ST Luke Skywalker/Mark Hamill Discussion Thread [SEE WARNING ON PAGE 134]

I think they could've stood to have Rey be Luke's daughter and structure a story about the burden of legacy in TLJ. Lord willing, these are the ideas that God blessed me with:

First, an exploration of backstory:

I don’t fully mind what they did with Luke. In concept I like it, but I think there’s things left out that could round out the character and explore his characterization and reasons for his actions. Luke began a new jedi order. He married Mara Jade, they have a daughter, Rey, but then the emergence of a new dark side force begins, the first order rises and Luke doesn't understand why this has happened again. Anakin destroyed the sith. It should be over. While I don’t know if I’d go for this, but Mara Jade is killed in battle defending her daughter in the midst of a raid by the first order, maybe even the Knights Of Ren do it.

Luke, tormented by this, furiously digs for information about why this has begun again, and finds out the meaning of it, that the balance is a cycle, not a single event. When he senses the dark side in Ben, senses Snoke’s influence, he feels it all happen again, the fall of the jedi, the rise of the empire, the destruction of the family he has left. In that moment of fear and pain, shaken by the perception of his family being destroyed by a rise of another Vader, he allows his fear to drive him, and considers killing his nefew, maybe even in a way to almost spare him the pain that his future could bring him, taking out his lightsaber, but not igniting it, realizing that it would be wrong to do, maybe even seeing his robot hand, reminding him of the events of ROTJ.

But Ben senses that and lashes out in rage. The new jedi order is burned, his daughter gone, her dead he thinks and his powers gone. Luke sees this as almost the force punishing him for what he did. Casting out those remaining, among them a partner in his training Lor San Tekka, sending R2D2 with him.

Luke himself not realizing that Ben had taken Rey, feeling tempted to kill her to avoid a threat to his rightful Skywalker lineage, but being unable to kill his cousin, he wiped her mind of any training she’d gotten by Luke and abandoned her on Jakku. Lor San Tekka discovered Rey and that’s why he was there and was willing to reveal the map to Luke at this time. He believed the knowledge of his daughter being alive, would reignite the spark of hope inside him, a message he never had the chance to relay to Poe, before the first order attacked. Han considered this to be the case as well after meeting her and Leia sensed it after they met as well. Kylo began to see it after hearing about it.

Rey would find out she's Luke's daughter at the end of act 1. Rey assumes he left her on jakku for her protection.

Luke over the course of the movie does grow to rediscover his goals by the end. Dealing with the loss of Han and him blaming himself for that, seeing his failure with Ben as the cause. All through finding out that Rey is his daughter and connecting to her and admitting what he did with Ben, feeling like he's been disconnected from the force as a punishment, seeing him considering killing Ben as not much different than what Vader had done when killing the younglings. He sees his 2nd chance in Rey.

But this is hurt when, at the end of act 2, Rey discovers that Luke didn't try to find her after she was taken. Luke is in shame by this, as Rey leaves.

Kylo, still through their link, tells Rey that Luke didn't leave her on jakku to protect her, but that he (Kylo) took her to kill her, but couldn't. Now, Rey, after discovering the pain and loss that comes with being a Skywalker, to the point of feeling abandoned and betrayed by Luke, her dad, after finding out that Luke didn't come looking for her, out of fear of finding her dead, she lashes out at him, angry and hurt, feeling abandoned and betrayed, telling him he has nothing to teach her. Luke is in shame by this. Rey then decides to go after Kylo, without Luke's help, for the death of Han and Finn being hurt.

Luke is then confronted by either Yoda or Obi-Wan (or both), who explain to him that he's seen Vader in himself and thus saw his failure as if he would be like him, saying that Luke has lost sight of what made him him, and it wasn't being a jedi. Them telling him the folly of not seeing his own humanity, underneath being a jedi, confronting him with truth of what happened to Padme, who Luke has no memories of and hasn't connected with (seeing only the Vader/Anakin in himself), telling him that they sensed in her that the children were beginning to die in the womb, but she gave up every ounce of life force she had left to keep alive, in spite of not being a jedi or force sensitive. In the midst of this Luke realizes that he cut himself off from the force in his shame and self loathing, he wasn't being punished. He reaches through the force and out to Padme, seeing her after she's given birth to him, even in the present feeling the touch of her energy on his face, hearing her call his name, seeing her and Anakin. Luke cries tears of acceptance, reconciling his humanity with his jedi identity. Luke resolves to go after Rey.

