ST J.J. Abrams (Director Of TFA & TROS) Discussion Thread—Now Finally Discussing: JJ Abrams

"It's so strange that we never hinted at this in any way." "This was always the plan."
"Was it then?"
"Suddenly deciding that the Force can do things is tight."
"I want this film to have impactful moments, but i don't want to actually deal with the impact."

 

So I missed my self-imposed watch by August deadline but I finally did listen to the JJ Abrams Force Awakens commentary track on DisneyPlus. (previously only available on the 3D TFA Blu ray, of note when you chose extra features like a commentary track on DisneyPlus it won't resume or go to continue watching so you have to go all the way through and/or remember your place). It's a fine commentary track, very complimentary, lots of cool tidbits. JJ opens the track with "when I was 10 years old these blue title cards were the 2nd coolest thing ever, followed by this" and the Star Wars crawl/blast. He does bounce around a lot and even apologizes to the listener for being jumbled and disconnected. Yes, he admits that they are supposed to be history repeating itself to the film, and he deliberately hits people with Star Wars iconography at the start of the film and then twist in little moments, like Finn being a stormtrooper who suddenly cares about anyone. Also one bit in the film when Rey is looking at the old lady forlornly is supposed to be Rey wondering if that is what is going to be waiting for her entire life. I've seen the movie dozens of times but never personally put it together. Also, my favourite factoid is that after Harrison healed from his injury they shot the running around from the Rathtar scene and Ford was according to JJ "moving faster and more than I have ever done in my entire life"

Lots of reshoots, which he freely admits, especially stuff with Rey and Finn. (Reshoots are not bad, dunno why they got that rap). Rey's little bit with BB-8 about waiting "for my family" was literally done on the roof of Bad Robot. Reshoot/additional bit with Rey and Finn changed their early dynamic, when they first meet originally Finn admitted he was a stormtrooper, and their relationship was much more combative. So the reshoots were basically to add more of a fun dynamic between them and Finn's whole lying about being part of the Resistance. JJ actually points out that "I'm not the one chasing someone with a stick!" was from the 1st version of their scenes which was the more combative version. Probably one of the coolest, essential reshot bit was "you need a teacher, I can show you the ways of the Force" and Rey just snapped back by calling Kylo a monster. the reshoot bit was one of my favourite bits in the film where she says "The Force" and then calls upon it to be centered and then kick his ass.

Anyway, interesting listen and the last Star Wars commentary track I had to listen to (kind of wish he had done it with Larry Kasadan though). Makes me wish for a TROS commentary track.

 

JJ was VERY visibly unhappy at the TROS premiere and avoided doing post-release press. I can’t see him having wanted to do a commentary track on the movie and have to own creative decisions he clearly strongly disagreed with but couldn’t discuss due to his NDA.

 

Sam Witwer explaining how it went down with his and Filoni's involvement in Solo (which followed the lore pissing on by TFA and especially TLJ) definitely sets up TROS to have a 3rd POV being louder of having the story make sense and connected. I recall the reports/commercials about the S2 Mandalorian episode with Grogu Force healing being tied to what Rey showed in TROS.

We have JJ wanting to tell his story, TPTB going off whatever motivations they had throughout the ST, as well as a new faction of people throughout LFL and ILM raising concern because what the films were doing didn't fit with the story. Of course it was a mess. Each day that more info comes out, the bigger mess the ST reveals to be.

 

Just curious what you are referring to here.

 

His interview after Solo. There is a lot in the interview that's very enlightening. Here's a clip.

https://www.swholocron.blog/2020/04...ion-of-the-scene-and-advocating-for-the-role/

Again - more about him and Filoni in link,

Also, Witwer didn't just call out JJ - he was clear on RJ as well for his story decision.

https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-last-jedi-rian-johnson-homework-sam-witwer/

The ones closest to SW - on camera and behind the scenes - were obviously like fans raising red flags that what Disney was doing wasn't making sense for the SW story. RO remade to fit more, Solo remade to fit more. The ST - no one in this group was listened to until after TLJ/Solo issues.

So JJ returning to SW not only found TPTB that greenlit TLJ's decisions but also another dynamic as people focused on the actual story (over style or anything else) was raising the alarms that the story didn't make sense. Seems like real life was having same arguments as this board.

Considering all that has happened, it's clear the ones in charge of SW going forward get it. Favreau from the Luke BTS intro:

So far, every known project is directly or indirectly tied to Favreau/Filoni except for Rogue Squadron - but I expect that to be as well. The idea that SW would be project/director driven has been replaced by the story coming first - same as MCU.

 

@2Cleva Wow, thank you! I am of the opinion that TROS would have been a mess even if everyone was unified behind the scenes. since TFA and TLJ were going in exact opposite directions (unless they just completely retconned TLJ, which would have gotten my vote if I were in the room!) However, couple that with the mess that was going on behind the scenes, and you end up with... well you end up with TROS.

I often wonder what motivated JJ to come back for TROS. Did he think he could save the trilogy? Did he think he would have more control than he did? Was it just for the money (has anyone ever heard what his paycheck was for that one)? Was it out of fondness for the cast and wanting to work with them again? Was it out of protection for the character he created in Rey (in that he at least attempted to refocus her as the protagonist after TLJ sidelined her in that regard)? I would love to know because I think it was pretty obvious that "fixing" the trilogy would be impossible after the 1-2 punch of TFA and TLJ. He was riding pretty high after TFA. I've always been curious why he did not just leave it at that.

