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Rogue One Is Rogue One a True Spin-off?

Discussion in 'Anthology' started by tokilamockingbrd, Dec 18, 2016.

  1. DBPirate

    DBPirate Jedi Master star 4

    Jun 20, 2015
    It is a spin-off in the way that it doesn't focus on the Skywalkers, but I think it certainly fits in with the greater saga far better than the Han Solo movie will, no matter its quality. Rogue One expands on the opening crawl of ANH while the Han Solo film will just be a random story in a galaxy far, far away and will have little to no effect on the main series.

    I agree with Darth Basin. Rogue One adds a deeper meaning and bigger sense of scope that ANH really needed in my opinion.
  2. Vasco_Rojo

    Vasco_Rojo Jedi Knight star 1

    Apr 21, 2016
    Yes, RO is a true spin off

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
  3. GregMcP

    GregMcP Force Ghost star 5

    Jul 7, 2015
    It created a pretty thorough mythology of its own. A world of characters beyond its two hours on screen.

    You can create stories within the Rogue One universe, as we already see in a number of books. Fan fictioneers can write within it.

    It feels different in tone to the Prequel or Luke Skywalker or Clone Wars sagas. It's its own thing.

    So. Yes.

    PS, I think the Han Solo film will do a similar thing. It's own mood, rules, background. The fact that it has new actors will reinforce that. If they do a sequel to it, that movie will belong to the Han Solo Universe, rather than the Skywalker or Rogue stories.
    Gigoran Monk likes this.
  4. Samuel Vimes

    Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Sep 4, 2012
    If this has been asked before I am sorry but question;

    How well would RO work to someone that has not seen any SW movie?

    If a person that knows next to nothing about SW and watched this film, would it work?
    Would it make sense?

    I think they might be rather lost.

    As for it being a true spinn-off, I don't fully agree.
    Companion piece might be better.

    To quote myself from the BO-thread.
    Bye for now.
    Blackboard Monitor
  5. Qui-Riv-Brid

    Qui-Riv-Brid Force Ghost star 5

    Apr 18, 2013
    The decision was made for them so they have little say in the matter.

    It is a true spin-off what it is not is a stand-alone.

    It's a in the middle (of ROTS and ANH).

    In future saga watches it's a great piece to have in a way that other movies won't be. Even an Obi-Wan movie probably won't be this relevant.

    Same for ROTS. I would say it fits far better with the PT than the OT by at least 2/3rd's.

    It's hard to imagine that if SW only existed as the OT that R1 could ever be the movie it is. The tone and texture are wrong.

    Couldn't exist without the PT either as a matter of fact.

    ANH is the only real stand alone in conception since Lucas didn't think he would make another since it was going to fail at the box office. Though he did hold out hope for some low budget sequel hence Vader's escape.

    ROTS is that to both R1 and ANH.

    Once R1 comes out I am going to do the Imperial trilogy of ROTS, R1 and ANH.
  6. TheManFromMortis

    TheManFromMortis Jedi Master star 3

    Nov 19, 2012
    _ _ _ _

    I will confess that after going to an opening night/midnight showing of Rogue One, I did then put ANH on when I got home, just to see how Rogue One segued into ANH. I do think Rogue One really adds something to ANH, particularly an explanation as to why Vader is some pissed-off at the beginning of ANH.
    Darkslayer and Sarge like this.
  7. Binary_Sunset

    Binary_Sunset Force Ghost star 5

    Oct 28, 2000
    Some of the old hands here might remember my unique (for this board) take on Star Wars: The 1977 Star Wars movie is (humanly speaking) the perfect movie, the best movie ever made. All the other Star Wars films fundamentally disappoint me. They feel to me as though they take place in different universes than does the 1977 film. I've felt this way ever since I first read Marvel's ESB comic adaptation a month or so before ESB was released in theatres. (For that matter, the other Star Wars comics I read in the 1970s also felt off to me.)

    But with Rogue One we finally have a Star Wars movie that mostly fits with the 1977 film. It feels to me as though it takes place in the same universe. While Rogue One is imperfect, it has done a far better job than any other movie (excepting the '77 one, natch) or book.

    So what is Rogue One? It is a picture frame. It frames the original Star Wars movie.

    In this analogy, the 1977 Star Wars is the finest painting ever done. The makers of Rogue One, wisely realizing that perfection can't be topped, instead opted to make the best picture frame they could for this finest painting. They decided on its size, color, surface, design, etc. all so as to enhance and not detract from the painting. In this they mostly succeeded.

