LOTR-FOTR - NOW DISCUSSING Chapter 28: Gilraen's Memorial*

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard
Chapter 21: Flight to the Ford**
Chapter 22: Rivendell
Chapter 23: Many Meetings
Chapter 24: The Fate of the Ring
Chapter 25: The Sword That Was Broken**

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

this was extended? I don't even remember that anymore

 

I know it's been a long time. The dialogue at the beginning was extended. Aragorn says he is a friend of Gandalf the Grey.

 

my thoughts as well. i haven't watched the extended edition of FOTR in a while. although i've been meaning to do so. maybe on my 6 hr trip back to school next tuesday

 

I don't believe they said anything to each other in the theatrical run.

 

Nice scene, particuarly with the lighting. Then again, I'm a real sucker for blue-gray hues.

 

Just a heads-up:
if any of you have ever read any Tolkien book, please take this survey!

http://www.surveyingmiddleearth.com/

 

That might be better suited for SFF: Books and Comics

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 26: The Evenstar DISCUSSION will be made available 3:15 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 26: The Evenstar
DISCUSSION: August 9, 2007 ? August 13, 2007
DVD TIME INDEX: 95:46 ? 97:24

Synopsis:
Strider and Arwen are standing on a bridge recollecting old times. She told before that she would give up her immortal life and bind herself to him. She gives him the Evenstar and he refuses. Arwen says it is hers to give to whomever she wants. She chooses a mortal life. They kiss. END OF CHAPTER

Opinion:
FOTR is really the only time I really like Arwen. I hate her in TTT and ROTK. Since their first meeting just after Weathertop you can sense something between them. The shot of the two on the bridge is breathtaking and is some great cinematography.

This whole Aragorn and Arwen subplot echoes that Lady of Luthien which was hinted in the Midgewater Marshes scenes and starts to make sense right here. Great job by the props department on the Evenstar; it?s a tad bit bulky but it?s still quite beautiful.

The Anarion song I believe it?s called from Enya works perfectly her for the scene, sounding as it is a song of elvish so natural for their culture. I look at the Rivendell set and it?s hard to believe that it?s a combination of just a bridge in a studio and a bigature of the refuge.

It?s a great upbeat moment before the big meeting taking place to discuss the fate of the world. They?re all heading towards this fate and Aragorn and Arwen accepted their fate before Frodo and the rest can accept theirs.

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard
Chapter 21: Flight to the Ford**
Chapter 22: Rivendell
Chapter 23: Many Meetings
Chapter 24: The Fate of the Ring
Chapter 25: The Sword That Was Broken**
Chapter 26: The Evenstar

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

decent chapter before things pick up in the movie. Like you said Moleman1138, I only like Arwen in FOTR

 

At first it's like rekindling love then when she disobeys her father who's a lot more wiser than she is. there's something wrong. Elrond may seem stern but he was right.

 

right in what? She did prove him wrong about there being no hope or life

he was right that Aragorn's death was inevitable, but she was very well aware of that, choosing to be (with) a mortal and all.

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 27: The Council of Elrond DISCUSSION will be made available 11:00 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 27: The Council of Elrond**
DISCUSSION: August 14, 2007 ? August 18, 2007
DVD TIME INDEX: 97:25 ? 105:30

Synopsis:
Elrond welcomes many races to his council to save Middle-Earth. They must unite or fall to destroy Mordor. Elrond tells Frodo to bring forth the ring. Everyone gazes at it wonder and envy. Boromir says that it is true that the ring has been found. Everyone is tested. Boromir tells the story about Gondor and Mordor. He approaches the Ring. Black Speech covers the council. Gandalf counteracts it. Boromir says it is a gift and use it against Sauron, telling everyone that Gondor has kept them safe. He suggest that the ring should go to Gondor. Strider says he cannot wield it. It is revealed by Legolas that Strider is Aragorn heir to the throne of Gondor. Boromir says Gondor has or doesn?t need a king. Gandalf agrees that they cannot used it. Elrond says it must be destroyed. Gimli tries with his axe but fails. Elrond tells him it must be taken into the fires of Mount Doom. Someone at this council does this. Boromir say it is impossible to get past the Black Gates which stirs an argument among the councilmen. Frodo says he will take the ring, but does not know the way. One by one, Gandalf, Boromir, Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas come forward to offer their aid. The hobbits hiding from sight come forward and say they?re coming too. Elrond pronounces them the Fellowship of the Ring. Pippin wonders where they?re going. END OF CHAPTER - INTERMISSION

Opinion:
You can tell this is the halfway point and the perfect time for an intermission after such an important discussion that drives the second half of the film. Despite being boring and lengthy in the book, it actually comes off quite well as a place of hesitant unification.

The additions here including the Black Speech invading Imladris definitely make this much more darker and the power of the Ring more tangible. It?s already tangible but the power and temptation is beautifully done here all around especially Elijah and Sean Bean.

The subtle Minas Tirith theme is amazing and works with the struggle between Steward son and exile heir to the throne of Gondor. It?s definitely a powerful moment for Aragorn. He has to acknowledge that he is the heir, but takes the ring quest not the inheritance quest.

Hugo Weaving pulls off Elrond quite well though I expect from time to time for a Hello Mr. Baggins. We?ve missed you. The sneaky hobbits and Fellowship proclamation is such as great high note for the slight break in between discs.

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard
Chapter 21: Flight to the Ford**
Chapter 22: Rivendell
Chapter 23: Many Meetings
Chapter 24: The Fate of the Ring
Chapter 25: The Sword That Was Broken**
Chapter 26: The Evenstar
Chapter 27: The Council of Elrond**

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

The Council of Elrond must have been a ***** to adapt into a workable scene for a film. But the scene works, and that's the important thing.

