ST Finn/John Boyega Discussion Thread

I may just do that if such conduct continues. Thanks

 

Disney and LucasFilm failed Finn, in big red block letters.

The fact that Finn seems to go trending on Twitter every month shows that people to this day still feel strongly about how Boyega and his character was treated in the ST.

Is there any redemption beyond this though, is the question?

 

They've clearly written off the entire ST-era and are content to just mine OT-adjacent periods for nostalgia points at this stage. Only The Acolyte has any promise as an actually original story which doesn't rely on OT iconography, and I don't trust them to not shoehorn Young Hot Palpatine into it.

 

Apparently Rogue Squadron takes place post-TROS, but details are fuzzy, so who knows?

I don't think they can leave the ST as the festering wound that it is, even if they spend some time away from it because it will still be there. Covering it up and pretending it's not there won't make it go away.

 

I've seen convincing analysis of the X-Wing on the logo (not to mention the Patty Jenkins promo, where it definitely is one) is actually a T-65, so I don't have high hopes.

I think it'll only happen when some bright spark at Lucasfilm or Disney or whatever comes to the realisation that a lot of people actually grew up with the ST (or if they didn't, generally liked at least some of it) and want to see more of the characters they enjoyed, but currently the leadership seems content to just play it safe more than the ST already did.

 

Judging by some of the imagery, it looks like it takes place in the OT period... which is no surprise, as I’d imagine Disney/Lucasfilm are currently wary of developing any post ST era stories.

 

The only thing that makes me scratch my head is KK's initial statement. It sounds pretty explicit, but might not mean anything.

 

I'm pretty sure 'future era', in that context, refers to live action films that are made after the production of the ST, as opposed to films set chronologically after the ST. I'd imagine that even hardened ST fans would become a bit cynical if the first live action film set after the ST again featured Tie-Fighters, stormtroopers etc. Whereas, I'd imagine, Lucasfilm know they can mine the OT era for that type of iconography, and it will be a bit more acceptable... and it can link into (potentially), Kenobi, Cassian etc. etc.

 

Actually she was supposed to be his long lost daughter, but it was ended up on the cutting room floor.
I have to say this....I am starting to get fed up with people complaining about JB's 'treatment' whilst completely ignoring KMT's treatment.
Finn's character had plenty of screentime in TLJ. He had, I thought. a good story arc. He became his own person, not just Rey's sidekick. He had his own love interest. He stopped being a 'comedy act' post Canto Bight - nothing funny about a man willing to kill himself to save the cause he'd adopted.
His character was wasted in TROS, but let's face it....everyone was apart from Rey. But JB was all too happy that Abrams had returned to direct it, wasn't he?
Kelly had a major role in TLJ, but her character was cut down in a way that frankly was disgusting, just as DLF blaming it on Carrie Fisher's death was disgusting. She could have accompanied the 'trio' on their adventures, but they gave that role to a six foot mollusc, shoving talented and likeable Kelly into a five minute role and replacing her with Jannah as 'Finn's love interest'.
Kelly deserved far better. And I admire tremendously how dignified she has been post TROS, unlike Boyega who apparently was peeved that simply because his character didn't get to hold a lightsabre.

 

A lot of people aren’t happy about KMT’s treatment either. There are some big differences though between the two. The way RJ wrote and Rose and how she was used in TLJ in the first place. I personally can’t stand Rose as a character and there are a lot of people that feel that way trolls and regular joe’s alike. It has nothing to do with KMT her character was poorly written and essentially spent the whole film lecturing someone that should know a whole lot about abuse and slavery by the first order. Not to mention her tasting Finn when he can’t be a deserter as he is not even a Resistance member among other things.

Her main arc is one of the universally disliked aspect of the ST. Canto Bight is just a mess of nonsense and ridiculous elements that overstuff a film that is already to long. I could go on but I hit the main points.

The main difference is Finn was a lead in TFA and got downgraded from there for the Villain who is not a lead... It also wasn’t just him pretty much everyone got downgraded for Kylo till the end of TROS.

Should JJ have tried to do more with Rose sure but TROS is a mess and not sure how adding in another character would help that. Rose’s poor reception has nothing to do with KMT but with RJ who made the character and had no idea what to do with her in the first place. She definitely got shafted but I blame RJ for that because if she had been a compelling new character she wouldn’t have been just dropped. It’s not like JJ did anything interesting with the other characters he added Jannah and Zori Bliss were total wastes as well. May as well add Phasma in there too her book and comic were better than anything in the ST. Rose and Phasma are two characters that were treated poorly by both directors in the ST.

I wish they had done a better job with Rose but d’or that to have happened RJ would have needed to do something with film instead of retread his TFA arc and written a good plot that included Rose. She is essentially collateral damage from being paired up with Finn in a pointless idiotic side quest where both characters are incredibly unlikeable. Just another casualty of Kylo being elevated by RJ

 

I'm quite tired of watching (or listening to) folk try to whataboutism their way out of acknowledging what happened with Finn (and by extension, John Boyega) is demonstrably different than what happened with Rose (in TROS), and symptomatic of her character's creation and use in TLJ to begin with. The two situations are not comparable.

Are people still trying to make Lando out as lecherous old man who tried to hit on Jannah?

