Mod Squad Update for the week ending April 23

1) If there is no basher/gusher "problem" then what purpose do the Basher and Gusher threads serve currently?

We have given that answer already.

2) If the rule of the TPM forum is to talk about the topics, not the posters, then why have two threads about a poster's alignment?

Both thread are talking about the movies so they are on topic.

3) If they are being preserved for the community each thread provides, why not move them to the community forum?

They are fine right were they are at. If Quix and Steve feel that way and a lot of people feel that way leave them were they are at.

Edit: What if they don't care about ridding the TPM forum of the basher gusher conflict?

Go-Mer it's been said so many times I don't know if I shoudl say it again but I will. The G/B war is nothing new it has been going on before both threads started and it will go on long after EP3 even if you close those two threads that will not end the G/B war. You will always have poster that like or do not like something about SW.

But instead of always having ever last thread become a G/B war. They can go to the BS thread where they can talk with others about why they do not like soem things in the PT.

 

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[i]1) If there is no basher/gusher "problem" then what purpose do the Basher and Gusher threads serve currently?[/i]

We have given that answer already.[hr][/blockquote]Then perhaps you could find that and repost it for people who are under the impression that this question has not been answered.[blockquote][hr][i]2) If the rule of the TPM forum is to talk about the topics, not the posters, then why have two threads about a poster's alignment?[/i]

Both thread are talking about the movies so they are on topic.[hr][/blockquote]The question is why have two threads that are about a poster's alignment with the "bashers" and the "gushers" if the TPM forum rule is to make threads about the topics, not the posters? Since you bring up topics, why not talk about TPM topics in threads for those topics?
[blockquote][hr][i]3) If they are being preserved for the community each thread provides, why not move them to the community forum?[/i]

They are fine right were they are at. If Quix and Steve feel that way and a lot of people feel that way leave them were they are at.[hr][/blockquote]I disagree. I think they polarize the TPM forum. On top of that, I think Quixotic and Oaks prefer it that way.

Just becausae the Basher/Gusher war isn't new, doesn't mean we shouldn't try and stop it now.

 

OK I am going to now try to reply to Go-Mer's post hoping it will not get edited 6 more times whilst I am typing this.


I gave up on both of them a long time ago.

I am hoping there are less biased people to appeal to at TFN.

The problem is that TFN is endorsing the basher/gusher rift in the TPM forum.

I don't want them closed, I want them moved to community where the other fan/hate threads have been located.

There might be "less biased" people here at TFN but they all seem to defer to the TPM Mods on this one Go-Mer. Not sure how effective this debate can continue to be when their minds are made up.


Strilo, do you care to answer the questions I put forth?

1) If there is no basher/gusher "problem" then what purpose do the Basher and Gusher threads serve currently?

2) If the rule of the TPM forum is to talk about the topics, not the posters, then why have two threads about a poster's alignment?

3) If they are being preserved for the community each thread provides, why not move them to the community forum?

4) Why would the people who frequent these threads stop posting if they were moved?


Questions 1 2 and 3 have been answered so many times in here, I will not answer them yet again. As for question 4, I myself just answered that one earlier. I will not speak for people on their own decisions. You'd need to ask them.

 

Once again, no answers, just restatements that they have been answered.

The truth is you have no answers that would sound good right?

Here is the best I can come up with from the recent discussions here...

1) If there is no basher/gusher "problem" then what purpose do the Basher and Gusher threads serve currently?

To keep the basher gusher fires burning.

2) If the rule of the TPM forum is to talk about the topics, not the posters, then why have two threads about a poster's alignment?

To keep the basher gusher fires burning.

3) If they are being preserved for the community each thread provides, why not move them to the community forum?

Because the people who frequent these threads won't be able to find them anymore.

4) Why would the people who frequent these threads stop posting if they were moved?

Because it's no fun when you aren't baiting people.

 

Just becausae the Basher/Gusher war isn't new, doesn't mean we shouldn't try and stop it now.

Closeing those two threads will not end it. If people don't like the movies they will say they do not like it.


Edit: To keep the basher gusher fires burning.

?

Because it's no fun when you aren't baiting people.

The DF and BS threads are not making people bait. Posters do that be they a basher, a gusher, or nether.

 

I DON'T WANT THEM CLOSED, JUST MOVED TO COMMUNITY

I think it would be great if people still came to the TPM forum to tell us all how much they didn't like it, I just think they should be doing it in TOPIC related threads, not from an entrenched base of operations.

 

I think it would be great if people still cmae to the TPM forum to tell us all how much they didn't like it, I just think they should be doing it in TOPIC related threads, not from an entrenched base of operations.

? Go-Mer your really making this a bigger deal then it is. There two threads that have done nothing to hurt the fanbase.

People have given answer after answer about way they should not be moved, closed, etc.

Give us a really good reason. I'm asking you to give a really good reason. Find something form one of the thread anything. That's all post a link then you may have something.

But on tell I can see good proof. Like Quix, Steve, Strilo, and others have said it is a mutt issues know.

 

Once again, no answers, just restatements that they have been answered.

