PT Jedi incursion on Geonosis

Something that has always intrigued me is when the Jedi suddenly appear in the Geonosian arena and take Dooku and his allies completely by surprise. I always wondered how they pulled that off.
Has this ever been addressed in any medium? Did they arrive in a single transport or in 200 Jedi starfighters? How did they manage to breach the geonosian defences without sounding an alarm? Obviously Obi-Wan was able to land his fighter without detection but we never saw any indication that he had to navigate any particular defences.

 

Seeing how the Sith want the Republic to accept the Clone army and get the Jedi fighting alongside the Clones, not to mention Dooku also wanting to convince Obi-Wan to join him, I'd think Kenobi, the Jedi, and Yoda & the Clones were allowed to land. Much like with Luke on Cloud City, it was a trap.

When Yoda arrived with the Clones, it may have been permitted, or perhaps the Geonosians were too preoccupied with the Arena battle, or it wouldn't have made a difference either way because they would've fought their way down, but either way it's what Dooku wanted because it started off the war.

 

Wouldn’t an attack on those locations raise an alarm though? I’m thinking about all those films where perps take out security cameras but the security guards don’t seem to notice screen after screen going to static or black

 

I'll be darned, I played that game a lot in the summer of 2002, but don't remember that

 

I’m going to seek out a no commentary playthrough on YouTube to experience the event.

 

“Our fleet is jamming all transmissions on the planet, it should allow us to land undetected.” - Luminara Unduli, The Clone Wars
“A communications disruption can mean only one thing, invasion.” - Sio Bibble, The Phantom Menace

How on earth does blocking an entire planet’s communications network and blasting their ground defences aid the Jedi to arrive at the arena undetected?

 

There are clues in the film that make me think the Jedi are also hiding themselves in the Force from at least Dooku. Doubt that would do much against radar.

Like when Yoda and the Gunships enter the arena Padme is the first one to notice them a moment before any Jedi. I don’t think it’s the Jedi are playing it cool. I think Yoda is doing something to mask them in the Force. Padme being more keyed in to regular senses notices first.

As for what order Republic Forces arrive on Geonosis or if it’s all at once. There are a number of distant booming sounds used for dramatic effect when the arena gets quite. I think those are the big Republic coming in for a landing.

If that’s the case an advance group of Jedi arrived to attempt a rescue in the arena and lower defenses where the republic forces would land.

 

Ok, that’s one theory. I’d like to hear what clues are in the film you’ve found that supports your conclusions.
I’ve been thinking on the problem myself and this is what I’ve come up with: That all 200 Jedi arrived either in a large carrier packed with starfighters or individually. If it was a carrier it must have reverted from hyperspace outside of detectable range. The starfighters were small enough to be undetectable to radar equipment since perhaps geonosian technology may only be calibrated to detect large scale assaults. This would also explain how Obi-Wan’s starfighter also went undetected. That’s all I’ve got.

 

However you want to make it work for yourself. I don't have the novelization in front me but as was said in the PS2 game, I'm sure it's "jamming." Or it's probably not addressed at all.

The true explanation is that it's a cool moment when the cavalry shows up.

 

I second this. I really doubt Mace and company could've snuck up on Dooku and the Seps. That's way too many Jedi to go undetected. They arrived because the Sith needed them to.

 

Going back to the op, I don't know if I would say Dooku and his allies were taken completely by surprise. Seconds after Mace and the Jedi make their presence known in the arena, an entire legion of Battle Droids come marching out from right on the other side of the doors, while Dooku's Super Battle Droids follow closely on Mace's heels as if letting Mace approach Dooku. Count Dooku himself seems quite unstirred by the whole thing. Perhaps it's his confidence in all situations, or perhaps he sensed them, perhaps he logical deduced they'd show up, or perhaps he was aware of their approach the whole time, repeating the theme of Sith setting traps for the heroes.

 

I think Dooku knew the Jedi were coming. That’s the big plan - get the Jedi and Republicans Army to successfully invade Geonosis to kick off the Clone Wars.

Did Dooku know they already arrived? Or was he just prepared for their predicted arrival?

I don’t think the separatists were in on the Sith plot.

 

Dooku did know they were coming. That was part of Palpatine's plan. This was one great big set up and the Jedi walked right into the trap.

 

Ok. It seems reasonable to believe that Palps tipped Dooku off about the Jedi incursion. And Dooku allowed Mace to put a blade to his throat because he knew Windu wouldn’t kill an unarmed man. However, from the Jedi point of view how did they intend to arrive quietly and unnoticed?
Obviously George didn’t give too much thought to this but as a Zahn reader I’ve been conditioned to expect logical answers to most things.☺️ As the above poster suggested, I should take a look at the novelisation again, perhaps an explanation was given, but I do vaguely remember that that book was pretty basic compared the the sensational Episode 3 novelisation
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I think this is just another instance where things happen because plot. It makes not much sense if you try and think through it.

Yes Dooku likely knew they were coming and allowed them in. Question is why the Jedi thought they could do this and not be detected?
They know that Obi-Wan was captured when sending a signal. So the Geonosians knows they have caught a Jedi spy and one that was able to send a signal. So they would be expecting visitors and be on alert.
Dooku was also lucky that Mace and the Jedi were really stupid in the arena. A better plan would be for Mace and 2-3 other master confront Dooku and have the passageway be guarded by 5-10 other Jedi. Put the blade to Dookus throat, not Jango, and call for his surrender. If he does not, chop.
Jumping down into the arena is dumb, have a few jump down and get Obi-Wan, Anakin and Padme out and some to protect them. The rest stay up. Also, Yoda arrived less than an hour after Mace came in, did they not talk to each other?
If Mace knew that Yoda was about an hour behind with a big army and ships, the sensible thing to do is wait.

