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The Mandalorian Imperial Remnants & the First Order

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Current and Future Shows' started by Jedi Knight Fett, Nov 22, 2019.

  1. Bor Mullet

    Bor Mullet Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2018
    No, Mando takes place five years after ROTJ, which is just one year after the Battle of Jakku.
    The simpler explanation is that the show is entirely filmed in LA.

    But don’t worry. The Cassian show will be filmed in London, so the Imperials will be British again! ;)
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2020
  2. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    No the battle of Jakku happens ONE YEAR after Return of the Jedi so that would mean four years after the battle of Jakku
     
  3. Bor Mullet

    Bor Mullet Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Sorry! Thanks for that correction. This means Sloane’s time is essentially over, correct? I can’t remember. What happened to her?
     
  4. DurararaFTW

    DurararaFTW Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2014
    We don't know what happened to her, but she was still a part of the First Order by the time Phasma made captain.
     
  5. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    I hadn’t noticed, but yea it’s possible most of his forces were recruited from the outer rim
     
    Bor Mullet and godisawesome like this.
  6. Darth Chuck Norris

    Darth Chuck Norris Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2014
    I misspoke in my comment. I should have said IF this is the reformation of the Empire into the FO and they're able to fund Gideon this well already, it's happening way too quickly. And with them speaking of a new era, they're giving off the impression that either the Empire still wields massive power, or they have already reformed into the First Order. Neither of which should be possible at this point in the timeline.
     
  7. DurararaFTW

    DurararaFTW Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2014
    Well Han's from the Core and he speaks American. Most Stormtroopers are depicted with American accents too.
     
  8. Ithorians

    Ithorians Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Indeed. I think maybe this isn't about the Empire being reorganized quickly, but simply the fact is that it didn't dissolve like a vitamin c tablet after Endor. Gideon´s forces may have skipped Jakku altogether, and in that case, you have a perfectly functioning army, already organized and fiercely fanatic, with all the recourses available from the planets it still holds. In that scenario, Gideon not is the leader of the Empire, but just leading a faction, much like Ardus Kaine, Zsinj, Hethrir and all those Legends warlords...
     
  9. DurararaFTW

    DurararaFTW Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2014
    By the time of Jakku more then half the Imperial fleet had either been destroyed or surrendered already. Of the remaining less then half, a quarter was absconded with by Rax for his plans, the bulk of the other quarter was under Sloane's command. And of what's left after Jakku still has the entire New Republic fleet to deal with, which was already greater then what the Empire had left by Jakku, now by itself. And by then the war was over and being an Imperial is the same as being a war criminal. Gideon would not just have availability to all resources he did as Moff, those planets are known to the New Republic and is not already liberated, they'd go right to work fixing that.
     
  10. Ithorians

    Ithorians Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Maybe so, but in my experience usually generalizations work better as a plan than as a reality. Are we sure Gideon didn't left the worlds under his forces command with all the resourses he could gather after Endor? Or that people like the Client aren´t in fact fanatic loyalists that used to govern planets and pledged their resourses in exchange from protection from the New Republic? Or that Gideon is, in fact, raiding planets in the Outer Rim that the NR, not being an all powerful force (this has been actually established in the series) simply cannot defend? There are a lot of maybes, to say that the only possible solution is that the First Order is already formed and that its Palpatine bringing resources to Gideon. In fact, if we are saying that the NR has basically obliterated the Empire, were are those resourses coming from? Exegol? How did the money get there in the first place without being traced? A lot of questions, a lot of potential for world building and interesting explanations, I think...
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2020
    Bor Mullet likes this.
  11. DurararaFTW

    DurararaFTW Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2014
    Just on Nevarro alone, there were dozens if not hundreds of Stormtroopers not even under Gideon's direct command that can afford to clean their armor, unlike The Client's men. For that matter, the captain of a Gozanti freighter can do better. I doubt the Client was ever at the level of planetary governor, he was clearly faaar lower in the echelons of Gideon's organisation then we thought.

    The NR decommisioned 90% of their forces in the time following Jakku, they aren't all powerful anymore, they all but used to be. But all that didn't happen overnight. If Moff Gideon's fleet has remained intact ever since Endor and has never left known space, then it begs the question why the NR thought it was such a good idea to not deal with Moff Gideon in the first place. Neither he, nor his ships are some unknown quantity in the galaxy. If what the forces under his command were at the time of the Emperor's death are mostly gone, that changes things. That Gideon raiding planets in the Outer Rim for supplies in this era where the NR is not equipped to mount a swift response seems likely, but that doesn't justify what we hear in this episode. If Gideon is capable of ushering in a new era all by himself then Palpatine must have left shipyards and massive bases and fleets under his command that no one that surrendered or was captured by the Republic knew about. And unlike all those other projects Palpatine is happy to leave Gideon to thrive in complete autonomy.

    OR they talk about the new era because they do know what else is going on. Seems like a way simpler explanation to me.
     