They HAVE been answered. You are not listening. Go read this thread and the rest of the closed threads about this subject and you will find the answers to these questions.


The truth is you have no answers that would sound good right?

The truth is exactly as I said. See above.


Here is the best I can come up with from the recent discussions here...

Ahh so you did not get answers YOU liked so now you are putting words in people's mouths. Mature.

 

Well you aren't answering my questions.

You say you are...

PPOR

I don't have to go into either thread for why they are not good. The titles themselves get right to the heart of the matter:

The Basher's Sanctuary

The TPM Defence Force (formerly the gusher's sanctuary).

They are bad because they endorse the basher/gusher mentality.

 

No I am saying many people have already provided answers to the questions you asked. I am done going round and round with you on this Go-Mer. You will not listen nor will you be happy until everyone caves in and gives you what you want.


The TPM Defence Force (formerly the gusher's sanctuary).

Sorry the TPM Defense Force was NEVER the Gushers' Sanctuary. The old TPMDF thread was changed in title only to that but the DF itself was asked to move to RPG. While there, SNowboards cleaned house and deleted the whole thing. Then we created a new one which was renamed to the TPMDF when the DF was allowed to move back to the TPM forum. The TPMDF has always been the TPMDF. The Gushers' Sanctuary is something else entirely.

 

I honestly haven't heard any answers to my questions.

All I get are demands to demonstrate why they should be moved.

Something I thought I made clear.

 

Edit: You know I'm gone do what Strilo has done. I'm done here. There is no point in this.

 

The proof that these threads are condoning the basher/gusher mentality lies in their very titles: "The Basher's Sanctuary" and The "TPM Defense Force".

It's proven.

If it is a "mutt" issue, it is only because TFN prefers to keep the Basher Gusher mentality alive as a matter of policy.

 

(I'm working on severely stabbed neurons here, so forgive me if I don't make any sense.)

I don't get it Go-Mer. Other than the derogatory terms that are the thread titles, I see absolutely no problem with them. There are always going to be people who dislike a movie, just as there are always going to be people who like it (well at movies like TPM, anyway). I, for myself, dislike some points about TPM and love others, so I probably - if I frequented TPM - would post in both threads. Firstly, I wouldn't go to SW Community looking for threads related to TPM. When you have a forum for TPM itself, then why move threads discussing the movie to other forums?

Secondly, I still am unclear about what exactly your problem is.

I know there are some people who simply like said character/movie/idea/whatever so much that they just can't stop themselves from going into the Bashers' Sanctuary and defending their opinions. (I'm not saying you're one of them - bear with me.) That's one possible problem - which is not going to be changed by the move. It's probably the best if the Mods simply warn and spank the users.

What exactly will this move accomplish? I can't see anything other than taking the discussion out of the TPM forum. Quite frankly, I'm all in it for debates - no matter how hostile they get, as long as we aren't sending death threats to each other, and as long as we aren't flaming each other. If we are, then that's what the Mods are there for.

I ask again - can you clearly state what exactly the problem is and how the move is going to solve that problem - and not create new problems?

Aunecah

 

The problem with these polarized threads, is they soak up most of the relevant TPM discussion. I think this discussion should be happening in threads about the topics being discussed.

1) This makes any topic easier to find for someone who isn't involved in the "basher"/"gusher" war.

2) It makes said discussion more relevant because both sides of the "TPM is great/TPM sucks" get to weigh in.

3) It keeps the discussion on the topics, and not the approach to the topics.

There has been an unwritten rule for ALL of the other film forums that there should only be 1 social thread, so as not to encourage "cliques". I don't see why TPM forum should have to suffer with them. To me, the basher gusher war should have ended a long time ago. It is counter productive to balanced discussion.

 

Thank you Go-Mer. That was succicently put, even though I have to disagree with you.

Firstly, the Basher/Gusher sanctuaries are two threads out of the twenty-five threads that are on page one.

Secondly, the Basher/Gusher sanctuaries are actually there on the first page because users are most interested in them.

If you don't like those threads, then simply ignore them. Assume that they aren't there and continue on with your posting like you have. Believe it or not, moving the threads to a different forum might in fact take away more users from the forum than bring more people in.

I understand your concerns, but I just don't see how the move will change the situation -TPM still seems to foster discussion despite the two threads.

I hope I made my points well.


Aunecah

 

Okay, this isn't going anywhere (aside from in circles), and I don't see either side changing their opinion anytime soon.

I think it's time to give this thread a break for tonight. Go, find a thread in one of the movie forums. Discuss the films. Relax a little bit. Then, if you have something new to add, feel free to revisit this thread tomorrow or at a later date.

 

Right, but out of all the threads on the first page, how many of those threads have more than 2000 posts?

I count one, "LOTR, The Matrix, and the Star Wars PT: Which trilogy will stand the test of time?" at 2217

By comparison, the TPM Defense Force has 2266, and the Basher's Sanctuary has no less than 12649! BAH! Who says we live in cynical times?

The combined post counts of ALL the other threads on the front page (aside from the basher's sanctuary and the TPM defense force) weighs in at a paltry 4251!

