ST Luke and Rey: their dynamic from TLJ and beyond

The key word being helped. There's only one Force user in the Star Wars films that demonstrated the power to actually, nearly single handedly, radically change the entire galaxy. And it wasn't a Jedi.

Jedi have show to be quite helpful. However the importance of a single Jedi, particularly in the OT, has always been exaggerated beyond their actual impact. Luke was not the "hope" of the Alliance, no matter what he told Leia. The Resistance was able to destroy Starkiller base even without Luke. Palpatine was able to destroy a Republic without Anakin. Yoda, as powerful as he was, couldn't stop the rise of the Empire. Kylo, powerful as he is, is, like his grandfather, more a pawn than a chess master.

What the Jedi (and the Skywalkers) are afforded in this saga is focus. They've, by design, always had it.

Which is why we can be plausibly sold on the possibility that Luke is terrified of Rey's potential, even as the galaxy burns all around him. In this franchise that's par for the course.

 

So Reys first words to Luke will be:
"Mr. Jedi-chov, tear down this Regime!"

 

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/forum-mood-and-environment-plus-a-warning-–-please-read.50047064/

 

Mark Hamill with some serious misdirection or perhaps the first significant splash of water on the Rey Skywalker theory. Why would he need to construct this backstory about a son who kills himself with his lightsaber for motivation if he had been informed that Rey was his daughter that he never knew under what would have needed to be almost certainly tragic circumstances related to them splitting apart or never knowing each other. What's more, he shared this elaborate backstory motivation with Rian Johnson who encouraged him to use it, rather than presumably sharing a notable difference that would allow him to better work with Rey herself or provide him with an actual tragedy to work off of.

Read more here:
http://ew.com/movies/2017/12/04/star-wars-mark-hamill-luke-skywalker-backstory/

 

The backstory involves the loss of a child. Why would he need that kind of backstory? And why would Rian Johnson encourage that angle of the story?

Let us also remember that Mark Hamill is not going to say "I found a wife and had a baby girl, then I lost my girl to a bunch of smugglers" or anything that gives away the game.

 

If they intend to go a different route where Rey’s new “family” that care for her in the future are meant to be more surrogate/adopted without being officially adopted then the loss of a step son would better explain to Hamill why Luke is so unwilling to become a mentor or step father like figure to this orphan who craves family. He may have created this because he can’t otherwise understand why Luke wouldn’t be more empathetic to a fatherless child, having been one himself. He may have constructed this to explain that he tried that and feels he failed at that once already.

 

If that is canon, however. The thing is... Mark Hamill made it up just to get into the right mood. However, that doesn't mean he literally had a son that accidentally stabbed himself with a lightsaber. It's saying that Sheev Palpatine having a teddy bear (which he ripped apart to show how evil he was) when he was a child is totally canon because Ian McDarmid said so.

Again, Mark Hamill knows what would happen if he even compares Daisy Ridley to his own daughter. And note that he never said that Luke didn't have a second child. Whatever the case may be, the mysterious pain of loss is something that Luke will have, and it is something that Rey is also feeling regarding her parents. Could it be that their stories intertwine a long time ago?

 

I understand it’s not his actual canon backstory. The significance is more that he felt the need to invent one as a result of there not being one provided that’s relevent to his role in TLJ or his relationship with the character of Rey. What’s more he ran this past Rian Johnson himself to ensure that this made up backstory of marrying and being a step father whose son is tragically killed doesn’t outright contradict how his approach to Luke should be. Not only for how it would impact his approach to a fatherless girl seeking family but also as it relates to his relationship with Ben Solo.

 

Unless there are further details, no one can say for sure what was shown in TLJ regarding Luke and what was missing in his backstory. Mark Hamill has noticeably been downplaying his role, insisting he's not the main character despite other presses saying that Rey and Luke's relationship is the beating heart of the story. Makes you wonder if there is more to Luke than he's letting on. Furthermore, Mark Hamill said he didn't agree with Luke's direction in TLJ until he saw the final cut. But his headcanon backstory was likely made during filming, meaning he didn't have all the details in play.

If one has to guess why he needed to make a new backstory to get into the role, I'm going on whim and say that perhaps Luke didn't went bitter after Kylo Ren betrayed him. He was bitter and cynical even before then. Or he did something that would be shocking to say the least.

 

A beating heart is what keeps the circulatory system going, gets the blood moving. Luke's rejection of Rey drives her towards Kylo.

I say this mainly to indicate that "beating heart" is a term in need of clarification IMO. Especially considering where the marketing has went now. I can almost imagine RJ saying "there are multiple things at the heart of TLJ" kind of like how these films "have multiple protagonists."

 

A beating heart suggests that the film is only alive if that relationship is there. Without that heart, the film dies as a story.

After all, some people may not be familiar with a circulatory system sadly, but they do know that you need a beating heart to stay alive.

 

Well it is regardless. RJ said he started out by trying to figure out why Luke is on that island and a lot of the Rey/Luke story is about unpacking that. Anyway, I'm in more of a wait and see mode on the "beating heart" vs. the "at the heart" discussions since the marketing has gone through some phases. The Rey/Luke phase was earlier and the the Rey/Kylo phase is closer to present.

 

Luke and Rey's relationship, imo, is more important than just pushing Rey to Kylo. I think the pushing Rey to Kylo part is earlier in the film, and will play a part in the growth of Rey and Luke's relationship. I think it was DR that discussed how Luke and Rey end up somewhere quite different at the end of the film than where they start, and I remember having the impression that it was meant in a positive way.

