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Lit Most "unbelievable" EU stories

Discussion in 'Literature' started by President Bossk, Sep 23, 2020.

  1. President Bossk

    President Bossk Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2019
    By unbelievable, I mean stories that just seem far fetched even in the Star Wars universe, or require you to suspend your disbelief quite a bit. New or old canon stories, but not ones that were never canon (Skippy the jedi droid).

    I thought this would be a interesting thread to start after talking about the Force Unleashed with someone. I found the idea of a insanely powerful jedi, who can rip ships out of the sky and best Vader and the Emperor, just a few years before episode 4, extremely unbelievable. His power dwarfs just about any other jedi I can think of. It also has Vader going behind the emperor's back to train a apprentice and overthrow him, which you would think would make him distrustful of Vader and cause him to not turn his back on him while he tortured his son. I just found it really hard to imagine all this actually happening between episodes 3 and 4. I enjoyed the game at the time, but looking back these things really prevent me from fully enjoying the plot of the game. (And that's just the first one).

    Which stories do you find "unebelievable"?
     
  2. Vialco

    Vialco Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2007
    ‘When did Starkiller best Darth Sidious?
     
  3. darklordoftech

    darklordoftech Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 30, 2012
    The IG-88 Death Star story.
     
  4. President Bossk

    President Bossk Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2019
    At the end of the game. He beats the emperor and is about to kill him until Kota talks him out of it. The Emperor only manages to kill him by a surprise attack.

    Start at about the 3:40 mark to see it.

    I forgot about that one. I don't think any story will ever top that one in unbelievability.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
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  5. Dream-Thinker

    Dream-Thinker Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    May 20, 2020
    There's that one kid book from the 70s that had telepathic wookiees.

    Not sure if that would count though.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
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  6. SpecForce Trooper

    SpecForce Trooper Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 19, 2016
    Honestly one of the least believable stories for me was TCW, as much as I might hate to admit it. Fitting characters like Ahsoka and Rex into the EU, alongside all of the new events and concepts, feels impossible at times (whether or not it fits with the movies is another conversation). Fitting a story where Anakin becomes a Padawan right after Geonosis into a universe where he only becomes a Knight in the latter half of the war makes very little sense. That's not even mentioning the brain chips, which feel weird even alongside the likes of ROTS, let alone the Republic Commando novels.
     
  7. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    obligatory "TCW should be formally detached from the 'Legends' continuity and made entirely new-canon" mention

    Personally, the one that always stuck in my craw was actually The Courtship of Princess Leia. Not for the rancor-riding witches or even Space Fabio, those are fine - it's the relationship dynamic between Han and Leia that just seemed really unbelievable. I mean, come on, this is supposed to be four years after Return of the Jedi, in a continuity that already established they were married with kids on the way a year later. And this is how we're supposed to believe they went from point A to point B?

    Also, Zsinj is as much an example of how retconning doesn't necessarily fix anything as how it does.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  8. Hamburger_Time

    Hamburger_Time Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 13, 2010
    Obligatory reminder that the date of Anakin's knighting was already inconsistent pre-TCW. In the micro series it happens right after Muunilinst and Hypori a few weeks at most into the war, while in the novels it happens in the last year.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  9. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2015
    Anakin's knighting around the microseries timeline was the best imo, but 4 months after Geonosis is still too early in Legends. TCW having Anakin knighted immediately after AOTC and then the Council being like, "Hey let's give this 19-year old a 14-year old apprentice while we continue to worry about his emotional immaturity" is dumb, and the literature/comics having Anakin knighted in late 20 BBY/early 19 BBY is way too late. Having his knighting around 21 BBY gives him more room to have a character arc from AOTC to ROTS, but gives him almost a year and a half to two years being a badass Jedi Knight.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
  10. FiveFireRings

    FiveFireRings Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 26, 2017
    To me the most "unbelievable" thing was the overall conceit of the post-ROTJ EU: total plot armor for the OT3 in case they were going to be used in Sequel films, as if such films would adhere to EU continuity -- which would never happen, so why bother to make these characters virtually immortal? The side effect being that horrible things happened to all of the the rest of their EU-only family, and their lives pretty much sucked, without the reader ever feeling like the OT3 themselves were ever in jeopardy. There were no "real" stakes, but the characters' lives were just... depressing, and the only real jeopardy was to characters who "didn't count". It just made the stories increasingly implausible and uninvolving, for totally OOU corporate reasons, and silly ones at that.
     
