JCC [jahi mcmath] she's dead, jim

Ah. So I'm going to go exhume my mother and place her ashes in a hospital bed, and surround the whole tableaux with nurses and doctors who have to treat her as if she's alive. After all, she's only been dead for 12 years, and in Ezekiel God brought dry bones back to life! I have hope!

Don't you dare tell me I can't do it, either, because you were never a 29-year-old woman who lost her 52-year-old mother on March 12, 2002, at 3:12 p.m.

That makes perfect sense.

 

Hey, if you can find medical staff to do it then go right ahead. Who am I to judge. Our grief is our own and we all manage it in different ways. I'm just not sure why you feel like you should be making the rules for everyone else to follow.

 

I think the "don't be an idiot and waste resources on a husk" "rule" is pretty solid.

 

so hey, when do i get to have sex with the body?

 

I do too, but how do you know for sure when someone is just a husk? I posted one article about brain death being misdiagnosed and there are many more. And some are a little scary. In 2009 a woman in New York was pronounced brain dead then she woke up while the doctors were harvesting her organs. They had made a mistake. Do a google search. It happens often enough to give it a second thought.

What do many people do when they discover that they or someone they love have a serious medical condition? They try to find out more information about it. Perhaps Jahi's parents searched the internet to find out about their child's condition and found these articles about misdiagnosing brain death. Is it really so unreasonable that they would still hold on to such hope just a month and a half after this happened to their daughter, especially after reading that? How many parents wouldn't hold on to the tiniest hope their child might still survive after seeing evidence that brain death has been misdiagnosed?

I believe Jahi is brain dead. I actually have no doubt about it. But again, I'm not emotionally involved in the decision.

 

The Rogue Doctrine

 

there are plenty of bizarre ways to deal with grief that aren't harmful to the wider society. for instance:



i am totally fine with this young woman's decision

 

What evidence do you have of that? Any official statistics on the proportion of people misdiagnosed with brain death? ophelia pointed out the differences between Jahi and a case you cited. Are there also differences between Jahi and the other cases you're citing?

There are misdiagnoses and complications for everything in medicine. Unless they're statistically significant, I don't think we should take a random case of brain death and assume the doctors misdiagnosed it.

 

In an effort to convince people that "random chance is random" when seeing stories of survival that are so astronomically improbable as to be rendered "nigh impossible" I give you this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vesna_Vulović

I highly recommend you try this from your next airplane ride if you're interested in testing probability theory...

 

She did point out differences, but she either didn't read my post carefully or she was being intellectually dishonest. Go back and reread it. The only claim I made was that doctors have been fallible in determining people as being brain dead. In that case, it was 4 doctors that were wrong. I never once claimed that Jahi is misdiagnosed (and actually specifically said otherwise). The point of what I said was that the parents could have good reason to think the doctors are wrong - that is what was supported by my evidence, especially since those doctors wanted to start harvesting organs and by doing so would have killed the kid. Again, as I said, lucky for that boy the parents' persistence paid off.

Also, after the big to do about closing the senate, it is my understanding that the JCC doesn't really appreciate senate style posting with lots of cited evidence. But here are some examples in addition to the first one I gave:
This one happened in 2010 http://www.khou.com/news/Woman-makes-miraculous-comeback-from-brain-death-diagnosis-105533163.html
This one in 2009 (the creepy waking up woman): http://jonathanturley.org/2013/07/1...rvest-her-organs-when-she-woke-up-fined-6000/

This is a link to a book from the Harvest press, but mentions a 19 year old girl in Denmark: http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/155270/

This isn't a specific case, but a history of brain death and a very interesting: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/01/books/review/the-undead-by-dick-teresi.html

This is an article about a machine that has been able to detect brain activity in 3 people who were previously thought to be brain dead: http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/science-scope/scanner-finds-some-brain-dead-patients-are-aware/

Again, the point of these are not to compare cases to Jahi's - it is to show how doctors can make mistakes and Jahi's parents might feel some reason for hope.

 

When I was in college there was a girl that fell from the 18th floor of the world's tallest dorm (at that time). She survived. Her name was Mary Zilly and all the students started calling her Mary Zillyputty.

 

Yes . . . I am personally making an arbitrary rule that dead = dead. That's exactly what a sane person would get out of this.

 

Wow, you read those links fast. But did you read them carefully?

 

I asked for statistics. You gave me links to news stories that provide none. (EDIT: Oh wait, one story has a neurologist saying that someone with severe head trauma can appear to be brain dead for a few hours. A few hours.) Individual "miraculous" recoveries do not support your argument that misdiagnoses of brain death happen "often enough" to warrant something like the McMath parents' legal freakout.

 

And that is your opinion, as someone who is not dealing with the trauma of losing their daughter or someone who is going to have to go to sleep at night wondering if they did everything they could to save her.

 

Did the doctors do everything they could to remove your head from your ass?

 

Actually, I've had a better idea. I'm going to become a death activist. I don't think it's fair that Jahi McMath, alone out of all the people in the world, is receiving medical care after her demise. Anybody could suddenly "wake up" at any time, right? There are internet links to prove it! We need to get fully-stocked crash carts out to those cemeteries, along with an army of backhoes, waiting to dig up and medically support anybody who suddenly returns to life.

A voice for the expired! Occupy the afterlife! You'd better be ready to jump in with both feet--we've got 101 billion people to serve! Lets do this!!!

 

Um, are you 15?

 

My cranium has not come into contact with my rectum. I can't begin to fathom what you're going through!

 

So you're a 15 year old with a thesaurus.

 

welcome to the jcc!

 

Thesaurus.com. Nothing's worthwhile if I can't find it on Google and link to it.

My noggin has never come into contact with my derriere.

 

i am a 15,328 year old with a brontosaurus. now where are all the vegetable people for me to sex?

 

here is a funny picture i found on the internet