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 28: Gilraen's Memorial* DISCUSSION will be made available 11:30 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 28: Gilraen?s Memorial*
DISCUSSION: August 19, 2007 ? August 23, 2007
DVD TIME INDEX: 105:31 ? 106:44

Synopsis:
Aragorn is cleaning off an elvish grave. Elrond comes forth and says the woman buried here wanted to protect her son. She thought he?d be safe in Rivendell, but still be hunted. Elrond says that Narsil can be forged but only Aragorn can wield it. Elrond says he is last of the bloodline. Aragorn does not want or never wanted that power. END OF CHAPTER

Opinion:
Quite a great addition to the Extended Edition, when I first saw it back in 2002, it did absolutely nothing for me but seeing Aragorn?s struggle with his inheritance in TTT and later in ROTK, it works quite well from a trilogy standpoint.

It?s so subtly beautiful and the cue of Elvish music here is superb. The tombstone itself is beautifully done giving a sense of elder times. Such intricate detail taken here to get a memorable effect. It also hints that Aragorn stayed among the elves, but such relationship between Aragorn and Elrond isn?t quite as direct yet.

Aragorn has his own Hero?s Journey and for most of the trilogy and especially this scene here we?re at the Refusal of the Call. He takes another journey to destroy the ring not the claim the inheritance from what Gandalf calls in ROTK, lesser men. The depth this scene gives to his character is just so amazing and helps him along.

I just really like it, despite its shortness. It does seem like Hugo Weaving was doing some pickups on this because despite the seamlessness, his shots seem in bluescreen if anything. But beside that good chapter;

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard
Chapter 21: Flight to the Ford**
Chapter 22: Rivendell
Chapter 23: Many Meetings
Chapter 24: The Fate of the Ring
Chapter 25: The Sword That Was Broken**
Chapter 26: The Evenstar
Chapter 27: The Council of Elrond**
Chapter 28: Gilraen?s Memorial*

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and [link=http://boards.theforce.net/Board.asp

 

I don't know if this is "bad form" or not, but I'd like to comment on the first chapter. I'm not an especially big fan of Peter Jackson's "The Lord of the Rings" movie series, but I appreciate the tremendous effort that went into it. I'm probably going to earn myself a few enemies for saying this, as well as coming across as a bit of a party pooper, yet I'll go ahead and say it anyway: I find "The Lord of the Rings" to be an overrated, ham-handed and rather tedious set of movies. Very little of the films' content resonates with me; I don't find Jackson's approach especially deep or elegant. I won't "gate crash" this discussion and pull apart the films chapter by chapter; I hope some general comments on the first chapter, expanding into comments on the films as a whole, will be sufficient to put my point across.

In my opinion, the opening chapter of FOTR embodies everything "right" and "wrong" about Jackson's filmmaking and approach to the material. On the one hand, it's stirring and marvelous . . . a real "home run" of an opening. On the other, it's melodramatic, clumsy and overwrought . . . a cloddish mutilation of Tolkien's staggering tale. Let me go into more detail. The darkened screen, the Elvish (?) whispering in the background and Cate Blanchett's evocative translation / narration, as well as the understated, haunting music, combine into an enrapturing incantation: I am immediately transfixed and pulled into another world. Then, just as brilliantly, "The Lord of the Rings" logo, fading in and out of view like some autumnal leaf concealed, revealed and suddenly hidden again, complete with an elegiac musical motif, is stirring -- and, in my opinion, perhaps EXACTLY what Tolkien would have wanted. So far, so good. Yet, even with this level of care and precision and all-round artistry, SOMETHING is missing. I don't want to turn this into a "versus" competition or anything of that nature, but the opening to "Star Wars" is much more cinematic. If anything, and as much as I admire the subtlety of this part, "The Lord of the Rings" doesn't announce itself in any memorable way. At this stage, it's more of a nitpick -- but I think it's a minor fallacy of the film that gets bigger and bigger as the movies unfold. The true iconographic promise of the material stutters and peters out. ANYWAY.

The narrative prologue now gets visual accompaniment. Blanchett's narration continues to captivate, but the visuals are somewhat clumsy: excessive close-ups, soft filtering, over-eager cutting. One isn't blown back into their seat and left agasp. Again, as painful and as silly as it seems, "Star Wars" begins with a WHOPPER of a shot: the Star Destroyer pursuing the tiny Rebel Blockade Runner is one of the greatest images in cinema history. LOTR is already flagging. The visuals and narration continue. Although the rhythm is not remarkable, it remains consistent throughout the prologue, and this is to Jackson's credit and skill. It's well written and paced. But there's a component to this introduction where Jackson completely loses me -- and indicates the TRUE "dumbing down" of the material to come. The battle. I'm sorry, but while this may have been impressive on a first viewing, it looks and feels HORRIFIC to me now. The opening reminds me of a video game -- indeed, those Orcs (or whatever) falling off the cliff and Sauron's subsequent "shockwave" are strongly reminiscent of "3DMark" (PC buffs will know what I'm referring to). Everything looks so fake and "digital" in this sequence. The sky is especially bad and looks "painted in". Jackson's love of sweeping shots and close-ups also causes this battle, like all the battles in LOTR, to resemble a television movie intercut with cheap "PlayStation" scrolling effects. But beyond the technical aspects, the battle itself reduces the story to simple "good vs. evil". The ostensibly "good" guys have all rallied in one last stand against a "monstrous evil". Sauron's power over Middle-earth is depicted as a literal Sci-Fi-esque "power": he flings warriors across the battle field like ragdolls.