 

I’m certain JJ was promised more control than he was ultimately given.

 

Agreed. Although it looked like everyone was on board in same direction after TFA - post TLJ the multiple fragmentations were evident. We obviously know few details but significant things have happened behind the scenes after TLJ that still aren't announced today. All we see is the results.

TROS is so bastardized it's hard to tell who is responsible for what.

 

They weren’t unified post-TFA. TLJ was being written while TFA was still in production and we know that JJ and his team were not happy about TLJ and that it did not at all resemble what he planned, no matter the PR platitudes that were recited.

The ST was screwed before the public ever saw TFA.

 

JJ had nothing planned. JJ isn't a director you get to plan a trilogy. JJ is a director you get to set up a template.

And from what i remember. there were articles saying JJ read the TLJ script and was jealous he wasn't the one making it. which i guess we would have to say was BS. but then how can anyone really talk for JJ Abrams? i mean this person you think JJ is seems to be somewhat your ideal director.

 

But the cast was never 100 on board with TLJ.

And I’m pretty sure TFA experienced studio interference. The studio wasn’t simultaneously totally on-board with JJ’s work AND with RJ’s work; buy-in to one precluded buy-in to the other. The studio never thought that what RJ was writing was consistent with JJ’s vision; they tossed his outlines completely.

 

It seems to me like Abrams didn’t want to come back but Disney made him a financial offer that he could not refuse.

 

JJ is quite wealthy. He doesn’t *need* Disney $.

 

Yeah - more likely he returned because he wanted to finish the story he started that he saw jumped the rails in TLJ.

A whole lot of egos were involved with the ST and the story (which is the backbone of SW) suffered as a result.

 

JJ doesn't need Disney money. but he still works mostly for gain. lets be honest. he made 2 Star Trek movies. He doesn't even care about Star Trek. He made sure his production company profited from those movies when it comes to merchandise and designs. JJ is a director that will make a film as long as he can negotiate some wealth or deals from it. He isn't exactly a tough director to convince when it comes to projects.

 

Well I think JJ is pretty picky because his director output has only been MI:3, Star Trek, Super 8, Star Trek Into Darkness, Force Awakens and Rise of Skywalker. He produces a hell of a lot, like a lot a lot, so he is definitely busy with that too. If he was just going in for wealth, he would have directed more movies over his career. I think he even had to return some cash to Paramount because he was supposed to make X amount of movies for them but kept leaving to make Star Wars movies for Disney/LFL. So since he made TROS, I highly doubt it was just for the paycheque and more Hollywood influence. the dude's got plenty of both.

 

Someone on Twitter who was at the premiere said Abrams disappeared as soon as the movie ended. He completely skipped the post premiere party.

 

Yeah, I need to get out the world's smallest violin....

He made the decision to come back. And basically, a lot of the problems he had to "fix" were problems he helped cause in the first place. Not to say that there was much he could do after TLJ, but he could have done something better than over two hours of "go here, find this" and casting his pals - I mean, c'mon, what purpose was Keri Russell's character except to insist that Poe was straight so no FinnPoe.

I will say that TROS is funnier than TFA, but that's totally unintentional.

 

Its not about the wealth. its about benefit. from whats been said Bad Robot may still profit from the recent Star Trek shows that JJ isn't even a part of. due to the fact that they continue to use Ship designs (intentionally) that were used in the JJ Abrams movies. i think its more about whats on the negotiation offer that gets JJ's attention more than a studio just saying hey direct this! probably helps if JJ likes it too. although he wasn't a fan of Star Trek.

I mean I'm sure people would love to think that JJ really wanted to come back to "fix" what Rian Johnson did. I believe he has even said he had to be convinced to come back, because he was working on other things and was nervous about the idea of directing another film. he had to be convinced by Kennedy to do it. he called signing up a leap of faith.

 

That's not how licensing works, Paramount/CBS owns all the "ship designs" that came out under the JJ Abrams movies. Ditto with LFL.

And the Paramount/CBS shows after Star Trek 2009 have not used any Abrams movie sourced designs anyway.

 

Abrams has already said those comments attributed to him were false.

 

Irrelevant. Creatives don’t sign up to have their work messed with anymore than actors sign up to be treated like trash.

Um he wrote outlines for eps 8 and 9 and they were tossed and they were tossed and their ideas discarded. JJ made TFA with those outlines in mind. Unless you’re going to argue with a straight face that JJ caused problems by psychically compelling DLF to toss his own plan I don’t think your position is very tenable.

1. The script was rewritten many times. And not because JJ or Terrio find rewriting scripts to be a fun pasttime.

2. The production was clearly heavily interfered with by the studio. Anyone who closely followed the coverage leading up to TROS could see that.

JJ was clearly upset at the final product because creative control was taken away from him.

While it can feel less satisfying to blame faceless suits than a movie’s director/writer, that doesn’t mean the director/writer is the one to be pilloried.

(And before anyone claims JJ should have agreed to do all 3 movies Disney insisted on an obscenely tight release schedule that would have been extremely difficult and taxing for any director.)