 

Yes, because the scene is incompetently directed and edited. Everyone knows that's not what's intended (purely from fictional norms, not because this hanging nail at the end of a 9 movie saga makes any sense in the internal logic of the film). It's still an eminently arguable interpretation cos its that weirdly put together.

If that take is appearing in EW, its cos they screwed up.

https://ew.com/movies/2019/12/21/the-rise-of-skywalker-companion-book-lando-final-scene-twist/

 

So Finn's treatment is in quotes because it's not real. Whereas KMT's is? Is that what you're implying here?

There's enough room in the wasted treatment department with both characters. Both characters deserved better. This is Finn thread though. And Finn is main character. A wasted one. So Finn is going to be talked about here.

But a couple of minor issues in the rest of your comment: Finn was never just Rey's sidekick in TFA. He was his own character there too. They never did the character right from the start, but he wasn't a side character. He was always a main character. And giving him his own story, away from Rey, doesn't suddenly make him a real character.

Second: Was "given his own romance"? As if 'his own' means that he could never be with Rey, ever, so give him someone else so Rey can go fall in love with abuser. Is that it? But besides that weird phrasing, he didn't have his own love interest in TLJ. If anything Finn was Rose's love interest, but she was never his. When Rose kissed him he froze and he (and the audience) seemed genuinely surprised by it. It was awkward as hell. Just as awkward as the 'other romance' going on, when Rey shipped her self in box to go on a date with her bf and Kylo looked her with his dead psycho eyes, and total confusion.

Third: His comedy act continues way past Canto Bight. The whole sneaking on to the FO ship, in disguise, with DJ acting goofy, BB8 bumping off the walls, the whole thing is a farce. And it's supposed to be. Because it's meant as levity against the real drama going on up stairs in the throne room. And then later, when he's about to sacrifice himself for the Resistance, he's then told he's a dummy for it. After all that brainwashing to fight, he's now just a dummy for accepting that lesson. And what is the real lesson; save the ones you love. Which is what Finn originally wanted to do from the start. But instead of giving him his props for this belief, the movie, Rose, his supposed love interest, calls him a dummy. His entire plot is a joke. A bad one.

 

Wauw, I'm not even sure where to begin.

How about the fact that you think John Boyega, someone who has been harassed online since 2015 for being a black actor playing a Star Wars character, was "peeved" simply because he "didn't get to hold a lightsabre."

Have you ever actually read what John Boyega has said?

John Boyega is also not less dignified because he has spoken up about the treatment that he and the other actors received. He has specifically brought up Kelly Marie Tran's treatment by the public and by Disney.

 

I’d try an avoid any comment demeaning John Boyega’s actual experience making the films. It’s not the best way to get traction on whatever point you’re trying to make...

 

Like I said, I know I've talked about why Finn was my favorite character in the Force Awakens and I've seen others talk about what they liked about his character. I and others have done it in this thread, as well

Your reasoning is also flawed because it assumes that the reason that people would spend a lot of time talking about how Finn was wasted is because there's nothing memorable about him as oppose to it being because the character was memorable and that's why people think the character was wasted.

Also, when people talk about how Finn was wasted, they (generally) use his character in the Force Awakens rather than just the premise of his character itself. Their reasons are rooted in his actual on-screen character and story.

Reduced does not simply refer to the amount of screentime that a character receives: for example, it also refers to the quality of story and choices for that story.

In TROS, Finn is the only one of the main characters who ends the trilogy without an endpoint that is significant to his character: Rey, Kylo Ren and Poe also end their journeys with an endpoint that, even if you dislike the execution, ties into their journey. The film just gave Finn a duplicate of Poe's while Jannah, a minor character, is given an endpoint that really should have been Finn's.

There is a lot to like about Finn. It might have been better for you to open with your post asking "What do you guys like about Finn as a character? Because I'm honestly not seeing the appeal but I am curious." as oppose to "You guys don't actually like Finn as a character. You just think you do because he's played by a black actor"

 

But with Finn he was marketed as a main character for all 3 movies. Usually getting 2nd to 3rd amount of screen time. so his presence should have been constantly felt. But people often act like his presence wasn't felt at all and blame it on Kylo or Rose for being there and stopping him from shining. Even though it could be argued he wasn't as wasted as people thought. But its more the idea of what Finn could have been that gets people hung up. And what he could have been usually various depending on each persons view point.

 

If this was meant as a reply to me, I've already addressed this (with an example, as well)

I'm not sure what answer you expect.

 

The amount of money TFA made was mostly due to it being the first fully hyped star wars movie in years. i don't think it has anything to do with Finn or even Rey.

I don't deny that there are people have a good reason to like Finn. but at the same time i don't think the type of response people tend to yell about would be as much of an issue if there was more to Finn than just potential that many ain't even sure what that even was.

I mean there are people who would like to see Finn return for his own series or whatever. and usually, the first thing people say is... make Finn a Jedi. and to me that sounds almost like a default way to make a character cool or interesting. it sounds less like a desire to see the character again and more a feeling of Finn should be compensated and that he could be interesting if you made him a jedi. because Jedis are automatically cool in this universe because force powers and lightsabers. so it seems like people are standing up for what Finn could have been rather than what he was. thats just how i see it.