Saga Does anyone here see the Saga 1-9?

Just because a person thinks 1-6 works fine doesn't mean they'd assume a sequel trilogy couldn't be an organic part of the same story. And, IMO, even if it doesn't feel "organic", it can still be good, or at least, believable enough.

 

I know what you mean but I don't see it like that. For me it's plausable that he had one backup plan on Exegol which appeared to be effortive enough for his cult. So I guess we “just“ have to think that way. It was like playing a joker-card which is used and gone after playing. Also I think you should always interpretate as it is most good for the story. Palpatine keep coming back and back is not really what TROS wanted to show/imply. Darkness always returns at some point, sure. But I don't need super much creativity to believe that Palpatine only had one ace up his sleeve; especially considering that he seems to be this guy who goes "all or nothing" oftenly. Although I never made it to convince a person who critizises Palpatine's return of my perspective on it, so I guess for you it will be the same. I mean...what could convince you that Palpatine is (very, very probably) dead forever? Since they opened this "pandora box" of him cheating death (as he planned to find out in Episode III already) of course there will be always a few precent chance that he is still out there somewhere - like a ghost who haunts the galaxy forever and always returns in a certain way. But I think this ruins SW for you in the end. I think him having an on-screen death getting dismembered in a million pieces after he played his cheating death card coordinating a group of dark scientists on a secret planet before the Skywalker saga officially ends in a climatical stand-in-fight between Sith and Jedi, we can allow ourselves to believe that Sidious is gone. We can not proof it, but we should allow ourselves to think it.

 

The ST should have revolved around the main three, all while we are introduced to a new band of characters who would then go on to have their own trilogy in episodes 10-12. Even if they weren't the best movies, it would have been the right way to tell the story.

 

Honestly, if I had to choose whether Palpatine was permanently gone after TROS or not, I'd choose not. Bringing him back a third time would actually be an opportunity to fix some of the mess made by TROS. Get Force Ghost Anakin in there to really finish the job.

 

I think it could have continued the story after 1-6, but not reconfigure a new 1-9 arc. If that makes sense? Lucas ending in ROTJ was very final (The Emperor dies, the Empire loses, the Rebellion wins, Vader sacrifices himself for Luke). That arc was finished. Now the story of Luke, Leia and Han could have continued with their offspring, and that is why 7-9 or a possible 10-12 could have worked.

That is why I expected back in 2013 for Luke, Leia and Han to have ceremonial roles in Episode 7 and pass the torch to the new characters (their offspring) for Episode 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, etc. It boggles my mind that Disney decided to limit their storytelling to only 1 Skywalker/Solo offspring and end the story in Episode 9. They could have made multiple Skywalker/Solo kids and continued on with new stories in a GFFA for years. They shouldn't have even called it the Sequel Trilogy because it limited their storytelling to 3 movies only. They should have just announced Episode 7 comes out in 2015, with Episode 8 coming out a few years later, etc. Disney could have literally made SW movies in true serial form with the Skywalkers for the next 2 decades. Instead they killed off the lineage in 2019. One of the dumbest decisions a studio has ever made with a proven property.

 

^If Disney ever decides to continue the saga, they may think the Skywalker name and a strong Force-sensitive bloodline are all they need. Which... I guess is hard to argue against. Doing so will probably come across some people as thinking less of adoptive families (even though Rey wasn't adopted...).

 

Right, the ST can be good, just not an organic part of the same story arc that began in Episode I (and ended in Episode VI).

I see what you mean, but I just can't accept it. The Emperor is dead in Episode VI, and there is absolutely no hint of the contrary (and no, just because he dangled the inmortality carrot in front of Anakin, it doesn't mean he learned how to be inmmortal).
Killing a villain off in one movie (with no hint of a possible way-out) and then bringing him back is just a cheap trick, in my opinion, and a sign of lack of creativity and / or proper planning of the story.
And I don't see how his death in Ep.IX was any more final than his death in Ep.VI.

I agree with that. Basically make a spin-off - or a different saga.
But not as part of the same arc that began in Episode I.

 

Can't say I agree. I see no reason why a post-RotJ trilogy as a concept would inevitably be less organic than the PT -- or RO or Solo or TCW -- but, opinions.

 

Okay, for this I disagree because all this cheating death arc was THE plot core of why Anakin even went to the dark side. In retrospective I found it even weird how so few people could see how PT and OT don't really match regarding this. Basically TROS honoured ROTS and gave it some story-meat.

