PT Is it illegal to be a Sith ?

wasn't it Panaka that told him about the marriage to Anakin? in the eu anyway.
it's not out the realms of possibility the chancellor of the Republic to know things he technically shouldn't....he isn't some peddler on the street.
I mean Padme and Anakin were idiots to have C-3PO present for crying out loud...

you don't already? it's only a small group of fans that don't. I say this as someone who likes the PT for the most part.

 

I do not think the Jedi are dumb. Those who think so misunderstand the prequels

He might have learned of the marriage. But Panaka couldn’t tell him that anakin is troubled by nightmares of her death. And it’s established later that Palpatine can telepathically mess with him

 

or misunderstand the OT

BUT this isn't the thread for this debate

 

Yet, that is what happens. That is what they do. That is why the Sith want the Younglings dead and why Palpatine wants Luke dead or turned. That's why the Jedi hid the twins.

Anakin, like all Force users, can sense the thoughts and feelings of others. He sensed that Palpatine was telling the truth. Not to mention that he said, "I can feel your anger", something only a Force user says. Palpatine knows what Anakin is feeling because he is not hiding his thoughts and feelings around him. Remember what Obi-Wan said.

OBI-WAN: "Your insight serves you well. Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they can be made to serve the Emperor."

 

No. What Anakin says is that he's been trained to use the dark side, and that Palpatine is the sith they've been looking for, in the grand scheme of things, I think likely the one that Dooku said was behind the invasion of Naboo and the Trade Federation. In this, I'd argue they have reason to believe this and seek to arrest him, saying that the senate will decide his fate. The goal here, I think, is to arrest him for his crimes of what he's done, that while they can't personally prove, are acting on the word of another jedi of theirs. Palpatine then shows himself by resisting arrest and outright killing the other jedi.

We can debate the jedi's protocol here: Them coming in on just the word of Anakin, but I think it tracks that they're arresting him for the crimes he committed as a sith, not just being a sith.

 

what do you mean "no"

I stated a direct quote from the movie.

Do you have a different copy of ROTS or something?

 

No as in they know more than that he can use The Force. Dagenspear directly quotes the rest of what Anakin tells them, that he’s been trained to use the dark side and Anakin believes he’s the Sith Lord they’ve been looking for

 

yes key word there "believes"

no where in their conversation were the words sith ever used

but we are going around around in circles, so I'm out,

life is to short for this sort of rubbish

 

indeed it is

 

The only reason the conversation kept going in circles is because y’all kept doubting what the movie shows. I never debated that they were going off of Anakin’s word,

 

I think at that point Mace was kind of like

 

The mental gymnastics is astoundingly awful. You're trying to rewrite the story to dig yourself out of a hole. The bottom line is that Anakin put two and two together and got four. Palpatine confessed to being a Sith Lord and Anakin realizes that makes him the very same person that Dooku told Obi-Wan about.

 

The overall point that I was making was that I think Mace was arresting Palpatine based on the suspicion of him being the one who was behind the trade federation and the invasion of Naboo, within the reasoning of just the movies, not just based on him being a sith, but for his crimes. I think it's based on suspicion, which I think in real life cops can arrest someone based on that. Though Mace's fear of what Palpatine may do to the jedi, which is what I think drives to act so quickly in this situation, may have been based moreso on him being a sith.

 

yeah, no

I'm going by what is in the movie:

I can translate the scene word for word, but I'm sure I don't have to, you've seen it.

no he did not, this is the crux of the issue

I'm not trying to rewrite the story because Palpatine did not confess this: he confessed to knowing the dark-side,
had he replied "yes Anakin, you are right, I am the sith Lord" I would concede your point.

 

As far as the movies are concerned, Palpatine confessing to knowing the dark side means he’s the Sith Lord. That’s the only explanation for who could teach him.

And you’re forgetting that he does in fact imply to Anakin that Darth Plagueis was his mentor

 

But as we know, TCW is apparently canon (not that I agree with that, but I don't make the rules) so there is a whole plethora of people who could have taught him, from acolytes to night sisters.
And believe me I'd like nothing more than a MOVIE ONLY CANON policy on these movie boards...but it hasn't been that way for over 20 years.

Imply maybe, but no actual evidence.

Which brings me back to the original point, call it 'mental gymnastics' all you like, it's not as black and white as you all make it seem,

and since we keep going around and around on this...(a bit like the Mace Vs Sidious thread) I don't know what else there is to discuss.

 

Think about it - Palpy is doing this, he's baiting them.

 

Cause Palpatine knows the Jedi are smart enough to take the bait, they’re not going to think “oh he probably took nightsister meditation seminars on weekends”

 

you do realise "taking the bait" and "smart" don't belong in the same sentence right?

speaking of

should Dandelo take the bait with this comment?

 

I understand the irony. But in this case they do belong in the same sentence.

“I sense a trap” “next move, spring the trap” -Jedi modus operandi.

Palpatine absolutely is baiting the Jedi to arrest him. But the Jedi have no alternative but to take the bait since the other option is to sit and wait to be executed

this is a theme of the prequels George has noted, situations where the Jedi are tricked into taking actions that help Sidious because the alternative is not acceptable

 

Again with the gymnastics. The fact Palpatine doesn't say, "Actually, I am a Nightbrother" is the tip off he is a Sith.

PALPATINE: "Did you ever hear the tragedy of Darth Plagueis “the wise”?"

ANAKIN: "No."

PALPATINE: "I thought not. It’s not a story the Jedi would tell you. It’s a Sith legend. Darth Plagueis was a Dark Lord of the Sith, so powerful and so wise he could use the Force to influence the Midichlorians to create life … He had such a knowledge of the dark side that he could even keep the ones he cared about from dying."

ANAKIN: "He could actually save people from death?"

PALPATINE: "The dark side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural."

ANAKIN: "What happened to him?"

PALPATINE: "He became so powerful . . . the only thing he was afraid of was losing his power, which eventually, of course, he did. Unfortunately, he taught his apprentice everything he knew, then his apprentice killed him in his sleep. Plagueis never saw it coming. It’s ironic he could save others from death, but not himself."

ANAKIN: "Is it possible to learn this power?"

PALPATINE: "Not from a Jedi."


PALPATINE: "Only through me can you achieve a power greater than any Jedi. Learn to know the dark side of the Force, Anakin, and you will be able to save your wife from certain death."

ANAKIN: "What did you say?"

PALPATINE: "Use my knowledge, I beg you . . ."

ANAKIN: "You’re a Sith Lord!"

Since Palpatine doesn't contradict him, that is an admission.

 

in law-101, no it isn't

this is my last post in this thread,

anyone quoting me will be ignored, so save your wrists and fingers typing a response.

 

it is irrelevant whether it’s an admission legally. The Jedi are correct in acting outside the law

 

Yeah, no. Criminals are prosecuted and convicted without ever saying 'I'm guilty" or "I did it". If he was captured and put on trial, he would be questioned during trial about what he meant when he said what he said. This, combined with evidence seized and possibly Maul's testimony would be enough to convict.

 

Maul's dead.