying levels of ESP, TK etc were due to authors writing her as they imagined her.
Fair enough, aleja! And at *their* (creak) advanced age, the age difference matters much less than the interaction of their strengths and maturity. I often forget I'm older than my husband . . .
Mazzic, you're next.
This is completely random, but bear with me for a moment. I'm still back in the middle of Jedi Eclipse, and I cannot wait for Balance Point! I haven't read anything else for fear of ruining the story, but just wanted to randomly comment until I can finish Balance Point. (WHY, LORD? WHY?! Must finsh...) And isn't it about time for a NR counter-offensive?
Well....Leia will always be a Jedi in my book....
New Rebellion said Leia was a Jedi.
Mazzic -- hi. Thank you! It's too bad we didn't get to watch Lando & Tendra get hitched, but it's far too late for me to show the ceremony. (Who wants to write the magazine story? Do we have a volunteer? It should have been the fashion event of the decade!)
No Ssi-ruuk, either. I've had enough of them, I think.
I dn't think the way Jim wrote Droma could be duplicated. I absolutely adored the "mud scene" in JE -- page 257 --
Mara's comment about having "made a science of stomping on massive egos" is attributable to her creator during our phone conversation -- and it's true.
I have no say in naming Bambino Skywalker. Oh well.
Someone else will say where the Chiss were, I hope. Also Danni Quee. BP needed focus, so I simply couldn't cover everyone. Stay tuned.
For other BP titles, see DL's site. (WHERE did he get that information??)
Something quotable about working with Mara Jade? Hm. Okay, how's this -- "Cross her fans at your own risk!"
Jarik -- Thanks a ton.
[huge grin -- I was just interrupted by a phone call from my first SW editor, Janna Silverstein, who had no idea she was mentioned in the dedication until her autographed copy arrived in today's mail. <waves> Hi Janna!]
aleja -- A second read? I am honored.
Jedimama -- Tim was cagey and wise, not to give her age.
boushh2187 & Jarik -- I do have an ANH script, from a long-ago dealer at a sf convention far, far away . . . it's not exactly the published version . . . looks rather like a fourth- or fifth-generation photocopy (oh dear, am I in trouble for having this? I bought it when I was just a kid!). On page 2, Luke is described as "a farm boy with heroic aspirations who looks much younger than his 20 years." Interesting!
Matthew Trias -- Yes, Leia is a Jedi in my book, too.
In mine as well, Matthew.
And Kathy, thanks for the response. I guess it is just authors writing Leia as they see her.. and we'll see what happens in the future. I have to say that you had me terrified at the end of BP. I thought Leia was a gonner... I was getting quite emotional.. I kept saying... "oh no, this is it for her." I left the book in another room a couple of times to regain my courage to continue.
Also, I can see "the fight" getting turned into a fanfic already.
boushh2187 -- I suppose that the H/L fight would be fine as a fanfic. As for Leia's injuries, maybe I should apologize for playing off the expectation that a main character would die in each hardcover. Or maybe not, if people are giving BP a second read. That feels fabulous.
I think it was great that you played off those expectations... it worked quite well. I'm still worried about her though... I'm wondering what her fate will be...
Anyone know how soon after BP the next book takes place...?
Hello Kathy, great book.
I didn't really have time to go through every one of the posts, so I guess this question may have already been asked. What happened to Baskhaban and Olmahk? Did they go down in glory or are they still with us?
Also, Jacen wielding the Force at the end like no one's buisness is one of the highlights of NJO for me. Ripping the wall sconce right off of the wall and bashing Tsavong Lah with it was totally reminiscent of Empire Strikes Back and Luke's fight against Vader. I got chills reading it. I love how he proceeded to absolutely smack Tsavong Lah around the room, a true Jedi victory to add to a short list. Anyway, thanks for adding a great piece to what is turning out to be an awesome series.
I'm usually just a lurker here, and this is my first post. I couldn't resist the chance to interact with the person that gave us one of the best SW books to date. As if you haven't heard this ten thousand times here already, thank you for your brilliant work. I finished your book last night by reading the last two hundred pages straight. I know there are others that read it in one sitting in 3 hours. Unfortunately, I can't do that, but any book that can hold my attention for 200 pages (or about 3.5 hours) straight deserves much praise!
As I read through this massive thread (whew!) many questions came to mind, and many, if not all, were answered. I do want to say that I agree with boushh2187: I really did think that Leia was off to meet the maker. However, unlike boushh2187, I almost wanted it to happen. I know that might sound sadistic, but it's not as if we haven't seen enough of Leia. And as others have pointed out, she has started to become a backround character. I, too, was fooled by the HC = major death rumors. At first I thought it might be interesting to see how her death was taken by the other characters, but then I remembered that we already went through that with Chewbacca. To start that again would be repetitive and, to an extent, boring. Besides, with the possiblity that she might lose her legs, Leia could easily move back into the foreground of the stories.
Baby Skycrawler? The name has to be Vanda, of course. If not, I'd settle for David. It's in the bible!
Well, I don't want to babble too much. If I think of any questions, I'll let you know. Thanks again for the book, and I think that you are wonderful for giving the fans a chance to get somewhat on the inside. Sometimes I wish that implant would malfunction, but in the end, I know that I will enjoy it more as it unfolds before my eyes. Once more, thanks!
CamassiJedi -- Thank _you_. B = unknown. O = dead.
Vanda -- I'm delighted that you enjoyed BP. Thanks for reading the thread, and those are good thoughts regarding Leia.