Full Series Official Star Wars Rebels Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

I was floored when I first saw it. It draws from one of my favorite stretches of LOTR, and Filoni did it so well. I was a huge skeptic of bringing Maul back, but because of how Filoni did it, I was instantly on board. His best episode ever, in my view.

 

I would live if we could get a toon of LOTR refrences when we indeed go back to old republic. I know Filoni would love that.

 

In the vein of LOTR references, Rebels draws several parallels to Gandalf with both Kanan and Ahsoka. The mentor figure to Ezra, who is clearly meant to be akin to the Hobbits.

Kanan meets his end in front of a blazing inferno, sacrificing his own life to save his friends. Very much as Gandalf the Grey did when facing the Balrog of Moria.

Ahsoka makes a similar sacrifice when Force-shoving Ezra out of the collapsing Sith Temple on Malachor, but unlike Kanan, her parallel is that of Gandalf the White. As Ahsoka is saved through an miraculous power that draws her out of thought and time, she then returns garbed all in white. Just like Gandalf the White.

 

Do you guys think it's sad that the most viewed Star Wars Rebels review videos are ones saying it sucks?

 

Some people just have too much time on their hands to make a video just to say that a television series stinks.

 

Of course, people could never remove their TCW nostalgia goggles and actually see the mythological storytelling behind the show.

 

But I could say the exact same thing for the first impressions on TCW; people had a difficult time removing their OT and PT film nostalgia goggles to accept that there was more stories to tell involving the Clone Wars that didn't always have to involve the usual suspects (Anakin, Obi-Wan, and Padme).

 

It's a never-ending cycle.

 

The same happenned to Resistance only louder then before. It will happen again and again. I wonder how loud it will happen to show he between ROTJ and TFA. Or between TPM and AOC (It's gonna happen sooner or later)

 

I’m hoping the Mandalorian will break that cycle. It’s going to appeal to the type of fans who like to complain very loudly.

 

Live action yess, but will the animation series break it, i could see the Ashoka/Sabine do or a show of young Anakin.

 

Not really. It's not a very good show. There are too many nonsensical things going on for it to be appealing. I get that movies and television shows pull all kind of unrealistic stunts, but Rebels just does it to a degree and level that is basically an insult to the viewer's intelligence. It doesn't help that we can't even pull a moral lesson from the show, because the Ghost crew seem like a pretty unethical bunch.

I'm not saying that Rebels had nothing good at all to offer. The ideas behind the characters and the character designs were pretty good. I think Rebels could have been a touching story about family and dealt with the Ghost crew (particularly Ezra and Sabine) constantly struggling with their actions not seeming to make much difference in the galaxy and the growing rebellion. It could have dealt with them growing to be mature and keeping hope even when their actions often met with failure and it becomes difficult for the crew to see that what they are doing has much affect at all. The characters could have been really amazing additions to the saga; I remember being really excited about meeting the Ghost crew when they were first introduced.

But the direction they decided to go with many of their interesting plot turns ended up being really dull and uninteresting. They could have delved into Kanan's blindness and how that deeply affected everyone because the rest of the Ghost crew would have to limp on without Kanan's leadership. But instead they skimmed over that issue and wrapped it up in like two episodes. Or they could have spent a whole season (or seasons, honestly) on the time-space weapon, which is incredibly OP and should have been a source of great temptation and struggle for Ezra Bridger, who had lost Kanan and his parents and now had the means to bring them back. I get that Ezra matured from season 1, but I still don't think he was mature enough by season 4 to just walk away from an opportunity like that. And the bad guys are all so one-dimensional and uninteresting. Kallus could have been a really interesting kind of anti-hero, but they turned him into a rebel, just like everyone else (after watching this show, it's hard to believe that Imperials still exist because it seems like everyone gets converted into a rebel). The rebels don't seem like underdogs either, because they always seem to win and the Imperials constantly seem lo lose, to the point where stormtroopers are pretty much my favorite characters in Rebels and I feel so sorry for them when the Ghost crew is constantly mowing them down in droves. I could go on and on about why the show is disappointing, but I think I'll stop there.

 

oh please, it's no a great show, but it's a good show and and a kids show, CW wasn't that beter init's first two seasons, and now with Resistance we hear this complaining again. Once CW is over i hope they get over that not all shows are like CW and never will be. their budget is too huge, and shows like Rebels/Resistance they want to have simple and famliy friendy stories and tones.

