Saga How feminist is the Star Wars galaxy?—SEE WARNING ON FIRST PAGE

I’m talking new canon. Do men still have more power in this galaxy? Are women expected to take their husbands names? According to the TFA visual dictionary sexism is common on fringe planets. Han seems sexist in ANH. Does sexism exist in the SW galaxy? Are there any matriarchal societies like the Hapes in legends? We still have the night sisters but they don’t seem as matriarchal as in legends.

 

From the Clone Wars, they seem to be entirely female, and just subjugate the male Zabraks on the planet.

 

Oh god, this thread's headed nowhere good if we're not careful

Well, the fact that the FO (and according to retcons, the Empire) allows female officers and stormtroopers is surprisingly progressive for authoritarian dictatorships. As for what that says for the state of the galaxy at large, or perhaps in the golden age of the Republic, not exactly sure. Might be something worth looking into at r/mawinstallation

 

Skeletons? What do you mean Skele-



ohhhhhhhh

 

You bring up points like “does sexism exist in Star Wars” well of course it does. That’s because there will always be some ***** person. However it does seem that when it comes to politics there seems to be a good mix. Out of the most known Star Wars politicians
Leia, Mon Mothma and Padme are very powerful. And we only get to know 3 males who are also politicians very well at least.

Females also seem to take high ranking military positions like Grand Admiral Sloane.

So I would say this in closing. There will always be sexism and sexist people, but the GFFA seems to be ahead of us in being more equal.

 

Oh my holy frigging ****, yes. Lol @Outsourced just added this thing, myself. Thank you for this glorious boon

Ahem. As for on topic

Well, the thing is, at least based on what we see in the movies - we're really only exposed directly to the clear good guys and clear bad guys. So of course we'd be getting good messages out of the heroes, and I already mentioned that the bad guys in SW are surprisingly progressive for evil fascists. I don't think we really see too much in terms of "slice of life" things in SW even in old/current EU or TV. Could be mistaken, but that would be a fascinating thing to explore

 

It definitely does. It's not like there were any male dancers chained to Jabba's throne and forced to wear metal swimsuits. I'd also argue that Poe's attitude towards Holdo was largely based on a sexist kneejerk appraisal of her qualifications based on her appearance, and he definitely came across as trying to mansplain their situation to her as soon as she finished giving her introductory speech. You also have Han's "If we could avoid any more female advice..." jab at Leia, which wouldn't make sense as an insult if sexism wasn't a universally understood concept by way of it being present in some sort of significant capacity.

So I'd say the world of Star Wars is definitely less sexist than our own, by a fairly wide margin, but still sexist nevertheless.

 

It's present, but as pointed out by the other posters it's far less generally that what we see IRL. As always, the problem is people-there will always be some shadow/echo of some form of tribalism, sexism and racism. Humans unfortunately seem wired for it. Thankfully our galaxy far, far away has evolved more than us.

A deeper question would be with the OT where it does pop up; does it pop up because of when in our history it was written and prevalent "thinking" at the time, or was it deliberately written in to juxtapose against Leia's strength and leadership. Probably another thread for that.

 

If by "more power" you mean "hold more positions of power", then that's not necessarily sexism. Nor would it be sexism if more women held positions of power when compared to men. Sexism would be if any of the sexes held more power because they belonged to a certain sex, and not despite of.

 

The Empire is clearly sexist in the movies, seeing as they are all male. The New EU making them seem inclusive is the exact opposite of what Lucas was going for. The Empire is bad, sexism is bad. The Empire being sexist is a reason to root against them.

Jabba and his goons are clearly sexist, as all the females at his palace are slave dancers, and of course, his humiliation of Leia.

As far as new canon, Leia slapping Poe is a sexist double standard.

 

I don't think you can say that the Empire was clearly sexist. You don't know what the women in the galaxy at that time wanted to be doing. Maybe most women didn't want to be serving in the Imperial military?

And Jabba just did what he wanted. Just because most of the other criminals and gangsters were male didn't make Jabba sexist. And that Jabba wanted to see female dancers didn't make him sexist either, it meant he was heterosexual. Of course his treatment of them was terrible, he was a horrible creature, it wouldn't surprise me if he was very sexist, but we don't actually see him be so in the films.

 

Jabba clearly isn't a decent creature though. He would treat anybody like an object to do what he liked with them. Whether that is chaining them up or feeding them straight to his Rancor. Luke was just as much an object to Jabba as Leia was.

I agree with you about Tarkin though. I think he would have treated Leia with more respect if she were male.

