ST If you feel jaded, how can IX make you fall in love with Star Wars again?

This was basically Lucas' initial treatment for Episode 7. You see Luke's temple fall in the movie, and the new main dark sider, who betrays Luke, is "born" as the villain of the ST. It was Luke and Kira going on an adventure together essentially like Luke & Obi-Wan did, then you saw how the First Order rose and began attacking the Republic.

I think that would have been much better.

Abrams and the story group's idea seemed to be to cast the First Order as former Nazis in hiding in Argentina, then they come out to "Play." But instead of Nazi's the FO should have been more analogous to radical terrorists.

Perhaps in this scenario Luke would have vanished at the end of 7, a big cliffhanger, and Episode 8 is kind of the search for him with Kira and the younger heroes having the fend for themselves and grow up, etc.

 

Back on the forums after a few months of hiatus after I realised that yes, I was a little bit jaded. Just a little bit though.

I think the best thing that IX could do for me is drop the jokes, that's all. After about a dozen re-watches of VIII, that's all that kills it for me. The comedic moments that just don't hit it (for me, at least). I think VII got it bang on with the humour - BB8 and his thumbs-up blowtorch, 'sanitation' 'sanitation?!' - that was fine, but VIII just took it far. The scene with Luke and Rey when they're seriously discussing what the heck she's doing there and what her destiny is, and the dialogue just breaks with the 'where are you from, Rey from nowhere?' 'Jakku' 'yeah, that is pretty much nowhere'... ugh. Every time, it makes me wince, because it breaks what could be such a meaningful scene into LOLFUNNYJOKE then back to serious. Cut it out.

I know a few people who didn't like the little comedic breaks in VII, but I was fine with it - VIII was too far for me.

The other thing that didn't do it for me in VIII was the cutting between different storylines without a great deal of weight in the earlier part of the film - it only got heavy, emotional, relateable, and serious in the last 40 minutes or so (which I loved). I vividly remember my first viewing, when Rose and Finn were on their way to Canto Bight and I just thought "crikey, I don't think I'm enjoying this"... and I went in with so much love and investment in the new trilogy. I really wanted to love The Last Jedi, but in the end it was the polar opposite from TFA for me - which I went into expecting the worst, and got sucked in.

I'm confident though, being the last movie of the trilogy, that it's going to have a lot of emotion and a lot of weight. So hopefully my emotional investment from TFA will finally pay off

EDITED TO ADD:
Also, any callbacks to the original trilogy would reel me well the heck in. I handled the departure to new characters and new locations well in VII, but VIII left me cold in that sense (until, as said before, the last hour or so when things got heavy). What I'd really love is an emotional gut-punch that calls back to original characters or original locations.

 

I can't see any way in IX. I'm just patiently waiting for a new (non directed RJ) trilogy that could start a new saga in the galaxy. As far as the ST is concerned, its a bust.

 

@Blastaar

I just go back to my excitement level for the ST four years ago when production on Episode VII was in full swing and compare to what it is now. I never would thought in a million years it drop this low. Even in the dark days of the PT, I still had hope for the next movie. I really do not have much for Episode IX even though I like TFA for what it is, a fun popcorn movie with some major warts. I just feel like RJ really left JJ nothing to work with.

 

I hope IX shows FO vs Resistance as a pretty small conflict with POTENTIAL to spread galaxy wide, but that the galaxy is actually a pretty chill place for most systems. Shows that both factions are not as big as the empire. Big fix for the ST and keeping OT legacy.

TCW show had protagonists aligned with the Galactic Govt that ruled pretty much everything - no underdog BS needed. Still good stories. I hope they make that happen for the NR.

I want FO split up and Finn leading legions of reforms stormtroopers. Kylo expelled for FO’s decline and being too softy since smoke died.

Cameo or appearance from Ahsoka or Ezra would be nice, as would the reappearances of Jedi who “left” Luke’s order to help.

Redescension of Luke to the physical world and f-ing stuff up with green lightsaber (never cared too much for Luke and his legacy or whatever but gotta admit if I think about it it’s kind of a bummer).

 

The primary aspect of TLJ that got to me was killing Luke off. In my view the character does not need an onscreen death.

The fix or "retcon" I want is pretty simple and already explained within the context of the existing films. Namely, Luke isn't dead but has strategically gone back into hiding, which is why Leia couldn't sense him (as in TFA). He could actually be absent from a good chunk of the film to give the Disney characters their space. But they need to acknowledge his preeminence in the Saga and allow him a full hero's role.

LFL/Disney keep shooting themselves in the foot via their fetish for killing off "Legacy" characters. I say leave all of their fates open-ended.

 

The only way IX can make me excited for new Disney Star Wars again (I will always love the original Lucas era Star Wars) is if it is renumbered to VIII, caries on directly from the events of VII and JJ sticks around to also make a new IX so that the trilogy is more than just a trilogy in name and ties in properly to the main saga. So basically, bin the abomination that is TLJ just like RJ binned JJ's story treatment for VIII in order to make his officialised fan fiction film.