 

While some of the ideas behind Rebels are good ones, I would not consider it a good show. I get having a 'family friendly' tone, but I'm not sure I can say that Rebels is truly family friendly, because some of the acts the Ghost crew does are pretty horrible, like Ezra using the force on that Imperial walker and having to face no repercussions for it at all. Another time Ezra pushes an enemy into a fireplace, where the enemy is instantly incinerated, and all Ezra does is make a joke about it. Zeb acted the same way when Rukh died. I get that the rebels hate the Empire and their reasons why, but they are brutal and merciless in dealing with their enemies and don't even acknowledge that they are killing hundreds of people with each ship destroyed and they don't feel any remorse for it at all. I'm also not a fan of the way Sabine creates a murder weapon seemingly targeted to kill her own people, and when that happens, it feels like she wants to blame her family for her pain rather than taking responsibility for herself. I don't mind a good guy doing bad things (heroes that make mistakes and slip up are good for an interesting story; it's good to have a character flaw, and this leaves a good opportunity for learning and growth that is essential for storytelling), but it should be showcased as the wrong thing, and I feel like the rebels are always portrayed as the noble heroes, even when their deeds are neither noble nor heroic. A good show can be kid friendly and still be interesting for older viewers, as well as having good moral messages, like Avatar: The Last Airbender.

And I wouldn't make the assumption that every critic of Rebels is automatically a diehard CW fan. Yes, I like the Clone Wars (most of it, anyway), but I have issues with that show as well; though I do feel like it was written better and more entertaining than Rebels. I can't say anything for Resistance because I don't think I have the heart to try and watch it at the moment.

 

You may not like it, but it's still a good show better them most shows on disney xd if no all. You cant have the darkness and matured tone CW's later seasons. Yeah the imps is potrayed as dumb sometimes, but thats a given on a disney channel show. But we got many good villains too the Inquisitors, Thrawn and others. The imps aren't the smartest bunch we see that even in books they potrayed that sometimes. And it's only the ghost crew who outsmart them, well they special people soo. I don't really get the Sabine critism, she's now one of if not the most popular character to come out of Rebels in it's two first seasns she's just this Mnnado girl, then she gets more development and she becomes on of the best characters. her episodes are pretty good. Kanan's blindless was never going to take over the show so i guessed it take 2-4 episodes, and it gets reffrenced a bunch of times. Bendu is a good teacher. Hera is the best pilot alongside Anakin and Han solo, so i think she like Han can get away anytime from them. One episode she may have gone overboard with killing the tech guys. Yeah Ezra he's what 14 years old at season 1 and you want him to be matured in seaon 1 when he's not even mature yet. I didn't think he be mature until season 3 or 4. Ezra like Ashoka was irritating in first two seasons, but along both of them had their mommnets and in season 3 both of them began to mature in their shows and in season 4 Ezra had matured into a young adult after Kanan's death he had become a man in his own way. He then sacrificed himself like his master did before like a mature character. I love Chopper enough said. Zeb was alawys a comic relief character and even he grew along the show. Kallus was a good villain and even a better Rebel. he was the only one in Rebels who did besides Wedge. So yess it's a good show not as good as CW, but yess a good show, those who says it sucks dosen't understand Rebels same with Resistance.

 

Just because Rebels is better than some shows does not make it a good show. It just means those shows are even worse than Rebels. I'm not asking for the darkness and maturity of The Clone Wars. Rebels is a different show than the Clone Wars; I'm not looking for a Clone Wars-rehash. Honestly, I would hope for something even better, and The Clone Wars had a broad view of showcasing the war throughout the galaxy and how it affected different groups, whether it be Jedi, Sith, clones, politicians, bounty hunters, etc. Rebels is meant to focus solely on the Ghost crew. And just because other shows have dumb villains doesn't give Rebels an excuse to create some of the most one-dimensional villains of all time. Yes, you can have dumb villains sometimes (I mean I love Team Rocket), but something that works in one show may not necessarily work for Star Wars. I mean, this is SW we're talking about, which has 40 years of established content. If you are going to write or create Star Wars, you have to fit into the established parameters, and those parameters say that the Empire are the top dogs who should come out on top 9 times out of 10 (or more) until A New Hope.

