main
side
curve
  1. Welcome to the new boards! Details here!

  2. The Boards Are Now Reopened For Business:

    READ THIS: your ability to post here depends upon it.. See the new rules thread here. Bans can and will be handed out to anyone who doesn't abide by the forum rules.

ST Luke Skywalker/Mark Hamill Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by Pro Scoundrel , Jan 3, 2020.

  1. Glitterstimm

    Glitterstimm Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 30, 2017
    @AndrewPascoe well I certainly agree he was wasted in TROS. There was no effort put into making Rey his heir, either figuratively or more literally. One of the expectations that LFL clearly had for the character, was that he would "pass the torch," and they utterly failed imo.
     
  2. Nate787

    Nate787 Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2016

    Yep. Another example of something JJ should have left alone but instead made it worse. He had enough of his own unanswered mystery boxes he should have addressed - he had no business trying to "fix" someone else's storylines.
     
  3. AndrewPascoe

    AndrewPascoe Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2014
    Look I can head canon the hell out of Luke, his X-Wing and Crait.

    Luke Realised he either didn’t have time to physically reach Crait or that he wouldn’t make it due to the FO that projection was the only option. It’s not great especially given that parts of the wing were used for a door to his hut but I can live with it.


    It would’ve been so interesting to see how different Rey’s interactions with Luke and Leia would’ve been had Carrie not passed. I feel that this aspect of the story would’ve improved remarkably but we’ll never knows
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
    Shadao, VanLiz and Glitterstimm like this.
  4. Nate787

    Nate787 Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2016
    My head cannon is similar. He realized he needed to go to Crait after his talk with Yoda but Rey already left and his Xwing was out of commission. Force projection was the only way.

    That's why I hate that JJ ignored the fact that parts were missing AND had Luke verbally admit he was wrong and afraid. Stupid move and I can't believe he thought that was better. The ST ends at TLJ for me as one last heroic epilogue for Luke.
     
    JeanNo likes this.
  5. AndrewPascoe

    AndrewPascoe Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2014
    See I have no issue with Luke admitting he was wrong I just feel that it rehashes his monologue to Kylo on Crait. It’s not new ground.
     
  6. LastSonOfAsgard

    LastSonOfAsgard Jedi Knight

    Registered:
    Apr 18, 2016
    “Long have I waited to Rise! Muahahaha!!!”


    Not but seriously, it’s been a long time since I’ve posted on this board. Since before The Force Awakens came out. I went into that movie feeling incredibly excited. I had heard the news of them doing the impossible. Disney had bought the franchise and there was A New Hope. A sequel trilogy?? Finally! Bringing back the original actors was the filling inside the beautiful delicious donut. It was a dream come true. We were finally going to get a continuation of the story of my beloved characters in my favorite film franchise. My childhood idols and heroes.


    I grew up watching the prequels at the cinema. I liked them as fun generic CGI films. I knew that Darth Vader would fall and went into the cinema with a heavy heart knowing what was to become. Although throughout the journey, everything seemed so real. Anakin was a good Jedi right? There were so many Jedi, so many cool Jedi, how could they all die? They would beat the evil Chancellor once he was discovered and Anakin being the good person that he is would choose good and there could be a celebration. Alas, what we got was more heartbreaking than I could have ever imagined. The story was frustrating, sad, depressing, but at the end there was Hope. The ending made up the entire trilogy for me. It was all set up for Leia and especially Luke to be the future of the galaxy. To be the ones who would stand up to the Empire and the Emperor and fight for good. To be heroes.


    I watched the A New Hope and I was initially frustrated. Why were the visual effects so bad? Why was the lightsaber duel so underwhelming? Well Empire improved on a lot of those, and I started falling in love with the style and with the characters and story. It was so simple yet so meaningful. Watching the characters develop into better people and at the same time the Rebellion stand up to those who oppress, those who bully, who are in power as an inspiration in courage. Return of the Jedi solidified my love of the franchise. Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader fighting for each other's soul. The Rebellion using every last ingenuity, courage, sacrifice and bit of luck they could muster to fight the giant terror of the galaxy and win. It was epic. The final scene with Luke, Leia, Han, R2D2, C3PO, Chewie, the Rebels and the Ewoks was happiness is made out of.The image of the celebration has been seared into my consciousness as a metaphor for ultimate victory and happiness.


    What they did to Luke, Leia, Han, the galaxy and the franchise has been nothing short of massive disappointment. Where we dared to dream of a better future. One where Luke Skywalker learned of the past mistakes of the Jedi and become something more. A hero. One that never gave up hope on his family and the intrinsic goodness of people. One who won not by fighting but by showing compassion. The story George Lucas told was not like those that are common today. There’s countless examples, where there is a powerful character and what makes them awesome is their power. They are big, they are strong, they are powerful. And that’s enough for them.