    I hope I don't have to wait another 40 years to enjoy a new Star Wars film this much. At 46 years old, I might not survive that long! [face_laugh]
  8. Qui-Riv-Brid

    Qui-Riv-Brid Force Ghost star 5

    Apr 18, 2013
    Well they do in the sense that it's the only SW movie made where Anakin isn't/wasn't Vader when the movie was produced. There are other things all related to that in terms of Anakin (of rather Luke's unnamed father) such as Obi-Wan was obviously from Tatooine himself and grew up with Anakin and Owen. The Clone Wars were the crusade that drew them to be Jedi Order.

    In many respects it does and in many respects it doesn't. I would say that it fits just as well and maybe better with ROTS because the tone, feel and fabric of the worlds of R1 is very much in line with ROTS along with the presentation of Vader himself. The Empire wins in both movies but there is hope at the end that things might get better.

    R1 has a girl who wants to redeem her father's legacy while ANH has Luke who wants to follow in his father's legacy. We have the various mentor relationship and friendship from Anakin and Obi-Wan to Jyn and Saw to Luke and Obi-Wan.

    ROTS shows the final breaking of the galaxy, R1 shows the continuation after and give some more scope to the average view as opposed to the more elite view of ROTS while ANH goes from the average view and ascends it to heroic levels that only a Jedi can achieve.
  9. ezekiel22x

    ezekiel22x Chosen One star 5

    Aug 9, 2002

    I always thought your views on ANH were a breath of fresh air compared to the usual "ESB best ever!" stuff. Glad to see you finally got another film that lives up to what you like best about Star Wars! For me R1 doesn't really work as a direct lead in to ANH, but at least I appreciate how they attempted a new story about (mostly) non-Force centric rebels.
    Binary_Sunset likes this.
  10. Millennium Falcon 888

    Millennium Falcon 888 Jedi Master star 4

    Jan 6, 2016
    Well, what can I say about Rogue One, even if I watched it merely once... It's definitely some sort of spin-off in that it deviates quite a bit from the usual Skywalker saga, even if young Princess Leia does make an unexpected CGI cameo at the end... And at the same time, let's not forget that the plot of Rogue One is linked to the events of A New Hope, notably to that question of "why is there such a glaring error in the DS1 design?"... :cool:

    Resulting in an amazing ending to Rogue One that, when watched together with A New Hope continuously, makes both movies seem like one long one titled "Star Wars" that stretches for over 4 hours! :p
    TheManFromMortis likes this.
  11. ObidioJuan

    ObidioJuan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Nov 1, 2002
    Hmm, how to put it nicely.

    RO is not a spin-off IMHO. Because it's plot and outcome directly affect the Saga. It could easily have been a numbered episode (Episode 3.9) :D

    In my view something like Caravan of Courage is a SW spinoff, or The Ewok Adventure, I would even put Star Wars: The Clone Wars as a spinoff, even though it protagonists are Obi-wan and Anakin. Because the story and actions don't really have a direct impact to the Saga plot.

    IMHO. It's not a real spin-off, but neither is it a Saga Episode though to me it feels more like an episode than some of the numbered episodes.
    Samuel Vimes likes this.
  12. Vasco_Rojo

    Vasco_Rojo Jedi Knight star 1

    Apr 21, 2016
    "spin-off noun
    a byproduct or incidental result of a larger project. "the commercial spin-off from defense research"
    a product marketed by its association with a popular television program, movie, personality, etc. "spin-off merchandising"

    Rogue One could have never happened without the Star Wars movies first. It is neither part of the saga, nor have the same tonality. Moreover, it does not even include any J E D I, which are probably the most iconic and authentic characters/elements of the saga. You can all argue whatever you want......

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    V-2 and Dr_Cthulhu like this.
  13. Samuel Vimes

    Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Sep 4, 2012
    First, about RO owing it's existence due to the other films.
    Yes but that applies equally to ESB, which would not have existed due to ANH and it being such a big hit.
    The PT due to the OT being big hits.
    So all SW films really owe their existence to ANH and that it was such a huge hit.
    Does that make them all spinn-offs?
    Not to me.

    Second, lack of Jedi.
    How much Jedi were there in TFA?
    Luke had what, a minute of screen time if that. And he had no lines.
    He was mentioned several times but Jedi were mentioned in RO and Obi-Wan was also spoken off, but not by name.
    And if one views the SW saga as the story of the Skywalkers then RO has more Skywalker than TFA.
    Assuming that Rey isn't a Skywalker, the only Skywalker in that film is the aforementioned Luke, who has very little screen time.
    RO has two scenes with Vader, one of the most iconic SW characters, and he has some actual lines.

    Third, the story of RO is directly connected with ANH and also ties in with the PT story and uses some PT characters. And some OT characters too.

    The Ewok films were spinn-offs, Fantastic Beasts was a spinn-off, RO is much more closely tied with the main series than either of those films.
    So it would be more Ep 3.9 than a spinn-off to me.