This all builds to the conclusion where Kylo has taken Leia hostage, and has killed Snoke, and Rey confronts him, Luke coming in after, this all igniting a battle between them all, and Rey tries to kill him, but Kylo defeats her. His powers outmatching hers, tossing her off to the Knights of Ren. Luke arrives in time, brandishing his green light saber, facing Kylo and (though this is more a suggestion) but Luke taking Anakin's lightsaber and passing it off to Leia, to assist. As Rey steals one of the Knights weapons and tries to fight them off. Them both battling Kylo and trying to reach him. Kylo exclaiming that he's building a legacy, beyond the Skywalkers now. Luke and Leia firing back that all he is another dark sider leading a stormtrooper army.

Kylo, realizing they're right, uses his powers to turn all the ships of the first order on eachother, stating a new path, "No more stormtroopers, no more death stars, no more empire." Making the statement of the dark side being the only thing left, and using the ships weapons to destroy eachother, even Snoke's ship, Kylo casually protecting himself from the destruction. Rey is the first the recover and tries to catch Kylo off guard, who stomps her, wounds her and in a petty slash of vengeance, slices the lightsaber over Rey's left eye, blinding her in it and scarring her. He lifts his lightsaber up and brings it down as a final blow, but Leia takes the hit for Rey. Kylo, for all his villainy, is still enraged at this and tears the already damaged ship apart in his pain and anger. This allows Luke and Rey to escape with a dying Leia. (In the hindsight of Carrie's passing.)

Leia tells Luke she knows what happened and she forgives him. Luke apologizing for Han and what he did, promising he won't give up again. Rey, devastated at what she sees as her fault, tries to help, refuses to believe there isn't a way. Luke holds her off, her crying, as she apologizes to Leia. Who simply reminds her that they all make mistakes and apart of her believes her son isn't gone. Luke reaffirming that with the no one's ever really gone line. And with that Leia peacefully passes away.

And with that we end the movie:

Luke having re-established his goal of heroism and maybe even left as a resistance member.

And Rey, as she stands out in front of the forcefield of the x-wing bay, in the starship, over looking an ocean of stars, holding Anakin's lightsaber. She, in a rejection of the Skywalker legacy and the pain and death that comes with it, throws the lightsaber into space.

The movie ending on her standing in front of that ocean of stars.

 

Yes. Actually, as has been pointed out, the clock started at 7pm on 12/19/2019 so at exactly 7pm on 12/19/2039, everyone who hated the ST will suddenly realize all at once the error of their ways

For some reason, my phone is not giving me notifications in the right order and I totally missed this post!! I gave it a thumb up purely because I appreciate all the thought you put into it and I promise to read it when I get the chance!!

 

He did look at it for quite a while (i thought) but he's also more sensitive to a stranger handing his Father's LS so he's irritated by the way Rey just handing it over after he's living in a different place and having a negative mindset. Hence although he tossed the saber he's not going to trash it (crush it with Jedi skills) he's just showing Rey her place vs Him.

Yes I agree here.

I don't watch movies thinking what the writers thought. I think the scene in question works well for the Luke I was expecting. IMO, It Just what the doctor ordered.

 

I don't either, for the record. It's just something I had read and thought it was an interesting parallel.

 

I finally found an appropriate way to describe why Luke Skywalker just doesn't work in TLJ. Imagine you go to see THE DARK KNIGHT and Batman uses guns.

"Why is Batman using a gun?"

"Because of that flashback scene where he was afraid of dying."

"Yeah, but I mean WHY is he using guns?"

"Because the movie said so."

"Just because it said so isn't a very good reason. In BATMAN BEGINS he was against guns."

"There was the scene where he was going to shoot Joe Chill."

"What?"

"Bruce Wayne used a gun in the last movie. It was established that he uses guns."

"But his arc was that he doesn't use guns."

"People aren't perfect. By the end of THE DARK KNIGHT he's not using guns anymore anyway so what difference does it make?"

