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Discussion Diversity In the New Saga [See OP Warning]

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Future Films - Spoilers Allowed' started by Pro Scoundrel , Nov 20, 2016.

  1. InterestingLurker

    InterestingLurker Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 15, 2011
    Lando is genuinely handled better than he was in the original EU (Legends).

    I agree that the sequel trilogy wasn't handled well, but when it comes to characters like Darth Vader and Lando Calrissian, both have been handled more or less superbly.

    I mean, think about it: in the original EU, Lando was played for laughs by having him trying to woo Mara Jade and, aside from moments like that, he's generally not heard from again.

    "Oh look, don't you remember that sleazy gambler Lando? Well, here he is! ...just standing around... doing genuinely nothing of any relevance or significance throughout the post-ROTJ EU, whether it's the Thrawn crisis, the Yuuzhan Vong, the Second Galactic Civil War, etc. But hey! At least we don't forget to include him as a cameo!"

    Damn, I swear, I felt genuinely bad learning that Lando didn't do anything of note after ROTJ in the Legends EU. The first time I read about Lando on Wookieepedia, I had a feeling that the EU authors would ignore him... and they mostly did. For a guy that was a big fan of Lando Calrissian as soon as I saw him, that was a damn shame.

    Pardon the language here and there. :p
     
  2. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Interesting. I haven't read hardly any post-ROTJ EU, so I wasn't aware that Lando was handled poorly. That's a crime, because he's one of my favorite characters. I finally watched TROS last night, and I liked Lando's moments.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2021
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  3. InterestingLurker

    InterestingLurker Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 15, 2011
    Yeah, Lando was good in TROS from what I hear, but I haven't watched it.

    I'm more happy about how he's handled in the new canon in general.

    Basically:

    Lando in the old EU (Legends) is poorly done.

    Lando in the "new EU" (current canon) is handled well.

    That's the way I see it.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 5, 2021
  4. Bor Mullet

    Bor Mullet Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Lando and Babu Frik are the only good things about TROS. Fact.
     
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  5. InterestingLurker

    InterestingLurker Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 15, 2011
    *Beep Beep Boop*

    VERIFICATION ONGOING

    VERIFICATION COMPLETE

    Fact detected.

    Please proceed to continue being right.

    *Boop Beep Beep*

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. QUIGONMIKE

    QUIGONMIKE Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2009
    Lando is my main man! In case you didnt notice, lol. ;)

    He was an excellent character in the originals. I loved his double-cross, his eventual plan to reverse his own double-cross and of course his leadership in ROTJ. In the sequels, he really do that much which I was OK with. Felt like he was there as a fan "checkbox" more than anything. He's a great SW character and always has been. His being black was great for representation but didnt add or subtract from the character. He's just a good character. :)
     
    InterestingLurker likes this.
  7. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Agreed. Lando is awesome.
     
    Bor Mullet likes this.
  8. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    It's amazing there's actually no black actors in ANH, I don't for one minute believe there was anything sinister behind it, but what a choice bringing in BDW. It's a damn shame he never got to play Two-Face in Batman Forever, he'd easily done as good a job as Tommy Lee Jones. Even after these years he can still bring charm and charisma to his character.
     
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  9. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Not on screen, but James Earl Jones.
     
  10. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    Exactly, proves there wasn't any agenda.
     
  11. QUIGONMIKE

    QUIGONMIKE Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2009
    Yeah, not likely anything sinister but thats how it went. The great thing about Lando is that you get a great character that was perfectly cast, it doesnt feel forced at all, and it gives representation to people that benefit from that. I believe the word is WINNING :). Hes one of my all-time favs in the entire saga.
     
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  12. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    No - that doesn't prove it. Agenda was very real. But we're talking about the late 70s. A lot of racism was just accepted then because it wasn't bad as moments before - not that it was good.

    Context matters though - hence why things that are problematic of the OT (lack of POC, sexual persistence of Han to Leia) aren't as big of a deal because they reflect the time but doing it now typically is called out.

    If you know better you expected to do better although everyone obviously doesn't.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2021
    anakinfansince1983 likes this.
  13. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    I believe it just never occurred to George Lucas, not for one second do I believe he had an agenda, I wonder if because ANH was filmed primarily in the UK and there wasn't that many black actors on British TV or film in speaking roles at that time. It was still a few years before the likes of Hugh Quarshie and Eamon Walker broke through and eventually became known beyond British shores, the black actors that were on TV here in Britain seemed to be isolated to sitcoms.
     
  14. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    The number of black actors in the UK, in the 70s, was a considerably smaller number than today. That and the fact that Star Wars wasn't known then, and wasn't a movie actors were lining up to be a part of, were definitely contributing factors. Although I'm sure George probably wasn't even thinking about the lack of diversity in those days, which was exactly the kind of thing that lead us to pushing for it these days.
     
  15. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    What you're describing to a degree is systematic racism. Not having an "agenda" but in a world where all one sees is non POC actors is being part of that same agenda. Not thinking about it isn't an excuse. But again -that's 1970s filters.
     
  16. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    So you're saying GL was guilty of racism to some degree because it never occurred to him that he'd cast all ethnic white actors? And that is what I am solely talking about, not other filmmakers, just GL.

    Personally I believe you cast people on merit, not the colour of their skin. As has already been pointed out, GL had cast JEJ to be the voice Vader, surely that cannot be a case of keeping a black actor from being in front of the camera by GL?

    Why do you think he cast BDW in TESB if you think he had an agenda?
     
  17. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    Ignorance is no excuse.

    And yes - merit is key. But if you are conditioned to only look at non-POC (which has long been an issue with Hollywood), your focus on what is merit is too narrow but is reinforced. Like NFL coaching searches - which was just as true for QBs. POC have had to be exceptional for white people to give them merit - while many of mediocre of white people have gotten jobs because they were already in the culture.

    I'm not pointing figure accusing GL. It was reflective of the times and GL was progressive in his films far more than most of that era. But I doubt even he would say he was good at it then.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2021
  18. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    There's an unintentional mistake, an honest mistake and there is deliberately not wanting to see.

    That can be said about nepotism, with certain people getting jobs over others regardless of skin colour. Both are wrong, I wouldn't even try to defend one as being worse than the other, just pointing out discrimination doesn't end with skin colour.
     
  19. 2Cleva

    2Cleva Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    Ignorance is ignorance. Trying to define what kind of ignorant mistake it was doesn't help the people shut out. Many of "unintentional" or "honest" mistakes still have consequences.

    Indeed about nepotism. And I didn't imply only skin color. Lots of biases and prejudices out there against equal opportunities for all.
     
  20. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    May be one day there will be a better world without discrimination or prejudice, only equality can eliminate that.
     
  21. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/Teh Mole Host star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    Eh you have to much faith in humanity.
     
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