    Bye for now.
    Blackboard Monitor
  14. Vasco_Rojo

    Vasco_Rojo Jedi Knight star 1

    Apr 21, 2016
    1- how much Jedi are on TFA? How about they are searching for Luke for the whole movie, the light saber is a critical element that triggers an identity revelation for Rey, and that the climax of the movie is a light saber duel, one of the most dramatic and well executed of the entire saga?

    2- Yes, RO is connected, of course, it is a spin off, nobody denies that. As you said uses some characters, but they are not the main characters, and legacy ones are cameos for fan service.

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    V-2 likes this.
  15. TCF-1138

    TCF-1138 Anthology/Fan Films Manager and Ewok Enthusiast star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Sep 20, 2002
    Well, both Leia and Kylo Ren are Skywalkers (even if not in name).
  16. Samuel Vimes

    Samuel Vimes Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Sep 4, 2012
    1. Your argument was that RO did not include any Jedi and Luke is barely in TFA and has no lines.
    They talk about him yes but they talk about Jedi in RO too. Both in general and of Obi-Wan, not by name, in particular. They also talk about Kiber crystals, that the Jedi use, that became the fuel of the DS. They talk about the Jedi temple.

    There is ligthsaber action at the end of RO too, not a duel as such but Vader uses his lightsaber a bit. And that scene was very pleasing to a lot of fans I know that.

    2. Tarkin is an important character story wise, as is Mon Mothma and Bail. Leia, R2 and C3PO, those are more cameos.
    Saw is in Rebels from what I know and he was a pretty important character.

    To me, RO is very closely tied and connected with mostly ANH but also the PT so it is more of a companion piece and less of a spinn-off.
    The story is also very closely tied with ANH.

    Compared with the Ewok films and Fantastic Beast, RO is much closer to the main series of films.
    And I think by design, it was an experiment but they used a lot of old characters and a familiar story to make it safer.

    And Leia is in RO too.
    Bye for now.
    Old Stoneface
  17. Christopher Blair

    Christopher Blair Jedi Master star 4

    Dec 23, 2015
    even though I dont like rogue one all that much I agree with this, bc the empire always felt way too tiny in the OT, and this helps set the stage better for ANH
  18. ObidioJuan

    ObidioJuan Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Nov 1, 2002
    I think that unless there's agreement on what are the qualities that define a spin-off vs. a saga then it's hard to debate.

    To Samuel_Vimes, I know we agree overall but for different reasons.

    That being said, RO is a spin-off because Disney says it's a spin-off. But to me personally, as I like RO better than some of the Saga Episodes, I will include it as part of the Saga. To me RO belongs with the Saga, but the other SW based movies I mentioned do not belong with the saga (E.G. Caravan of Courage)

    If spin-offs are defined as posted above:
    "spin-off noun
    a byproduct or incidental result of a larger project. "the commercial spin-off from defense research"
    a product marketed by its association with a popular television program, movie, personality, etc. "spin-off merchandising"

    Then by this definition all movies, tv-shows, etc. that are based on the original '77 Star Wars are spin-offs, including the re-brading of Star Wars into A New Hope.
  19. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Force Ghost star 4

    Mar 10, 2005
    There's also this definition: "any product that is an adaption, outgrowth or development of another similar product".

    So yes, strictly speaking, every product released under the "Star Wars" banner - with the exception of the first film - is a spin-off.

    RO is definitely a spin-off of the Skywalker Saga, though.
    V-2 likes this.
  20. V-2

    V-2 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Dec 10, 2012
    All sequels and prequels are spin-offs by definition. What is the problem here?
  21. vong333

    vong333 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Oct 18, 2003
    RO to me is more than just a mere spin-off. It is in a way, an indirect prequel to A New Hope. The only thing that is missing is the Skywalker aspect of this, but everything else is there. In fact, well, call me crazy, but between the novel Catalyst and this movie, there the premise may not have been jedi, but there sure was a lot of lore surrounding the force and the power of the kyber crystals. What I worry about is Han Solo spin-off being good, because RO was definitely a much bigger spin-off than some of us thought that it would be.
    Ricardo Funes likes this.
  22. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval TV Screaming Service / FFS! star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Aug 19, 2003
    I'm gonna say "pedantry"...
  23. BadAcrobat

    BadAcrobat Jedi Master star 3

    Apr 20, 2015
    Spinoff? Anthology? Prequel? Sequel?

    Who cares? Its a Star Wars movie - all tied together far as I'm concerned. And yes, The Han Solo movie will also be a Star Wars movie. All part of the big SW universe story arc.
    Ricardo Funes and Gigoran Monk like this.
  24. Gigoran Monk

    Gigoran Monk Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Dec 2, 2016
    I think of Rogue One as a Star Wars film.
    Ricardo Funes likes this.
  25. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Nov 20, 2012
    This sums up the entire forum.