  11. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    I mean one could take it further and say Post ROTJ in general because of how much that film is supposed to be the book closer ;p
     
  12. R4-D4

    R4-D4 Jedi Master

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2003
    The Ewok cartoons from the 80s.
     
  13. StartCenterEnd

    StartCenterEnd Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 2, 2006
    I’d say a lot of the early Marvel comics.

    Re Anakins knighting in 03-05 clone wars, didn’t they retcon that a lot of time passes inbetween or even within some episodes? I’m pretty sure the essential chronology patched that up, I’ll have to check it out tonight.

    I don’t find TCW knighting Anakin early in the war all that unbelievable (when not included in Legends of course) because at the start of AOTC Anakin has been an apprentice for ten years and says he is ready for the trials and the Jedi council thinks he’s ready for his first mission alone and he does manage to protect Padme. Also he really grows during AOTC. Not completely but by the end, he ultimately chooses duty over saving Padme. Sure he immaturely charges at Dooku right after but I think losing his arm would have made him more cautious and wise in the following months during the war leading to his knighting. As for granting him a Padawan, Yoda thought being responsible for an apprentice himself would force Anakin to mature faster and Yoda was right. Obi Wan and Yoda were ready to give Ashoka to Obi in the clone wars movie if Anakin felt he wasn’t ready but Anakin changes his mind and accepts her. It turns out to work out, Anakin really becomes much more wiser and mature through training Ashoka. It also makes more sense that Anakin wants to be a master in ROTS. If he was only a knight for less than a year he comes across as even more whiny than he already does when passed for master ship.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  14. SilentGuy66

    SilentGuy66 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 1, 2014
    The Star Wars Tales comic story about an ex stormtrooper suffering PTSD from battling the Ewoks on Endor
     
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  15. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2015
    I agree Anakin begging to be a master only months after being knighted is ridiculous, but I believe if you put Anakin's knighting at 21/20 BBY, that gives him room to have an arc like the Dark Horse comics and to grow beyond AOTC, but also have enough time to prove himself in the war. Anakin is not like the other Jedi when it comes to his exploits and military victories in the Clone Wars. Anakin's relationship with Obi-Wan is still strained even by the end of AOTC, but Obi-Wan's renewed trust in Anakin in ROTS and Anakin's more mature demeanor in ROTS is, I think, a result of the long span of the war and not just Geonosis.

    Obi-Wan was 25 I believe when he was knighted, though I guess he had to train much harder given he didn't have the natural Force abilities of Anakin. But I think in AOTC, Anakin saying "I'm ready for the trials! But he thinks im too unpredictable" and then following it up with, "He's overly-critical, he never listens, he doesn't understand. Its not fair!" is Lucas trying to highlight that Anakin really isn't ready. I just can't see Anakin's personality switch in just a week instead of gradually happening over the course of the war, which I think gives Anakin a character arc.

    I understand why Yoda gives Ahsoka to Anakin, though ironically that kind of backfires on him, given what happens to Ahsoka has Anakin question the Jedi's morality, but I wish canon would show more of Anakin's immaturity before Ahsoka since I believe outside of the first 10-15 minutes of The Clone Wars movie and "The Hidden Enemy," we don't have much content of pre-Ahsoka, post-AOTC Anakin.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  16. StartCenterEnd

    StartCenterEnd Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    May 2, 2006
    Fair points but we should also consider the monumental events that happen to Anakin in AOTC. He falls in love, he loses his mother and brushes the dark side which makes him ashamed of himself, he is thrust into the clone wars, loses an arm and gets married. I can buy him maturing within a few months after AOTC. It’s like Luke maturing so much in between empire and Jedi which is only a year. He’s been though some sh**!
     