 

Except in RotS Palpatine himself said he didn't know the secret to cheat death after all. So it's not ''honoring'' RotS so much as retconning it.

 

There are inuniverese 23 years between Ep III and his "death" in Ep VI. You can guess that he learned it by the time Vader threw him down the shaft without actually learning it in the movies...and you learn it in Ep IX that he achieved it in some way.

 

^Even if you go with that kind of headcanon explanation, it just opens up more questions. Granted I haven't watched TROS, so maybe I don't know how it works or if the powers are even explained, but if he knew the secret to cheating death / possession by the time of RotJ, why didn't he use it sooner? He was a decaying old corpse even then, before TROS.

But really, I don't think whether he could come back is the most important thing. It's what his death signified in RotJ and to the whole 1-6 saga. That's my real issue with Palpatine coming back.

 

You get further infos about that in the Ep IX novel. Check it out. Its all there if you're willing to get into it,

 

^No thanks. And you left out the part of my post where I mentioned that how it happens isn't the real issue. Backstory can only do so much; it can't take back the fact that they brought Palpatine back and had Rey defeat him.

 

The way I see it, the story of Darth Plagues the Wise is vague enough that you can interpret it in many ways. Maybe Darth Plagues never even existed. Maybe he did exist and was Palpatine's master, but he never had the power to cheat death. Maybe he did have that power but Palpatine never learned it. Maybe he did. In any case, it's such an ambiguous story (told by someone who is trying to lure Anakin using lies), that I don't see how it sets up a possible survival of Palpatine.
Even more so when that power is never discussed again, and it's actually the Jedi who find the path to inmortality.
What the Darth Plagues story does set up is the fact that the Sith Master was killed by the apprentice, which is what happens to Palpatine (in Ep.VI). So, even if Plagues did have that power, he couldn't use it to save himself!

(And I'm not even talking about how poorly the ST introduced the whole resurrection concept!)

 

I just didnt get into that because I wanted to point out that there is lore to learn more. I actually find it strange that you complain about things you havent really researched.

For me it works and the whole callback to Palps words from Ep III in Ep IX make it clear that there is a connection. Its ok if you dont like it of course.

 

Also keep in mind that two films in this supposed sequel trilogy take place literally hours apart. Something like that could have been done in later installments. But right out of the gate for episodes 7 and 8 was just asinine for an already doomed trilogy.

 

No one should have to ''research'' to be able to criticize these films. I don't like the idea of Palpatine coming back, I don't like how he's beaten, I just don't like these movies in general; it should be no surprise that I don't want to read stuff about them. If some people do, fine, but if TROS needs this extra material to work then that's not my problem. I'm not going to go out of my way to make the pieces fit for what is, in my opinion, an already-horrible idea and finale for the saga.

 

I haven't tried a full watchthrough of all 9 films yet, but i don't see why i would watch it in any other way if i did.

 

No, I can't think of a single thing in the sequels that gave me the Star Wars vibe.

 

Suit yourself.

You stated you have not watch Ep IX. Thats what I ment by "research"...check out the official source material. The film and the novel are official stuff and provide enough content to tell you everything you need.

I also dont get how nowadays everything must be explained into last detail. When there was only the OT people had fun thinking about stuff and coming to their conclusion and answers. Now its bad if stuff isnt fully explained and worded out on screen.

 

^You only mentioned reading the novel, not watching the movie, so... yeah.

And again, no, I'm not reading the novel or watching the film. I know enough of what happens in TROS, I dislike what happens, there'd be no point.

Not everything needs to be explained; sure, but that's not an excuse to do anything you want. Undead-clone-grandpa-Palpatine randomly appearing was hardly needed to bring mystique to the SW universe. And once again, the explanation for how Palpatine returned isn't my real issue, it's him returning at all.

OK, I've made my point so I'll just drop this here, since I don't want to keep repeating the same things, and this is probably more suited to a Palpatine thread anyway.

 

I’ve enjoyed every single thing in Star Wars canon to date - all the films, shows, games, comics… all of it!

It’s a never ending saga, and everything belongs in it.

 

I see the saga as an 11 parter and some parts like a book are better then others but its 11 parts. I do include Rogue One and Solo as both add a lot to the mythos. Vader is class in Rogue One and Solo and Chewie becoming partners was massive. So yeah all 11 lol

 

and now where do visions fit in.. its so much more than 1-9