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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Homosexuality and theforce.net

Discussion in 'Communications' started by Angel_of_Sith, Jul 22, 2003.

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  1. Angel_of_Sith

    Angel_of_Sith Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 2002
    It has come to my attention through the closure of The Gay Bar, a gay social thread, that homosexuality is not something theforce.net is willing to permit. With the closure of a gay social thread whilste others still exist and the banning of gay relationships in fanfic, I feel we are being discriminated against.

    Something really needs to be done to address this issue, and things need to change.
     
  2. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    I agree. It has just come to my attention that interspecies relationships are permitted in fan-fic, but not gay ones. Is theforce.net saying that gays are sub-human or something? Or at least sub-alien?

    I've heard a bunch of the arguments against, and they are all bunk. Homosexuality is shown on broadcast television in a non-explicit way- why can't the same thing happen here? There's women in thongs and three breatsed women in the SW movies-Why can't a respectful gay relationship not be depicted in fan-fic?

    I think that if theforce.net really cares so much about it's younger audience, it needs to acknowledge that some of it's young audience may feel that they are gay already, or have gay parents and relatives. What message are we sending to them, when we act as if being gay is some sort of awful thing that can't be mentioned?

    It's wrong, and this site should realize it's 2003, and treat all people who love Star Wars equally.
     
  3. Kyle Katarn

    Kyle Katarn Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 10, 1998
    If you had read the reason why your social thread was closed, then you'll see that it wasn't about discrimination, rather it being a thread on subject which already had a thread.

    if it was discrimination, then it would have been locked with something along the lines of "Homosexuality is not allowed here ... et al." and that would be the end of it. But no, you had to jump to the conclusion that it was discrimination and felt that opening a can of worms by creating a thread about it was much more appropriate than sending a PM to the admin who locked the thread.


    It's the year 2003, we now send PMs first and only post threads as a last resort, get with the program.
     
  4. DarthBane420

    DarthBane420 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 13, 2003
    I was actually curious about something.
    I read in an article in USA Today that Mr. Griffin, CEO of TFN, is also a minister. Is this in part why this issue seems to be such a taboo?
    If not it appears to be basic garden variety discrimination.
    It really doesn't effect me in the least being hetrosexual, but I hate to see people put down like this. You wouldn't think this kind of discrimination would be on a Star Wars board.

    EDIT: Kyle, so gay fan fiction is alright? If so then I stand corrected.
    Also I just checked the thread and it was pushing people towards established topical threads, there appears to be no other specific social thread for gays.
     
  5. Angel_of_Sith

    Angel_of_Sith Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 2002
    Kyle Katarn: You mean to tell me there's allready a gay social thread? The only other gay thread was my 'Are You Gay?' thread which was a discussion on homosexuality, and 'The Gay Bar' was a celebration of it, as I explained in my (as yet unanswered) PM to Bria (the mod who lock it).

    Besides, it gone beyond that. It merely sparked off the whole thing. The treatment of gays and lesbians in general has to change.



    . . and confusion reigns supreme . .
     
  6. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Kyle, how about stopping trying to spin what we are saying, and really think about what is being said- I mentioned the year 2003, and I was talking about fan-fiction.

    And maybe you think Rosa Parks should have privately called her congressman and complained about having to sit on the back of the bus, but I don't have to think that way. This is a public issue in a public forum for communicating about the forums and how they operate. A PM gets as far as the mod who recieves it wants it to go.
     
  7. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
  8. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    When did Josh become an irrational person that is not open to discussion? Did I miss something?
     
  9. 1stAD

    1stAD Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2001
    Logic and reason do not belong in such a place as this.

    This is the internet. If you don't like it, get off plz.
     
  10. DarthBane420

    DarthBane420 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 13, 2003
    1st,
    Do not defy teh J*sh.
    I was wondering if this was in response to my statement?
    What I was trying to get at, is the idea that there might be a moral code that exists on TFN outside the TOS.
     
  11. Kyle Katarn

    Kyle Katarn Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 10, 1998
    If you don't like it, then go elsewhere. The gay fanfic horse has already been beaten to a pulp here and you already know how it'll turn out, and if anything, you'll only do a disservice to yourselves and your crusade by polarizing the issue all the more.
     
  12. HawkNC

    HawkNC Former RSA: Oceania star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2001
    I agree with you about the fanfic issue 100%. However, J*sh...er, Josh, runs the whole of TF.N and doesn't have just the JC to worry about. In fact, it's probably not a huge concern of his in comparison to the thousands of people who visit the front page every day. And I'm quite sure he has very little interest in going to Comms every day to answer questions about all his policies. So the chances of this particular policy changing anytime soon are exceedingly slim.
     
  13. Darth_Dagsy

    Darth_Dagsy Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 18, 2000
    You've got one thread for the discussion of sexuality. The JCC has, for a long time, avoided threads based on sexuality because it is such a divisive issue. I think you should be grateful that you've been given the chance to have a thread about sexuality, rather than complaining that a second one was closed.

    You know that people arent allowed religion social threads in the JCC? Does that mean that there is discrimination against religions? Not at all.

    In this instance, you are looking for something that doesnt exist.