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  17. Vialco

    Vialco Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 6, 2007
    Palpatine was faking it. He was playing possum, pretending to be defeated to tempt Starkiller into striking at a supposedly defeated opponent in anger. He did the same thing with Mace Windu and Anakin.

    The fact that Sidious blasts Kota the moment Starkiller shows that he’s not going to turn proves that the Emperor is superior. He doesn’t kill Galen with a surprise attack. The two of them go toe-to-toe in a head-on battle with Starkiller barely managing to hold off Darth Sidious’s Force lightning until the Rebel leaders escape.

    Starkiller defeating Vader is completely plausible. He aims for the Dark Lord’s mechanics weakness. That tactic useless against the Emperor and Starkiller dies easily.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
  18. Deliveranze

    Deliveranze Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2015
    I can see that, but I think we need more content to show that. I don't feel AOTC to the 2008 TCW movie has a good transition into Anakin's maturity. I know Marvel right now is showing the journey Luke took to grow from ESB to ROTJ. I think we need a "Clone Wars: Year One"-type story to show Anakin's demeanor change and to see how Obi-Wan learns to treat Anakin like a equal, maybe showing those final weeks of Anakin as a Padawan and mullet-hair Obi-Wan.


    Legends rectified this by pushing all of Anakin's Padawan exploits(Dark Horse), Jedi Trial, and the Dreadnaughts of Rendili arc (the first mission Anakin takes as Knight) into 22 BBY.
     
  19. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Maybe Anakin being given an apprentice was a wartime expediency? What with many of the Jedi being busy fighting or becoming casualties, perhaps the Jedi Council felt they had no choice. Anakin also seems to go above and beyond to keep his troops alive, so maybe they thought Ahsoka would be safe with him.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
  20. Emperor Ferus

    Emperor Ferus Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 29, 2016
    The 2002-05 media project had Jedi Trial taking place six months before ROTS. Between TCW and the Disney sale, LFL tried to reconcile the two canons by condensing the selection of pre-Jedi Trial Clone Wars books within the first month of the war, having the TCW movie taking place a month after AOTC.

    Two and a half years would have given Anakin time to mature while retaining the dark streak that would be his downfall, but no way The Clone Wars could be condensed into six months.



    Edit: The story I've had the hardest time swallowing: Jedi Academy Trilogy and The Force Unleashed, though I respectively enjoyed reading and playing
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
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  21. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    Here is the biggest most unbelievable EU story.

    The Expanded Universe itself.

    A set of stories that everyone knew one day would get retconned whenever Lucas deemed it be it a post Episode 6 universe or whenever Lucas did his prequels.

    So at the end of the day...the EU is the most unbelievable thing ever...because it was always gonna gat axed whenever Lucas wished it.

    Mind...Blown ;p
     
  22. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Pretty much every time a dark sider wants to conquer the galaxy, or whatever.

    The only believable dark sider there has ever been is Set Harth.

    "I'm going to use my evil powers to live like a rock star, forever."
     
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  23. Jid123Sheeve

    Jid123Sheeve Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 2016
    Funny enough I saw a review Podcast of the Darth Bane Books that said Bane's motivation for wanting the Sith to rule didn't seem that believable
     
  24. Ulicus

    Ulicus Lapsed Moderator star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2005
    You mean a SWDBPODCAST?
     
  25. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Lucas did say he was done with Star Wars, that he was all burnt out after ROTJ, and just wanted to move on to other things. So I'd say there was justification for thinking the EU would endure.