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JCC IMDb for Hollywood/Celebrity/Famous sexual predators

Discussion in 'Community' started by vin, Oct 30, 2017.

  1. harpua

    harpua Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2005
    Then, you're probably posting in the wrong thread, dude. This is the thread for talking about rapists, and such. If you can't deal with people wishing illness, etc upon a rapist, then yeah.... you should probably post in a happier thread.
     
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  2. Outsourced

    Outsourced Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 10, 2017
    In theory, I think that everyone should have a chance at rehabilitation. Our prison system is already too focused on punishment. Prisoners should have the resources to atone for what they've done and better themselves in a humane environment with minimal infringement to their rights.

    I do not think that about Weinstein. I hope very dearly that he is miserable for the rest of his days. He is the worst of society.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2020
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  3. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    Weinstein is the type of person who usually doesn't go to prison: rich.
     
  4. Diggy

    Diggy Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Don’t care if he’s happy, in fact hope he isn’t. It’s a state of mind he simply doesn’t deserve. He has wrought untold misery on countless others, why does he deserve happiness from any rational point of view?

    And maybe the outside hospital visits are usual throughout prisons for panic attacks. I suspect they aren’t and he is still getting preferential treatment because he’s high profile. Another thing he does not deserve.
     
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  5. MrZAP

    MrZAP Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 2, 2007
    Let me put it this way.

    I do not think Weinstein should be leaving prison anytime soon. I am uncomfortable with the concept of indefinite sentences for anyone, but that's not necessarily an issue here.

    We don't have to try to rehabilitate Weinstein. If he makes his own initiative, great, though I'm not holding my breath.

    He should absolutely be prevented from harming others going forward, of course, or, frankly, exercising the power and resources that enabled him. In other words I'm all for taking his stuff and redistributing it. And of course on a larger systemic level there's lots to do.

    I don't want inhumane conditions for anyone in prison regardless of who they are or how long they are expected to stay. I'm not saying luxury. I'm saying everyone is afforded basic decency even if they didn't give it themselves, even if they irreparably harmed others, because that doesn't invalidate their status at living beings deserving of it. Every living human deserves a baseline of decent living- not as defined by them but by a minimal baseline- simply by merit of being a living human being. That cannot be taken away, period. It's a slightly smaller argument for my well-documented issues with death, but it's a lot of the same reasoning.

    So I'll demand that we make sweeping societal changes. I'll demand that we punish rapists and other transgressors and anyone who victimizes others, and stop them from being able to continue doing so. I'll demand that we make sure victims (or survivors, if you wish) be taken care of and are afforded every kind of help we can possibly give, for as long as they could possibly need or want. But I won't ever, ever engage in schadenfreude or anything that could be construed as happiness or a desire to see others suffer, even if I dislike them and everything they stand for, which in Weinstein's case I do. It's just antithetical to my ethics. The argument for it I just have to reject out of hand. And yes I will be and am disappointed in those who disagree, though I don't expect people to care because I'm just a guy.

    So in Weinstein's case I still hope he doesn't die, and makes a full recovery, and can find some semblance of fulfillment with his current circumstances, though I'm never going to call for them to change. It is more important that he can no longer be a victimizer than that he is unhappy. I think most people here agree with that statement at least.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2020
  6. Diggy

    Diggy Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Survivor if you wish.

    [face_plain]

    he also does not deserve to feel “fulfilled” on any level. He does not deserve peace on any level, however repentant he becomes. He had his “fun” with wild abandon. I do t wish him dead, I just don’t care on any level whatsoever if he lives or dies.
     
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  7. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    What he did was bad and he should feel bad. He can never be rehabilitated, atone, find or even seek any sort of redemption without feeling bad and being unhappy first. You probably should be panicking when you sexually assault and rape people for half your life and then it finally catches up to you. If he dies from this, he will have died at his own hands due to his own mistreatment of others.
     
  8. harpua

    harpua Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2005
    hope he gets atm peen, on a regular basis.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2020
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  9. MrZAP

    MrZAP Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 2, 2007
    See I'm basically on board till the very end of that statement, just because of the death thing. Death happens to people. It's a calamity subjected to them by the tyranny of nature which has cursed us with mortality, and we don't deserve it for anything. But I don't want to get into this because that's not what this thread is about.

    Still, I agree with the main part of your statement. I don't think he shouldn't feel bad for what he's done, or that I don't want him to, though I'm not expecting it and frankly don't necessarily require it. I don't think rehabilitation is ever strictly impossible, for anyone, who did anything, but that's not relevant because I'm not calling for his rehabilitation. I just mean at the end of the day he doesn't deserve to be forever miserable, because forever is forever, and deserves a basic level of compassion in his care. I'm not sure I'm communicating this effectively.

    But at the same time, I think that if he felt completely the same about everything and didn't feel bad, but we could also somehow guarantee that he couldn't or wouldn't do anything again I wouldn't be opposed to releasing him right now (though I would freeze his assets regardless, probably give him a studio apartment and an ankle bracelet... I dunno; this isn't my thing), because punishment for the sake of punishment is archaic and just... irrational. I don't think such a guarantee is possible, of course, but that's the theory.

