Discussion in 'Lucasfilm Ltd. In-Depth Discussion' started by Doom Trooper, Jan 22, 2018.
Or maybe he thought it was a chemical reaction or something like that
My headcanon is that Shiva took over from the "You've betrayed Shiva!" to Indy catching the Sankara Stone but I think the actual explanation was that Indy was reading the Sanskrit parchment or something.
I chalk it up that he simply didn't want to risk his credentials being revoked if he were to tell the others at the university what he saw and experienced during his time at India. He surely would've been written off and risked having his teaching license and credentials revoked for telling such an out there tale, even if it was true. So he kept quiet about his experiences.
Indy is a scientist. I'm sure he convinced himself after (TOD) that there was a scientific explanation to it all. Until the Ark was opened.
Yah and his whole possession bit as well but maybe Indy was simply mind-wiped that whole bit.
He probably remembered the mine cart chase cause that was fun.
TOD is my favourite Indiana Jones movie. In fact I was introduced to Indiana Jones as a kid. But like Star Wars I like all the Indiana Jones movies equally.
For me it's a tie between the first and the 2nd, with the third not far behind.
TOD has always been my favorite. I enjoy the whole series as well, but TOD is tops for me. So many of the series' best and most iconic moments alone are in this one movie. Some may not like it's darker tone and mood but that's one of the things I've always enjoyed about it so much. Between that and it's more occult-oriented storyline and how it's the most pulpy-feeling film of the series. Spielberg and co. were firing on all cylinders when they made it.
TOD comes across exactly as it was probably intended, like an episode in a 1930s action series. In fact I'm surprised someone clever enoguh hasn't split this film into 20 minute episodes on youtube and ended each with a cliff hanger before the next episode starts.
Lucas actually gives a pretty good explanation of Indy's mindset in the Raiders story conference transcript:
Now, on top of that, I have added, I thought it would be interesting to have him be a sort of expert in the occult, as an offshoot of the anthropological side of this thing. He has a tendency to get into situations where there are taboos, voodoos, things, especially when you start dealing with pyramids you get into all that. So he sort of studies it because he's gotten mixed up with it. A study of ancient religions and voodoo and all that kind of stuff. He's a guy who sort of checks out ghosts and psychic phenomenon in connection with the kind of things he does. He's a sort of archeological exorcist. When somebody has a haunted house, or a haunted temple, and nobody will go near it, he is the one who will go in there and do it, and he has dealt with... Assuming that he believes in the supernatural because he deals with it, he is the one they send into the haunted house. Like one of these haunted house professors who try and figure out why a house is haunted. He does that. He gets involved with sacred temples and curses and all that stuff. And actually some were real, he came across some real curses and stuff. He said hey, this is really interesting. A lot of the times they are hoaxes. And he can figure it out. This is just a general history of where he comes from. People will use the pharaohs or a curse, and something will happen. People will walk through this particular temple and they will die twenty-four hours later. Nobody knows why. The curse of Mabutu is on that place. Well, he looks at it and sees that there's a fissure in the thing and there's a deadly gas that's coming out of the ground. Because he's an intelligent professor, he knows his science and he can sort of deduce a hoax.
So basically Indy approaches all this stuff like a scientist. Sometimes he comes across real supernatural stuff like in Temple of Doom and he accepts it, but he's come across enough hoaxes that he's still very skeptical of any wild supernatural claims. Now, I think the line of dialogue in the actual Raiders film was intended to give the connotation that Indy doesn't believe in any of that stuff, because that was simpler for a stand-alone movie with a classic skeptic-to-believer arc, but with Temple of Doom I think we can assume that Lucas (if he even thought about it) didn't want to be constrained and went back to the original idea that Indy has a long history of encountering this sort of stuff. But just because one myth turns out to be real doesn't mean they're all real. We see evidence of this mindset again in Last Crusade, where at the beginning Indy doesn't seem to fully believe in the Grail either. His characterization allows for Indy to undergo a skeptic-to-believer arc in each movie.
TOD is a very bold sequel. It is nothing like Raiders, which was my one criticism of Last Crusade (I liked LC, but it was almost a remake of Raiders.) The music is great, Ford has never looked better and the set pieces are breathtaking.