 

And that is not to say both relationships won't be important, but at this stage Mark Hamill and Adam Driver seem to feel Rey and Kylo are the focal or central relationship. Adam called them the "centre" of the story in a Japanese interview and Mark said the focus is on the two of them and Rey's journey. Rian has also been fairly vocal about their dynamic. What he's describing is not a 2 1/2 hour Rey and Luke bonding ceremony, but rather a tough-love relationship between a grief-stricken mentor and a student in need of guidance. Their interactions on the island create some kind of chain effect that leads Rey down a certain path, where she finds what she's looking for from a very unexpected place (Kylo).

I'm curious to see how the Rey and Luke connection ultimately fits with Rian's "beating heart" description (which IMO could be in need of clarification). I don't believe he meant that Rey and Luke's relationship is the heart of the narrative, but rather that they influence each other in some way, that their meeting sparks something within them and drives them to make certain crucial steps in their development. Luke indirectly impacts Rey, Rey indirectly brings Luke back to reality.

Simply put, their connection serves the function of driving significant parts of the narrative.

A new quote from Mark about his state of mind:

 

Here's the quote:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/life...nd-more-star-war-last-jedi-teasers/851353001/

Clearly Luke and Rey start off somewhere bad, with Rey disappointed. This has been emphasized the most in marking, which is to be expected because it's the beginning of the conflict. That they take a tremendous journey to where they end up in the film tells us that they don't end where they begin.

It doesn't matter that Luke isn't one of our new stars or leads. Neither was Vader, ever, in the OT. Like Vader, Luke is important to the extent that he is important to Rey, and Rey undertakes a journey with him.

 

I'm seeing everything about Luke in TLJ through the prism of that book. I might even reread some of the chapters tonight. But yeah, the Tides chapter seems particularly informative when it comes to the Luke/Rey stuff. It's even centered on Luke and a young girl with force sensitivity.

The other part that I think is relevant is the testing they subject him to after they agree to give him a chance. Luke was put through the absolute ringer, and his young girl sidekick in the story had already been put through that awful test even younger than she was in the story. And through all that, Luke failed, but still learned a great deal. On the whole, he found it all very enlightening and rewarding. Makes sense that that might have an impact on his teaching.

 

Rey and Luke's relationship is absolutely going to develop. Nobody has been shy about saying Rey and Luke end up in a very different place by the end of the story. They obviously don't consider that a spoiler in any way. It's what encourages that development that intrigues me. They're probably going to part ways on Ahch-To on somewhat bad terms. It's going to take something huge to get through to Luke. What's going to make him lift that X-Wing out of the water and return to his sister's side?

 

I’m sure Rey’s early relationship with Luke will absolutely push her towards Kylo. But what some people seem to not be considering is that Kylo might push her right back to Luke. She might go to Kylo and nope the heck right out of there in Act 3. And maybe her running away will force Luke to leave the island to go after her and, at the end, they both realize they were wrong.

I’m not saying this is going to happen, but Rey leaving Luke to find Kylo/Snoke doesn’t mean it won’t roll back around to be Rey/Luke at the end. Even if the central action involves Kylo and Rey.


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The beating heart always expands and contracts. Push and Pull. Like good parental relationship story, you're always going to have a strain between the two before you mend your mistakes and recoil with each other.

 

I am a big believer that something incredibly positive and powerful is going to come out of Rey and Kylo's connection. It can't not, IMO. Not with the way they've been talking about the dynamic and the overall story.

Rey's bond with Luke and Rey's bond with Kylo are not mutually exclusive in my eyes. When you explore one you explore the other because Luke and Kylo share monumental history. However Rey and Kylo impact each other is also going to impact Luke.

 

I do think Rey and Kylo’s relationship will be ultimately positive, too, even though I waver on my own personal feelings on the subject. What I’m absolutely not sure of, though, is if it’ll happen this film.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Rey reaches out to him in compassion and he rejects her and hits rock bottom only to realize in IX that he needs to truly change. Maybe he’ll see Rey mend her relationship with Luke and see ‘My god, forgiveness and compassion are possible.’ I think she’s likely Luke’s daughter so her forgiveness of Luke could mirror his rejection of Han. And seeing her ultimately become better and stronger for it may save him by example. Even if she’s not Luke’s daughter and he’s just a fatherly or mentor-esque figure for her, this dynamic could still work if Luke somehow played a role in her abandonment or isolation.

I think just building up the Rey/Kylo relationship this film is enough without it having to fully change in dynamic or, in other words, go straight into positive friendliness. They’re sworn enemies in VII, they reach a tentative understanding in VIII, they ally themselves in IX. That, to me, is a more reasonable progression. And Rian does say Kylo’s redemption isn’t totally up to him and Adam implies Kylo suffering greatly at the end of VIII.

I just don’t think Rey’s relationship with Luke is lessened or diminished because of her relationship with Kylo or vice versa. They’re both critical. They are both central and likely parallel in many ways. That’s why she’s literally standing between them both on the poster.

And I could also be 100% wrong. I fully admit that.


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I'm sure Luke and Rey will not get along all the time, just like Anakin/Obi Luke/Yoda.

 

But they also described their relationship as not being a Luke/Yoda relationship. Or Obi-Wan/Luke either. This is something else.