 

The thing that will cure me after Solo will be opening fanfare and big sign STAR WARS Ep IX. In that moment I will forget about all past sins

 

Dunno: It was all a dream? Luke wakes up at the end of IX to see Wicket hugging Han's leg again - argh.

 

I'm with Chewies_bandolier.

I think for me, one way would be this:

Have no crawl for Episode 9. Jump immediately to Luke waking up and turning to Ghost Yoda and saying. I had had the most horrible dream possible. I need to get to Ben. Yoda reminds him- "always in motion is the future." and something like "careful you must be that by taking action you don't make this future true"

And then we learn that TFA and TLJ where just some possible future outcomes and we reset to Luke having the academy and Ben and Han still alive.

Then start over.

I know this will never be, so I can't say. Luke dying as a dejected bitter old man was probably not on anyone's radar when the ST started.

My worst case scenario for Luke was him turning to the Dark Side to rescue Ben (similar to those old EU storylines).

Now the trio is gone. Chewie is just a hanger-on without purpose. I was interested in Rey, Finn after TFA but TLJ did not build up anything of their relationship. Reylo is just creepy (is Rey attracted to the man that killed his father, and her father-figure, and is doing all these awful tyrannical things?)

 

I’m only jaded that there has been so much trolling/negative commentary in such an unjedi way in such a hateful manner that it makes discussion moot.

If the next film brings about more of that attitude - i’d just as soon as dismiss, what used to be a favorite aspect, the shared excitement of fans. I barely am involved with this forum as of late, even in the prequel days there was civility, acceptance, and “ok, i guess that’s it” and it was all ok but today it’s disheartening to hear a segment of the fan base take it to the extreme they do.

I like star wars dammit....i kept reading the books even after they killed chewie ( my fave) in the books. I didn’t write a thesis about how it ruined star wars.

So no. Keep the movies coming, i love em. Theyre my jam. As long as the basis is good versus evil, lightsabers, the force, adventures, spaceships, and aliens I’m ok. I’m on team NoJade.

 

I'd be really stoked if they brought the U.S.S. Enterprise back. We're two thirds of the way through the trilogy and we haven't seen hide nor hair of it. I don't get it.

 

I wouldn’t say I’m jaded as much as I am burnt out. I loved TFA and R1, but was more apathetic towards TLJ and Solo (even if I didn’t hate the films).

TFA in particular was the first SW film I saw in theaters, and it was probably the best experience I’ve ever had seeing a movie on the big screen. I saw it three times, which I’ve never done before.

So that said, all I want for IX to get my enthusiasm back up for the series is to experience even a fraction of the elation that that film brought.

 

Have TLJ be in an alternate universe and then redo from there.

 

One problem IMHO is that through 6 films we learnt that, for all their flaws, the Jedi were the good guys. And bringing back a democratic order AKA New Republic to the GFFA was the goal of the "good guys". The last movie (before the ST) is EVEN called the RETURN OF THE JEDI. But then the ST has said "ignore the past, kill it if you have to" and wants to blur the lines on what is good and what is bad. The Jedi are bad. The Sith are not that bad. Han and Leia are bad (bad parents, bad spouses, etc). The foundation of what was Star Wars has been destroyed.

The Jedi way is not the way forward. The Republic is not the way forward. The good guys are bad (Holdo, Leia, Poe, Luke, Rey), the bad guys are not good either. The seedy traitor is just a seedy traitor. The republic enslaves children, the FO also enslaves children.

There's no-one to really root for. Or look for. What's the resolution?, what's the fight for?, the FO doesn't need to continue the fight. They already WON. The rebels/resistance have no resources to fight nor do they have any support or planets to fight for. Nor reason to do it either.

At this point in the story, there's little reason for Kylo to go after the remnants (one ship and a dozen people) of the Resistance. There's no reason for Leia and the dozen people to pick a fight with the FO. And they only have one ship. All they can do is run and hide with the tail between their legs.

Instead of the two previous movies building up to some conflict and resolution, the board has been reset. There's no Rebellion and the Empire is back on. Unless the plan is to set EPIX several years in the future and let other writers to fill in the blanks on how the Rebellion will be back on in EPIX I don't think that 1 movie is enough time to build up a credible Rebellion against the FO and also defeat them. Perhaps their best bet is that Rey marries Kylo and keeps him in check.

 

The VILLAIN of the movie said that. Why do so many people think the villain was telling the moral of the story? It's baffling. Luke (the good guy) ended the film by telling Kylo (and the audience) that the Jedi would live on.

 

It's through the whole story being told. Not just that quote alone. I could write a whole essay about how TFA and TLJ basically erode away at many of the aspects of the previous films but it's been done already. You have one way to look at it, and I have a different read on it. That is all. I don't say my way is the right one or correct one. That's why I start with IMHO which a quick google search will say stands for In My Humble Opinion.