    I was trying to be inclusive. I don't think either word is accepted by everyone and people who have been raped use both. More importantly, I wanted to included those who did not survive and those who did. Admittedly I'm not close to an expert on this.
     
  10. Diggy

    Diggy Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2013
    Going back to this; a reply to Rae’s post, in Which she explicitly said she did not want him to die. You were arguing against something that wasn’t posted. And it was downhill from there.

    you have a weird hang up and dislike of death.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2020
  11. harpua

    harpua Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2005
    yeah, i mean, death is as natural as it gets... just as natural as birth. i don't understand your odd hang up with death.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2020
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  12. MrZAP

    MrZAP Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 2, 2007
    I could (and have before) discuss it at length, but I don't think this is the right place for it. I wasn't accusing anyone of wanting his death, and I appreciate Rae's statement, but I can still take issue with others saying they don't care. To me that's literally just as bad as actively wanting it. And regardless, people were saying they wanted him to suffer, and that's also bad and why I brought up things in the first place. Regarding the death thing I was really just commenting that the argument is from the same place, more or less, as an aside. The only response I will give on that matter to Kristie is that natural =/= good or right or acceptable. Obviously.

    Regarding my larger comments, I've been thinking about it and I have this to say. I really hate the idea of people calling for- or just being accepting of- suffering or harm, and it is a moral issue for me that I feel would be wrong for me not to respond to. I think it's easy for people to feel sorry for people who can only be seen as victims and who didn't do anything wrong, easy to value the life of someone you care about or is perceived as having done good. It's much harder to do so for people perceived as bad, or who have harmed others. And it's natural, and certainly human, to not do so out of instinct. But I think valuing those people, as well as those perceived as good, is fundamental, and not doing so is dehumanizing and devalues the perception of life for everyone. That's why I'll sometimes make what I know is an unpopular argument on this topic. For example, something that sticks in my mind and I think about sometimes is how I remember on reddit a few years ago immediately after the Vegas massacre I was in a reaction thread and I saw a bunch of people saying they were glad the guy was dead, and I had to respond, and had largely the same response as here. It went on for awhile, longer than I cared for it really, and yeah I got thrashed for it, but I still know I was right and the people celebrating someone's death were wrong. What I'm saying is if you value people, just people, I think you need to value everyone, always, all the time, no matter what, whether we're talking about life and death, or just suffering and general well-being, and perhaps even happiness, maybe. That applies to Harvey Weinstein too. I can say that without liking him or condoning his actions or wanting him to go free, and with all the empathy in the world for those he targeted and with a sincere desire to make sure they and others like them get help and emotional support. These things are not contradictory for me, and I don't really see why they should be for anyone, frankly.

    The one thing I have been thinking about most though since yesterday, and that does give me pause, is how I should be commenting here, or if I should at all, in relation to others here who may be dealing with trauma. I'm sure there's a higher proportion in this thread that would fall under that category. I still feel my comments were correct. But I don't want to inadvertently cause greater suffering to trauma victims in the thread by what I'm saying. On a fundamental level I dislike the idea of being further traumatized by the suggestion that someone shouldn't suffer, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to ignore suffering said by my words, and obviously it's more complicated than that anyway. I know that. It's frustrating to me, because I have an active interest in the thread, and I don't feel like I can't respond when something comes up like that, on a moral level, if I see it. I feel compelled to say something. So maybe the best move is to just say my interest doesn't matter, and I can find other venues, and to unwatch the thread and move on. But I suppose I had to give a last response and say my piece first, because I have the annoying compulsive desire to be precisely understood, and maybe it's worth it.
     
  13. harpua

    harpua Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2005
    way too long.... read about a third.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2020
  14. Juliet316

    Juliet316 SFTC NFL Bonanza Winner star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    As a child rape survivor, my thoughts on Weinstein pretty much boil down to: "let him rot in jail the rest of his (probably short) life."
     
  15. Juliet316

    Juliet316 SFTC NFL Bonanza Winner star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
  16. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    That means it's likely circulating through the prison system. I wonder why Weinstein got tested and regular prisoners do not. :confused:
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2020
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  17. Juliet316

    Juliet316 SFTC NFL Bonanza Winner star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Probably because of his pre - existing respiratory issues from previous hospital visits.
     
  18. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2002
    I was being sarcastic. It's because he's rich and despite everything still has more status than normal people.
     
  19. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    Alex Salmond found not guilty
     
  20. Bilbo Fett

    Bilbo Fett Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 19, 2017
  21. Coruscant

    Coruscant Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Is anyone looking at #opdeatheaters on Twitter?
     
  22. Juliet316

    Juliet316 SFTC NFL Bonanza Winner star 10

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    Uh, no, I thought it was likely something to do with some stupid racist op-ed about the protests (most of my twitter trends - and I don't like the way Twitter recently redid them - have something to do with the protests in some way, shape, or form)

    Edit: WHOA!
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
  23. Coruscant

    Coruscant Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
  24. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    is Prince Andrew in it?
     
  25. Coruscant

    Coruscant Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Yep, as “Duke of York.”