That'd be a good project for fans to do, actually. Of all the Indy films it's the one that most feels like the vintage 1930s/40s adventure serials in so many ways and this would be a fun project to do. And next year is TOD's 35th anniversary, this would be a neat way to honor it.
That seems to have been somewhat of a trend with threequels. There are a handful of trilogies from that era in which the third film is very similar to the first. Last Crusade, as you mentioned, is very similar to Raiders with, unfortunately, some slapstick thrown into the mix. Return of the Jedi rehashes elements from A New Hope. Back to the Future Part III is very similar to the original Back to the Future. The Karate Kid Part III is very similar to the original Karate Kid.
It's interesting, and probably not coincidental, that the original Star Wars trilogy and the first three Indy films follow a very similar arc with the first and third films in both series being very similar to one another in both story structure and tone and the middle film in both series being that dark middle chapter.
Another cool thing about TOD, the character IJ actually has grown, has undergone some changes. Of course I know TOD is technically a prequel, still I noticed some nice character development there. In Raiders I get the impression Jones only cares about lifeless objects, not so much human beings. We see him looking sad in a bar after Marion "died", but that's it. 5 minutes later he just got up to chase after his treasure again, maybe not giving her another thought. But in TOD he isn't really after treasures, he actually cared about those enslaved children. There was nothing in it for him when he returned those stones to the village. And that one line, "let's get out of here, ALL of us", followed by that expression on his face - a combination of pity, anger, disgust and determination - in the next shot, simply priceless! This is Indiana at his best and most "badass", and ironically also his most caring and human. Also his face shows he is really upset and emotionally affected when still in the village he translates "children...he says they stole their children". He actually swallows when he says that, showing there are things for him way more important than adding another piece to a museum collection. TOD Indy is far more human than the Raiders one.
He is no longer just a "tomb raider" but also savior of children now, a similar development from selfish ANH Han to a caring ROTJ one. It's just too bad Spielberg doesn't like this movie. Yes, it's dark but it's also uplifting and redeeming.
The entire film has a dream like quality to it, and I mean that in the best possible way. From Indy descending the stairs at the start like James Bond to the otherworldly qualities of Pancott Palace, everything is a bit surreal.
Beautifully worded and right on the money. It's truly a shame Spielberg looks down so much on TOD. I wonder when was the last time he's seen it? If he hasn't seen it in years or perhaps even since the 80s, he'd be wise to re-visit it soon with an open mind and see how good is truly is and all of the good things he accomplished with it. I know at the time he made it he was going through a difficult time in his personal life which likely conflicted with the shoot and his mood during production, which could've also clouded his outlook at the time, but I think he'd be long overdue to re-visit it all these years later with a new set of eyes if he hasn't done so in a long time.
One of my fav lines in the movie is from Short Round
"I very little! You cheat very big!"
That has probably much to do with it being less grounded in reality than Raiders or Crusade, and like Doom Trooper says, harking much more to a comic-book / pulpy roots type of movie. That is what I absolutely love about it, it is really whimsical, right from the off with the "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom" title that shows up behind Willie now in that comic-book font that we all know and love. (Wasn't used in Raiders, and probably wouldn't have looked right)
Occasionally, film makers strike pure gold, and they just create this fabulous piece of cinema where absolutely everything is right. The story, the characters, the aesthetic, the stunts, the set-pieces, the cast, the music, the action etc
Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom is one of those movies.
I'd like the see a grown up Short Round in the next one....what if he was the new villain? That would be a nice twist, although sad.
I'd love to see Short Round back in the next film but as Indy's sidekick again. Him as a villain, can't really see it and it wouldn't make sense to me.
Seeing Short Round back would be a nice way to close out the series. Willie too.
I wouldn't mind Willie being back but with the hugely negative reception she got I wouldn't hold my breath. Though I do like her character and feel like I'm one of the few who doesn't mind her. I get her non-stop screaming and shrieking gets annoying for some but I find her funny and many of her scenes give me a good chuckle. I say that as someone who usually can't stand comic relief characters. Short Round back to assist Indy on his final adventure would be a great and fitting way to wrap up the saga.
She's the anti-Marion Ravenwood when the film begins, but her character has an arc. She's pretty superficial, but when faced with adversity, what does she do? She punches that thuggee right off of the mine car and saves the day. I like her.