EDIT: As a sidebar. In previous SW films the bad guys Tell the truth. It's the good guys that LIE or tell the truth, from a certain POV. So if Kylo is the bad guy it's supposed to be the truth based on previous SW films.

 

I do agree that letting the past die was a theme of TLJ, but I don't feel the film was ever saying that it was the "right" mentality.

For example, Luke talks about how "it's time for the Jedi to end," but that's only when he's at his low point (and, to be fair, he does raise some valid points-- the prequels showed us that the Jedi were flawed.) But, by the end of the film, when Luke finally gets out of his slump, he no longer believes it's time for the Jedi to end.

And yes, Kylo talks about "killing the past if you have to," but the ST has shown us multiple times that Kylo's not exactly the most reasonable or sane guy in the galaxy.

And as bad as Rose's little speech was on Crait, it again emphasized the theme of saving the things you love, not killing.

By the way, I really didn't mean to sound like I was attacking you (and I do apologize if it came out that way.) You're certainly not the only one who thinks the message of the movie was that the past should be killed. I've seen many, many people who agree with you. I just could never really understand why. To me, it's like watching Rocky III and thinking that the message of the film is that you should give up when you lose, simply because that's how Rocky felt at his low point in the movie.

Anyway, I don't want to drag this thread off-topic. I don't feel jaded about these films, so this thread isn't for me. I'll shut up now.

 

I must admit Iger's words today while did not completely address a lot of the angst out there among fandom, it was nice for a company like Disney to admit fault. I don't think it is going to help with Episode IX much as I think fans have made their mind up one way or the other if they want to see it but perhaps down the road it can help. Just my two cents but I think Iger sees the post Episode IX era to be a "reset time" for the franchise.

 

Iger only admitted fault as to the release of Solo, which caused a financial 'failure'. He didn't mention anything about TLJ, despite what people what to read into it.

 

I wouldn't say I'm jaded, but I have been underwhelmed by the films so far except for Rogue One but thats not part of this trilogy. I'd say I've moved on mostly, for me the Sequel Trilogy just isn't my Star Wars, which I'm okay with, it's a different generation's Star Wars. But it's just not something I can get emotionally involved in.

Will I see Episode 9? Maybe, but with no expectations. I'm happy enough getting my Star Wars fix in the old comics, books and games.

 

yes, this x1000!

 

I'm pretty much the same. I've realized that Star Wars isn't what it used to be and if that's the way it is, so be it. I still have the old movies and EU to enjoy. I didn't go to the theater to see Solo (TLJ really ruined the movie experience for me) and when I eventually saw it at home, it was tolerable at best IMO. Rogue One is probably the only Disney Star Wars movie that I somewhat enjoyed, despite some reservations. Frankly, however, the stuff with Vader probably made me like that movie more than it deserved. If there's any silver lining with the Disney Star Wars movies, it's that they have made me appreciate the PT much more.

All of that being said, I have to admit that I REALLY like the new Thrawn novels by Timothy Zahn. I also liked Claudia Grey's "Lost Stars" and thought "Bloodlines" was passable. The rest of the new Disney Star Wars novels that I've read, namely "Phasma", "Lords of the Sith", and "Aftermath", have sucked IMO. "Aftermath" was especially horrid and I refuse to read anything by Chuck Wendig again. It was atrocious!

Ok, I'll step off my soap box now. lol

 

An interesting question.

Having finally seen VIII and loving Mark’s performance -but not loving everything with Luke- in spite of understanding the failure theme, the biggest issue for me is making all of the characters compelling and adding something to Star Wars. I find it strange that some of the Marvel movies nail the characters, yet TPTB in the ‘LFL story group’ cannot.

After viewing VIII last week, nothing can taint my love for Luke and this universe no matter how hard Disney & Marvel tries.

I am not a fan of J.J.s outside of the 2009 Star Trek, but I no longer care what he does with IX. My anger has disappeared. I know Star Wars is trying to move beyond what I have loved and enjoyed for 41 years, I thought I was moving on myself. I am not in that I still adore Luke and the Jedi etc.

I suppose making me really like at least one of the new characters and direction would help considerably. I have no desire to follow these new characters and that still bugs me.

 

I can get behind this. I think 7 was decent and I didn't mind 8....but it would have been better with a little more backstory into what was actually going on. Okay, Snoke turned Ben's heart but how? I read the books and get the gist of how the First Order came to be but what about Snoke? IMO before he died (I'm not mad he did) they should of told us something. The scene when Ren kills him would have been more surprising if they would have gave us something to become invested in his character a little more. I was waiting the whole movie for some backstory then he died. Now I really don't care about his backstory. Also some more information on Luke and what he's done in the last 30 years not one night almost killing his nephew.