    George went a different direction, he wanted to show that power comes from within. And true power isn’t destructive, it’s compassionate, it’s spiritual, it’s hopeful. And that’s what Luke Skywalker is. He is the general who decides that diplomacy is better than war. The pedestrian who chooses to stop to talk and give a few dollars to the man sitting on the sidewalk. He is the pastor that goes into prisons to talk to people convicted of terrible crimes because he believes there is still hope for redemption for them. He is the man or woman who decides that what makes greatness is choosing not violence but peace. That friendship is something to be cherished. That the true fight being that of protecting the good and innocent.


    These are the lessons that were taught in the Original Trilogy. These were the principles Luke chose to live and die for. These are what makes him one of the greatest cinematic heroes. This is what makes Luke Skywalker a better hero than Han Solo or Indiana Jones. What makes him a better role model than the countless generic action heroes.


    Luke provided an alternative. And those of us who grew up feeling like outcasts, or lonely, or were bullied, or abandoned, he provided someone to relate to. Someone who could make us feel like we were important and could do great things too..


    This is why I was struck from the beginning with TFA, how could the situation had gone so badly? Where was the New Republic? Where was the Jedi Order? Where were the things that an entire galactic war were fought and won for? Where were the rewards for the sacrifice of good people. For the bravery and heroism of countless thousands across the years, across the stars. Was it all for nothing?? This reboot took the least optimistic, least creatively interesting, and least ambitious route and destroyed the state of the galaxy and the characters that were cultural icons in our world.


    The Last Jedi finished what TFA started. Destroying the character of Luke. Who turned out to be one of the worst impulsive reckless emotionally unbalanced characters ever portrayed on film. The portrayal as a hero as not one, but instead almost a villain. Contemplating and for a second deciding to kill his nephew. His own blood. The son of his beloved sister and brother-in-arms. This was compounded by the fact that after one mistake in his life, he let it consume him to the point where he resigned himself to slow suicide. Simply put, it’s one of the most depressing character assassinations ever shown on film. I don’t understand the thought process behind it all. Deconstructing a character can make them more layered and complex. But there is a certain point to a deconstruction. A deconstruction is supposed to outline the character and themes and place ask, what would happen if we seriously considered the implications of these. At the end of ROTJ, Luke showed us what made him so heroic, so human. It was his compassion, hope, tenacity and patience. A deconstruction isn’t replacing the character with something unrecognizable for the sake of turning heroes into villains. Do some men/women fail, of course they do. But giving up is something else entirely. Giving up is the bleakest imaginable state to leave a character. It ends all hope. There is no more forward progression. No matter how much time passed, there would be nothing better. This is not the lessons that George Lucas liked to tell.


    Rise of Skywalker, just adds on to the pile of failure. While some of the fan service was nice (I seriously got emotional when he lifted the X-Wing). It was further indictment of Luke’s character as he was ultimately cowardly for not going and fighting for justice, peace and to save his friends and family. On top of his already fledgling accomplishments looking even more underwhelming under the new scope of powers. Rey could have easily lifted the X-Wing herself given her power. And Luke’s power seemed tame compared to the god-like force use in the final battle. He did behave more like one would expect old man Luke to behave. But it doesn’t come anywhere close to retroactively fixing his portrayal. It’s a real travesty that for so many this will be legend of Luke Skywalker.


    To conclude, I’m not in despair over his portrayal by Disney and new Lucasfilm. I’ve decided to reject this timeline, this trilogy and this canon. I had never been a fan of the Expanded Universe but now it seems like it’s the best post-ROTJ story we will ever get. Just a shame we won’t be able to enjoy it on film with the beloved actors that made Star Wars, Star Wars. It seems that there are things that never work out and seemingly the Empire and the Sith won out at the end. But alas, there is always precious history to cherish and optimism for a better future, even if beyond our lifetimes. These characters are eternal and their heroism will live on in our hearts and those of future generations.
     
    Jango723, Luc12, afrojedi and 19 others like this.
  7. reyvision

    reyvision Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 12, 2017
    The handling of Luke in this trilogy will always be one of the weakest things, by far. It really makes me sad.
     
  8. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval Subscription Screaming Service star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    The Force imbued water on Ahch-To repairs machinery and Luke knew the exact amount of time the X-Wing needed to marinate in there before it was completely operational. The Battle of Crait was too soon.
     
  9. Nate787

    Nate787 Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2016
    True. But I despise it because you can see it was put in as one of the bullet points he thought he needed to address to appease the complainers. Quit worrying about that and just write that story.
     