Dooku is again lucky that none try to shoot at him when the gunships arrive or that Yoda takes no help with him when he goes to confront him later. Dooku is a primary target, the Jedi say this and yet they for some reason don't try very hard to get him. The plot needs Dooku to get away and so he does while the Jedi look clueless.

Had Dooku been killed or caught on Geonosis, the war might have ended right there. Yes Palpatine is out there but if the seps movement collapses with Dooku's death, then he has to start again.

Bye.
Old Stoneface

 

Dooku is supremely confident in his abilities and would believe he could escape unscathed, and obviously planned to let the Jedi into the arena, in fact the entire gladiatorial fight instead of just shooting them as Nute suggests, is most likely stalling for time to allow the Jedi to arrive. So I fail to see why it makes no sense, old stone face, but you’ve already written off these movies as having things happen for no reason, when really theyre subtle enough to let you think about why something might be happening, so you no longer analyse them in good faith

 

I think Samuel makes some good points. Both Dooku and the Jedi make a number of silly errors. But particularly Mace. Now I come think about it, I’m remembering the Shatterpoint novel. Mace constantly berates himself for going after Jango instead of Dooku. He could have ended the entire war right there. I guess with regards to Dooku the main flaw of the Sith is their overconfidence. So you can make allowance for his bold and rash actions.

 

Most stories have moments of narrative convenience, when things line up just right in order for the plot to move on. Like in ANH how the R2 unit that Owen bought breaks down right there, how in ESB, on the whole planet of Dagobah, Luke lands just next to where Yoda lives. Or how in RotJ, the rebels, wearing camouflage, takes along a shiny, golden C3PO. Or in TPM, how they land on Tatooine, right by the town where Anakin lives and the first shop they enter is where Anakin works.
Those a narrative shot cuts so not to spend too much time on things that are not that important. And I can buy that.

But if a film or story does too much of this that is goes from a convenience to a contrivance, then it can start to bother me.

To continue with TPM, Watto just happens to be immune to the mind trick, he just happens to be the only trader on the planet that has the part they need, there seems to be no way to exchange money on Tatooine and Qui-Gon does not think of the obvious, go to another trader, one not immune to the mind trick and by stuff of equal worth to the part they need. All so that we can have the pod race.
This is starting to become a situation where things happens because plot.

With Dooku, yes he would know that the Jedi were coming, Palpatine likely told him. And this was a show to get them to act and cut them down. But there are still issues, first nad mostly from the Jedi and what they did and how. But also from Dooku that he somehow knew that only Mace would confront him, that he would not get fired upon. He was lucky that the ship Anakin and Obi-wan were on just happened to be out of rockets and they somehow did not think to use their other weapons. Yoda for some reason did not bring any help with him.

The PT has instances were the characters take action in ways that seem to make sense at first glance but become questionable when you think them through.

For ex, did Dooku plan for Padme to die at the start of AotC? You would think so, he sent Jango and the reason why is that Nute made that a demand in order for him to join the seps. So clear then?
Well no, there is the issue of the dart, that was very specific and was Jango ordered to use it? Was the plan for Jango/Zam to fail and instead push Anakin and Padme together and be ordered off planet and Obi-Wan would find Kamino and then Geonosis? Was Jango told to fail?
If Jango was supposed to kill Padme and when he failed, Palpatine improvised. Obi-Wan was never meant to find Kamino and when he did, Palpatine improvised. Then the question is, why did Jango use the dart?
If he was ordered to fail and instead lead Obi-Wan to Kamino, then a lot of other questions arise.

I have tried to work with the PT but there are issues. Not enough to ruin them totally but numerous enough to bother me.

Bye.
Old Stoneface

 

what is slightly amusing (bemusing rather?) is that people who are resistant to the mind trick - the opposite of the weak minded- are obsessed with money and or materialism,
Don't know what that says about the characters, or the storyteller that created these characters, but it is what it is.

anyway, to stay on topic...

yep...or in terms of In universe story telling:

Palpatine is once again god like status

and the Jedi are reduced to morons....again, because of course.

 

.

 

I can only imagine how crazy the Obi-Wan Kenobi show must be making you. The writing in that has been atrocious.

 

It's also convenient that the mind trick doesn’t work on Jabba, so that Luke doesn't have to fight to rescue his friends, because heaven forbid certain species are immune to mind manipulation.

Palpatine is a master manipulator. You're telling me that you've never seen or read stories involving a master planner? If you're trying to start a war intentionally with someone who is on it, wouldn't it be prudent to time it all out in advance? You don't get to be the head honcho by blind luck. This was hinted at back in ROTJ.

 

of course

but if you have read threads round this forum the past year 'Palpatine did it' is the new 'the force did it' and it gets old.

And it gets old pretty quickly.

And you can have a strong master planner or a strong villain (prof. Moriarty for example) you don't have to make your protagonists dumb idiots to do it. Holmes certainly wasn't.

 

It's been that way for twenty years now.

The Jedi aren't stupid, but are arrogant in thinking they're facing an enemy who is coming at them head on. They believe the Sith only control one side and could be taken easily.