    And FYI, the course of action when a thread is locked is to PM the mod that locked it. Discuss it with that mod. If you dont like the response, you PM an administrator, and discuss it with him. If you dont like that response, then you come to Communications. Dont come to Comms with accusations of discrimination, without going through all proper channels.
     
  14. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Kyle, I don't think anybody should leave a place because it's not perfect, and I don't think that asking questions in the communications forum should bother you to the extent that it has. Why would it bother you that a group of our fellow SW fans that feel slighted want to discuss it with the staff?

    At some point, the networks decided to let Ellen and Wil and Grace on the air. This would be considered impossible just 10 years ago. It's not beyond our ability to imagine a site where groups are not discriminated against.

     
  15. AmberStarbright

    AmberStarbright Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 20, 2002
    A question, if in the first post he had left it as everyone is welcome would it still been left open?

    My reasoning for this is because in the title it is not stating about a person's sexual orientation.

    Nor was the thread really, it was just a social thread for anyone.
     
  16. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Religion is a choice- One's sexuality, or color, is not. Yes, someone could choose not to act on their sexual feelings, but that wiouldn't change the way they were born.

    A good idea when trying to discuss this would be to substitute a name of a race or gender into the sentence about gays, and see if it sounds like something you'd be proud to say-Like:You Mexicans already have a thread, you should be thankful for what you've got! Or: You women have complained before and nothing happened. If you don't like it here, leave!

    I'm not trying to fight, here..I just want people to really think about what they are saying.
     
  17. DarthBane420

    DarthBane420 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 13, 2003
    It's not beyond our ability to imagine a site where groups are not discriminated against

    Cheers Bobafetish!
    So are we basically admitting that there is an unpublished moral code that is at work here beneath the surface?
    Why in the world couldn't somebody write a fanfic with Gay characters?
    I wonder how Anthony Daniels would feel about this?
     
  18. GabeC

    GabeC Jedi Youngling star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 28, 2000
    So, we can have 50 threads about how some fanboys can't get laid. But there can't be two, or three threads for gay people, or about beeing gay? That's really lame.

     
  19. Angel_of_Sith

    Angel_of_Sith Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 2002
    Gays aren't people anyways.

    They need to go to church and learn some morals.


    I am as much a person as you or anyone else on these boards, and as it happens I am a practicing christian and I'll stay that way till I die.

    Darth_Dagsy: FYI I have PMed Bria, as I said in a previous post, I haven't had a reply yet. I've also said that it isn't about that thread, it was merely the catlyst that sparked the whole thing off.



    . . and confusion reigns supreme . .
     
  20. Darth_Dagsy

    Darth_Dagsy Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Nov 18, 2000
    A good idea when trying to discuss this would be to substitute a name of a race or gender into the sentence about gays, and see if it sounds like something you'd be proud to say-Like:You Mexicans already have a thread, you should be thankful for what you've got!

    No, that isnt what I'm saying.

    Divisive, adult topics just havent been allowed in the JCC. We're starting to allow some.

    People should be grateful that they can have them at all, rather than complaining of discrimination when their second thread is locked.

    My point isnt about sexuality, not about religion. Simply about divisive issues.



    You want to do word swaps? Ok....If I started a thread named "Are you an Astroboy fan?", and then a second one called "The Astroboy Fan Bar", they'd likely be seen as subtle variations on the same topic. I wouldnt have a leg to stand on if I were to complain about the second thread being locked.
     
  21. DarthBane420

    DarthBane420 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 13, 2003
    Gays aren't people anyways.
    They need to go to church and learn some morals.

    The amazing thing is TFN seems to support this kind of thinking, and as of no shock, attracts people with these ideas.
    Sadly a mod even visited this thread after that was posted and has apparently done nothing.
    :(
     
  22. AmberStarbright

    AmberStarbright Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Actually the thread name which I pointed out before could be interpreted as being happy not about people's sexuality, it all depends on how you look at it.

    Exactly DarthBane420, people's attitude towars gays wont improve while people aren't really allowing gays to be themselves.
     
  23. 1stAD

    1stAD Jedi Youngling star 5

    Registered:
    May 10, 2001
    This issue is obviously solved to my satisfaction.

    End of topic.

    Lock at your pleasure, boyos.

    The amazing thing is TFN seems to support this kind of thinking, and as of no shock, attracts people with these ideas.
    Sadly a mod even visited this thread after that was posted and has apparently done nothing.


    Life.

    Real life.

    Get over it.
     
  24. AmberStarbright

    AmberStarbright Jedi Grand Master star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Exactly it's life, people are gay.....if you can have threads for straight relationhsips, it should be allowed for gay relationships also.
     
  25. BOBAFETISH

    BOBAFETISH Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Dagsy-You mean like "Diagon Alley" "Harry Potter Survivor" "Should I read teh Harry Potter Books?" threads? Like the way those got shut?


    Oh, wait...they didn't.

    Neither do the thousands of "Should i ask out so and so" How do I know if so and so likes me". Theres a hot girl at target, outside my door..bla bla bla....

    Dagsy, you are a brilliant debator, and I'm sure we can go around in circles all day. I just think that you are smart enough to recognize when something is just plain wrong(and I'm not talking about the closing of one thread that may be redundant). I'm talking about discrimination against gays on these boards.

    Really, we have a thread(and I don't dispute their right to have it)that praises the confederacy! Why is that considered less divisive than a gay social thread?
     
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