And then to add insult to injury, it's actually the middle chapter of a Nightwing trilogy.

 

Well actually, in the Dark Knight Returns, Batman does use a gun.

(and come to think of it...he also steps away from crimefighting after losing a protege, before joining the fight again years later as a jaded old man, mentoring a young girl)

 

...but not the Nolan Batman. I specifically said BATMAN BEGINS for a reason.

 

https://geekositymag.com/sebastian-stan-eyed-for-luke-skywalker-projects/

 

How credible is this and how BS is this, i can see it happenning but also be a fan dream.

 

I've been following Mikey Sutton on FB for a couple of years. His sources have been on point completely (lots of SW, Marvel and DC rumors).

 

I can this 50/50 like Kenobi in Andor. Kessel run and Illuminati has had right on many things too, but recently got flacks for their wrongs.

 

It would make sense to recast Luke. it would certainly be the most budget and effects friendly option. but I'm surprised they would do it now after they bothered with the whole CGI option in The Mandalorian.

You would think they would have set that recast template back then.

Although in that article it says

If it set before episode 4 i dunno how Sebastian Stan could be Luke. he seems abit too older to be teen Luke.

It seems abit messy to be believed tbh.

 

probaly because of secret that Luke would show up.

 

Who knows.

But: Sebastian Stan is 38. That's Luke c.15 years after ROTJ. Two years before Rey was lost. The KOR vs Clan years in those early leaks.

 

Actors don't have to play a character the same age as they are. Stan could easily play vague early 30ish.

Anyways. I don't think it's real yet. Stan is busy with Winter Solider (prob), and having him jump into a Luke role might be weird since MH has played Luke at various ages now.

Like other SW projects I believe when I see it's actually being made.

 

I think LFL rather go with unknowns or not as known in hollywood. Like the live ation Ezra is rumored to be someone not well known.

 

This isn’t true. He’s always been hit or miss and his “scoops” are typically very obvious developments.

 

In the The Dark Knight, Bruce Wayne nearly turns himself in/gives up being Batman in order stop the Joker from killing people. Yet, as Alfred describes, Bruce comes to terms with the fact that the point of Batman is that he can endure. Batman will always make the right choice, Batman will never stop, Batman "has no limits."

Keeping with this idea, the film ends with Gordon and the Gotham PD hunting Batman because as Gordon says, "(Batman) can take it."

Flash forward 8 years. It turns out Batman couldn't take it.

Bruce Wayne has given up on life because of the guilt/emotional trauma of losing Rachel. Despite the fact that this is the very thing he overcame in the previous film, The Dark Knight Rises revisits this theme to show a reclusive, bearded, out of game, removed from the equation Batman. In his absence, a new evil has been festering in Gotham born of the evil League of Shadows that Batman previous thought he defeated two films earlier. This evil group has come back despite seemingly being destroyed in Batman Begins.

Even after hearing his good friend/mentor/partner Gordon has been shot and nearly killed, it takes a young, idealistic hero (Blake) to convince Bruce Wayne to become the symbol/hero that Gotham needs. Batman does so, and ultimately inspires/saves the city and (seemingly)sacrifices himself in the process.

The movie ends showing that Batman passes the torch to the next generation (with some name changing shenanigans) and the Batman will live on through a new character that "earned" the mantle.

 

Are we pretending THE DARK KNIGHT RISES isn't a terrible, bloated movie? People only ever talk about the first two for a reason. You can't justify one bad movie with another. Both TDKR and TLJ are terrible films.

 

So you haven't been following the past year so you don't know what he's reported. Got it.

And the knock against him because it was obvious or that reddit "proof"? Proof is in the pudding and he's been on point since I've followed.

We shall see.

 

I don't think any of that.

 

You know what'd be even worse? If Bane's mask was necessary because Bane was in the temple that Bruce burned down in BB and when Bane finally showed up to Gotham, even though Bruce was directly responsible for Bane's injury and thus his guided anger, Bruce was still like, "Nah, Gotham needs to learn how to deal with my mistakes without my help."

I still think the movie is terrible. And the whole NUKE plot was pants-on-head.

 

I like TDKR for what it is but there’s definitely some “turn your brain off and just go with it” moments.