14915 = Basher and Gusher threads combined
4251 = Rest of the topics on the first page.

See what I am getting at?

If you are truly a proponent for differing opinions in a debate, surely you can see how discussion suffers without dissent. The Basher and Gusher threads promote intellectual stagnation. If they have to exist, I think they should be in community where they won't impact the TPM forum.

 

But why Go-Mer. The TPM forum only reflects what the fans feel about TPM. If you like the movie, then go say so in the "Gusher" thread to even out the count.

IMHO, the Bashers tend to post more in most cases because they have a strong opinion about it - if they're willing to stand up against the majority to say they don't like something, then they're usually well opinionated about it. (I'm saying this from my own experience.)

So, I still don't see what this move is going to accomplish. What do you see this move accomplishing?

Aunecah

 

They aren't standing up to the majority, they are standing up in front of a hoard of like minded people.

I am not a gusher, I want to talk about the film with other fans with different opinions.

I do stick to the other threads in the forum however, the only people posting there are newbies and the maybe 5 or so people who have yet to leave in disgust.

I see this proposed move as helping out by keeping the TPM forum about the movie, not the cliques. "Fan alignment" doesn't need to be encouraged in the movie forums IMHO, and it only serves to keep the basher/gusher conflict alive.

I would like to think that we could mature beyond this as an overall fan community.

 

OK, I'm going to post a little proof on the condition of the TPM and let you people decide for yourself. What I've done, is gone through every thread posted in from between about 1 PM and 6:30 PM board time today, checking the most recent 25 or less posts (since that's what my browser is set at) and recorded a summary of it all for you folks to see (from top down). Let's have a look, shall we?

Index Thread: no activity in over a week, not much activity in general
TPM Trivia Contest.
Just trivia and fun, nothing else that I see.
Did Alec Guiness See Episode 1 before he died?: An interesting debate as to whether Alec Guiness cared for SW at all, which also mentioned a few other actors and their comments on what they are most remembered by. ST-TPM-ASF-TNE seemed annoyed at one jab someone made at TPM, but no use of the words basher or gusher appeared and no one was at each other?s throats.
LOTR, The Matrix, and the Star Wars PT: Which trilogy will stand the test of time? : The page started with an apology, so someone must have been irritated. The apology reads ?DEATHSTAR1977-- I had no intention to offend you. So I apologize. I do not come on here to insult people. I am just here to discuss the topics of the thread.? This thread seems to the center of any such ?basher/gusher? war. Some of the more notorious and comfrontation people go here to argue which trilogy is better, and so things can be tense. However, not always. I?ve followed this thread off and on. Sometimes tensions go too high, and other times it?s the best discussion on the boards, depends on the people posting at the time, mostly. There are a few people there who tend to be very confrontational, and guess what? About half of them (maybe more) aren?t members of the Sanct or DF.
The Jedi are in their prime, but are they sex symbols? Hmmmmmm, the title says it all. Really, it does. Anyway, we all knew QGJ was the ladies man, nothing else to say. Moving on. The Jar Jar Binks Reference and Discussion thread: Joking around and other tom foolery, all in the name of those who both love and hate JJB.
Lucas took our critisms of TPM to heart : Moderators were forced to speak in a couple of weeks ago and chill things down. Did it work? Let?s see Well, people started getting into a discussion about why people argue, which was off topic, then the discussion recently resumed normal, and seems to be fine. I did notice that the people who got things heated a few weeks ago were some of the same people who had gotten things heated in the ?LOTR, Matrix and PT? thread. Not all, mind you, but again, I see a trend of a few confrontational people causing confrentation, not forum wide chaos. But am I wrong? Let's move on and see.
ARGH! My VCR ate my EP1 tape!! : Poor Just_Joe, it sure enough did.
Contradicting Episode V : Hmmm, this thread requires my attention, I?ll be back in a -- OK, OK, no, I?ll finish this post first. Anyway, just people talking about whether or not QGJ being Ben?s master in TPM is a contradication. Though some people disagree, most are on the same page and the discussion is both interesting and civil.
Qui-Gon used the Force on Boss Nass : This thread educated a few, and troubled no one, except those troubled by QGJ?s misuse of the force
Four years on......

 

It contains 2 polarized social threads, one for the "bashers" and one for the "gushers".

 

Speaking only for myself.

I'd just like to interject here, that I'm satisfied that this issue is getting the attention it deserves.

I'm very glad to see this this topic being discussed in a civil manner.

My major gripe was that I had specifically asked Quixiotic-Sith to open a modsquad thread, and I felt that request was being completely ignored and summarily dismissed.

I'm willing to give the AC a chance to further this topic, and only ask that the next AC/Mod update include a bullet on how the discussion is progressing.




Also, several nice responses in this thread have convinced me to give these forums another shot. C-ya round the boards.

 

It contains 2 polarized social threads, one for the "bahsers" and one for the "gushers".

So what?

You didn't even read the whole post, no one reads that fast. How about you read through what is going on in each thread then comment on the "terrible" state of the TPM Forum, and how the people and the topics are in general so different than other forums.

 

Stryphe nice post I don't think I could have come up with a better post then you did.