 

Pre-Disney there seemed to be a fair amount of equality in all spheres. Both sexes were well represented in politics, in the Jedi order, in crime circles including bounty hunters, and I suppose in most normal places that don't get a lot of screentime. The only place women were less represented were in the military. But then the major militaries used mostly clones and driods. The rebels had women in positions of leadership but only men were disposable grunts (just like on earth). The Empire itself may have been sexist but we only see the military and not any other body. But then the Empire was also racist against non-humans so that may have been there too. The only real proven sexists were the Nightsisters who oppressed the men on their planet. So I would say pre-Disney the galaxy was quite equal and not at all feminist (except those aforementioned Nightsisters).
As far as Disney goes, there does seem a fair amount of people being handed positions of power without them earning it in any way, and even constantly failing afterwards. Holdo, Phasma, and Hux come to mind here. I don't know if that's in-universe sexism or simply the the stark incompetence of all factions. Holdo seemed quite sexist and feminist with her kneejerk mockery & dismissal of one of the Ressitance's best pilots, but that could be just the way she treats all her underlings.

 

Way to turn this into a Pro-Disney vs. Anti-Disney issue.

 

I think with this type of topic its hard to avoid pre vs post Disney comparisons as Disney has taken a different direction than Lucas did.

The PT seemed to be more equal than the OT as we saw female Jedi knights, Naboo pilots, Republic officers, bounty hunters, and TF officers. But as time went on, the Republic became increasingly more male exclusive. While with the OT, a few high ranking rebels and a couple of rebel pilots and techs are female, while there are no on screen female imps or bounty hunters which fits with the trend started in the PT. As already stated, the only females in Jabba's crime organization were for entertainment, mainly his.

The ST departs from the pattern somewhat, while the inclusion of women in the new rebels is not surprising and follows the six original films, the greater equality the FO has over the empire is a bizarre reversal in trends that does not match. Sadly I think one reason the FO stopped using clones is so they could be equal nd be more marketable to a greater range of viewers.

 

...what?

 

The FO never used clones did they?

The empires stormtroopers weren't retconed to be clones because that would have caused all kinds of continuity problems with the canon at that time.

 

They were, and then retconed back. As far back as 1978, some Lucasfilm sources stated stormtroopers were clones. Plus Lucas had Jango bump his head in AOTC and stated that trait was cloned into all the stormtroopers, which means the head bumping stormtrooper on DS1 is a Jango clone. Lucas later kept flip flopping back and fothm seemingly giving a different answer everytime he was asked. However, Disney seems anti clone, maybe due to avoiding having PT elements putting the ST in jeopardy with PT backlash. At one time, Halblo confimed they were clones in the OT, then flip flopped ten years after with the Disney sale.

 

They also had no idea what the Clone Wars were. For a long time, everyone assumed the Clones were the enemies.

I find this kind of funny considering how TLJ ties the OT and PT together more tightly than the actual trilogies do.

 

There are several old threads in the PT and OT forums that discussed if stormtroopers are continued clones. I rather not derail this thread with that discussion. However, there is a 1978 Lucasfilm poster book which was also reprinted in 1980 that states stormtroopers are clones, how they are grown in tubes and raised as kids into adulthood and taught nothing else than to serve the Empire, pretty much states many things we see in AOTC. The same poster series also talks about how Vader was burned on a volcano planet and other elements that made it into the PT. Lucas was a big flip flopper in the production of all six SW films and TCW which does not help matters. As I said, there are many threads that discussed this in great detail.

I have not watched TLJ yet but heard of its mixed reception. Have seen TFA but stating my opinion of it here would likely get me banned. Regardless, all the OT imps are clearly male, unless ot stormtrooper helmets mask female stormtroopers to sound male which is unlikely, but not beyond Disney retconning. All onscreen imps with exposed faces are men, and all talking stormtroopers have male voices, which shows the decline in equality as the republic decayed into the empire. However, what doesn't make sense is that the FO, which is supposed to be even worse than the empire is clearly shown to be more equal. This sends a bizarre message that equality makes evil organizations even worse? Like WTF? Lol.

 

Well I’m not sure Star Wars was ever meant to represent a Utopian society. In fact it’s supposed to show a society that is as flawed as our own. That includes slavery, political corruption, gangsters, war, sexism, discrimination, etc. Showing the flaws of a fictional society doesn’t mean one is supposed to agree with it but rather the viewer is supposed to evaluate that society and that pass judgment as they choose. Even in the context of our own human societies there are varying degrees of which other countries and cultures have viewpoints on sexism. It’s probably true of a GFFA where different planets, alien species, cultures, etc have varying views as well.

 

Wasn't the head of the Republic a woman in TFA?

Presumably it was Mon Mothma after the initial formation of the New Republic.

Leia is in charge of the Resistance. She has great authority within the Rebellion initially & the Republic/Resistance.

Women in powerful positions isn't new to Star Wars - Queens of Naboo, Duchess of Mandalore, Senators of various systems, Jedi, Governor of a planet etc

Phasma is the commander of the First Order troops.

Also - we have seen female Hutts. Who is to say they don't chain men to their thrones & make them dance?

Star Wars is and has been one of the most progressive franchises of all time.
People who complain it's sexist on social media either haven't seen it or are trying really hard to find reasons to hate on it.