  12. Ithorians

    Ithorians Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2016
    I understood that they assumed Gideon dead. Maybe they cannot find him (its the Outer Rim, after all) or maybe they aren't even looking for him. The fact that the Remnant has a base of operations on Nevarro makes me think that simply the NR doesn't know about them in detail.
    About where the resources are coming from, that's what I was saying. Gideon isn't necessarily the top man that unifies the whole Empire to still have financial and logistic assets. The Client, in fact, could perfectly not be part of the Empire´s formal structure at all, but a fanatic coming from a political or commercial arena. My point is, Gideon isn't suddenly going to be stripped of everything after Endor/Jakku just because the Empire as a whole fell. Could be the case of many, but its not obligatory to be so for every imperial around, I think.
     
  13. DurararaFTW

    DurararaFTW Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 5, 2014
    The base at Nevarro had a skeleton crew, Star Destroyers have crew counts into the tens of thousands of people. It would take population numbers far greater then what is available in Karga's outpost to feed even one of them. Gideon would've had a whole bunch of Star Destroyers as Moff. Regardless of whether he personally is believed dead, if his whole fleet is still active, the NR would know about it.

    I imagine Gideon was thought to have died with the majority of his fleet, which did largely get destroyed or surrendered. Thus he is able to move unnoticed now.
     
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  14. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    The Timeline as we know it so far is

    Sloane with Hux Sr and Jr took the the Emperor's Super Star Destroyer the Eclipse and went into the Unknown Regions.

    After some time they were rendezvous with Snoke and apparently Imp Reinforcements.

    With Snoke's aid they began to conquer and settle the Unknown Regions creating a power base and slowly over time develop the First Order

    After more time Snoke outmaneuvered various Imperial Officers who thought they would be Supreme Leader until becoming Supreme Leader.

    According to the TLJ novelization the Rise of the First Order was more improve then grand master plan, so it could be quite a messy rise before we get to TFA and Starkiller. Or at least Bloodline.
     
  15. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    A moff doesn’t have fleets per day that would be grand admirals. Moffs would be in control of systems or sectors
     
  16. Snafu55

    Snafu55 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 19, 2015
    Moffs very well can have fleets, they did in legends, and that has been reconfirmed by the fact that each Moff has a sector group of combined imperial forces. In the Thrawn comic at least each governor had an imperial admiral under their command.

    Also, Grand admirals are not at all the only ones with their own fleets. The rank of Grand Admiral is a much rare title with only 12 existing at anyone time, there can't be only 12 fleets... Even in the first Thrawn Novel the 7th Fleet is commanded by Fleet Admiral Sartan before Thrawn ever got the rank of Grand Admiral. I imagine all moffs have their own sector fleets.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2020
  17. godisawesome

    godisawesome Sequel Trilogy Manager star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2010
    I like to think that the bulk of Gideon’s remaining logistics are primarily ground- and planet-based compared to what a usual Imperial Moff would be able to call on during the height of the Empire. I’m enjoying the idea of his flagship being something as a sturdy, reliable, but somewhat undersized cruiser, and that his main tactics right now are more about running a kind of “shadow empire” underground.

    Not only does it play up the “warlord” and “remnant” aspect, but it also means he gets to use more obscure designs.
     
  18. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    Well I guess we know now that Thrawn is still operating and by the looks of thing he still runs a pretty nasty shift. Or at least allies with some shady people. Curious where his territory is.
     
  19. Tan-Wessel

    Tan-Wessel Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 31, 2001
    Keep the dirty First Order and its teenagers away from Thrawn.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  20. BalanceOfTheForce

    BalanceOfTheForce Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 18, 2016
    I think right now we have 4 remnants?

    Gideon's forces, Thrawn's forces (if they aren't connected to Gideon), The First Order and The Final Order/Sith Eternal.
     
  21. Fredrik Vallestrand

    Fredrik Vallestrand Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 15, 2018
    I might be wrong, but i think Thrawn might have the largest of empire remnant forces, most his 7th fleet might still be around. Maybe he has a certain jedi as prisoner.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  22. Tan-Wessel

    Tan-Wessel Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 31, 2001
    Yeah, I think Ezra is broken. Whenever Sabine and Ahsoka get him back, they're going to have to rehab and bring his mind back.
     
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  23. StarWarsFan91

    StarWarsFan91 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Would be a good way for Ezra to have a role post RoTJ while keeping Luke the last Jedi.

    Maybe he did some not so good things and because of it gave up his jedi status.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  24. Fredrik Vallestrand

    Fredrik Vallestrand Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 15, 2018
    Or he can be a more grey like and Thrawn has used him.
     
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  25. Jedi Master Scorpio

    Jedi Master Scorpio Star Wars Television star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 24, 2015
    So many questions for sure. I'm still not sure the First Order would be a group that Thrawn would want to align with.
     
    Bor Mullet likes this.