  10. AndrewPascoe

    AndrewPascoe Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2014
    Oh god you’ve just reminded me I need to baste the tie fighters on the barbecue. Thanks!
     
    ImpKnight likes this.
  11. chris hayes

    chris hayes Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 13, 2012
    No doubt grumpy Luke was divisive but man Mark Hamill gave one hell of a performance and somewhat redeemed in TROS.....
     
    Darth Gummybear likes this.
  12. Ender_and_Bean

    Ender_and_Bean Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 19, 2002
    I’ll never understand the fascination of some wanting him to be there to die rather than dying while appearing like a total badass to the FO in a way where kids were hyped about it later all while levitating in a yoga pose in the comfort of his robes in his new home.

    Forget the selfless sacrifice aspect; Luke’s my hero BECAUSE he pulled off the ultimate ****ing work from home day like a champ. My only disappointment was that he wasn’t eating some fish and drinking green milk as he did it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  13. RDeckard

    RDeckard Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2015
    You may not like it, but nothing about Luke's character was unbelievable.

    I think the problem you may have is TFA/TLJ Luke is all too real. It's apparent his encounter with the dark side of the force at the end of RotJ has left him with a fear of the dark side which caused him to act irrationally towards Ben Solo. This is literally the most human thing they could have done with Luke Skywalker.

    Also, you wax poetic about a character "giving up" and so on but didn't Yoda, the greatest Jedi in the saga, do the exact same thing for a time?

    I'm sorry, I think I understand where your coming from when I filter out all the emotion, but Luke is a sad character to be pitied. He was charged with bringing the Jedi back and he failed.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  14. VanLiz

    VanLiz Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2002
    His ghost repeated Obi-Wan's words to Rey. For some reason, after seeing the prequel trilogy, my eyes water when Obi-Wan says those words to Luke after he blows up the Death Star.
     
  15. VanLiz

    VanLiz Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 13, 2002
    That was an awesome display of power. I always figured that by the time Luke changed his mind about helping, it was too late to pull the X-wing out of the water. He would not have reached them in time.
     
    JeanNo likes this.
  16. Solo88

    Solo88 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2018
    Rey succeeded where Luke failed because reasons.
     
  17. RDeckard

    RDeckard Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Rey didn't succeed where Luke failed. We have no idea what she does after the trilogy.
     
    JeanNo likes this.
  18. Solo88

    Solo88 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2018
    She killed the Sith. She did what no Jedi ever could.
     
  19. RDeckard

    RDeckard Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2015
    That sounds like a gripe with TRoS.

    Originally, I had this theory that Kylo Ren was a fringe Sith, which is to say that Snoke was a fraud and was playing with fire he couldn't control. By doing so, Kylo Ren becomes a complete mess, drunk with Dark Side force power.

    Unfortunately, JJ in his infinite wisdom had to dredge up Palpatine again. Awful.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
    AgentCoop likes this.
  20. Solo88

    Solo88 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 31, 2018
    I do have a gripe with TROS. As well with TLJ. Doesn't negate the fact that TLJ made Luke a failure to prop up Rey as a character.
     
  21. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 23, 2015
    But according to Terrio, we’re supposed to think Luke won because Palpatine’s granddaughter chose to be a Skywalker instead. That’s what really matters for his legacy.
     
    Thrawn082, ami-padme, Chémus and 7 others like this.
  22. themoth

    themoth Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2015
    What’s with his hair? It looked laughable. So distracting in a bad way.
     
    Chémus likes this.
  23. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett PT Interview Host/All-Around Good Guy star 10 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2014
    It just looked so different for some reason compared to his TLJ hair.
     
    themoth likes this.
  24. Chémus

    Chémus Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2019
    It's been outlined before that Luke and Yoda's exiles were completely different circumstances. I'm someone who doesn't mind Luke's moment of weakness, even though it's ostensibly out of character for an older, wiser Luke. What Rian completely failed at was to convince a large portion of the audience that Luke would abandon his sister, best friend, and the galaxy after his failure with Ben. This isn't real life, it's a story. A skilled writer can take a character to a place that we'd never expect based on prior characterization, but explaining it away with a 30 second flashback and minimal exposition is not going to cut it for such a 180 in character.
     
    Hmmmm, Thrawn082, AgentCoop and 4 others like this.
  25. RDeckard

    RDeckard Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2015
    Again, you're kind of just waving it away. Obi-Wan quit too by your definition.

    It's a story but these characters are real and it's far more believable that Luke is terrified of the dark side rising again than the idea that he just is completely blind to the dark side.

    This is all fairly straight-forward stuff.