The Inquisitors weren't good villains. Okay, the Grand Inquisitor started out as a good villain, but they killed him off after only a small handful of skirmishes with Kanan and Ezra when he should have been a much bigger threat. Honestly, I think the Grand Inquisitor should have been the highest-level villain that the Ghost crew ends up facing in the entire show. The other inquisitors are just pathetic and underdeveloped and not much of a threat. Thrawn is one of the best characters of the EU, but they totally destroyed his character in rebels. I can't acknowledge the Chiss guy in Rebels as a true Thrawn. Vader and the Emperor should be so powerful that they should be able to annihilate the Rebels in mere seconds, so they were obviously waaaaay underpowered. In other words, the two Sith should never have been in a show like Rebels anyway because they're too powerful for the Ghost crew, who needed less powerful villains to deal with. Vader could appear only in the instances that it relates to Ahsoka and her character arc, but that's it. Pryce is just another "I'm just a bad guy to be bad" (as are most of the Imperial bad guys). Okay, I guess I have to admit that the stormtroopers are pretty good. They seem so friendly and almost innocent and like nice guys, and the rebels just slaughter them without any remorse. I genuinely feel sorry for those guys.

I'm pretty sure that just about every rebel manages to outsmart the Empire in some way (Hondo, Lando, Vizago, Saw, and Iron Squadron seemed to get around the Empire fine).

My problem with Sabine is that she paints herself as the victim of her actions without mentioning so much what it did to everyone around her. She blames the Empire because she trusted them, and she blames her clan because she believes that her clan and family turned their backs on her. What she doesn't say is that she got to run away and play bounty hunter and rebel, while the other Mando clans turned on Clan Wren, leaving Sabine's people with no allies from either the Mandalorians or the Empire. This left her clan in a dangerous situation that could have resulted in Sabine's clan being attacked or annihilated by the other incensed clans. This left Ursa in a difficult position of trying to placate the other clans and the Empire just to keep her clanmates alive. Oh, and Sabine's father gets thrown into prison, and Tristan is forced to become Imperial Supercommando, whether he wants the job or not (and from what I've seen, I think he was unhappy with it). So basically Sabine runs away, leaving Ursa, Alrich, and Tristan to deal with the consequences of her mistakes while she gets to roam free and be an artist. But you know, out of her family, she's definitely the victim, not her imprisoned father, or indentured brother, or the clan leader who has to deal with the displeasure of both the Empire and fellow Mandalorians. I just hate how Sabine doesn't take responsibility for her actions and paints her family as the bad guys, when from where I'm standing it seems like she's the one who abandoned her family, not the other way around. This is only further hammered home by the fact that despite the clan's situation, all the members of her family seem pretty quick to forgive Sabine for the awful situation she put them through. And honestly, she takes them for granted.

I think Sabine could have been a really awesome character if they had portrayed her as a cool character aloof but fiercely loyal to her family, and later gone into her backstory and addressed that she felt torn up guilt, and that was why she had run away. I think her guilt should have been the reason she couldn't face her family again, and Rebels should have progressed through a stage of healing for Sabine as she worked up the courage to return to her homeland. That is sort of what happened, but I think it should have been from the angle of Sabine needing to get forgiveness from her family, not the angle of Sabine needing to forgive her family. The basic framework of her story was a good idea (thought it needing a lot of polishing and refining), just poorly executed, and the Mandalorian should have been a much bigger issue and arc in Rebels than it was, as in spanning over an entire season or probably multiple seasons.

I didn't say that Kanan's blindness had to completely take over the show, but the time period after Twilight of the Apprentice was a very important era in Ezra's life of turmoil and change, and I think they should have actually gone into that instead of skipping over that era. There was so much storytelling potential there, because it left Ezra the perfect opportunity to learn to take over as leader of the team while Kanan sat things out for like six months.

I don't think Hera is that great of a pilot, and I'm tired of every Star Wars pilot being the "best pilot in the galaxy". I think she should have never been nothing better than average. I'm starting to feel like every major Star Wars pilot is the "best one" and it's turning into a cliché.

I don't think I said I wanted Ezra to be mature in season 1. I didn't find Ezra irritating at the beginning (and Ahsoka was only irritating for the first maybe five episodes of The Clone Wars, not the first two entire seasons).

Zeb was extremely mishandled and shoved into the background. It's pretty sad the way they mistreat him, honestly.

Kallus could have been a really interesting anti-hero. I really thought he was going to believe in his government and the side he fought for, but no. He just ended up being another one of the rebels along with seemingly everyone else.

 

The villains was alright, Thrawn was great, he was not destroyed, He was a cartoon in a kids show and not as great in as abook get over it. And Vader let them get away on purpose o he could take out the rebel command ship, only time Ezra faced Sidious was in world betweend worlds and he pretty mutch just toyed with them. If we wanna talk about villains lets talk about how Cw destroyed Grevious or How film and Cw Dooku are not always the same. It's a kids show for 10-12 year olds CW was more for adults.

I think you just looking for something to hate. Rebels was never going to go as in detail as did with CW. Zeb might have been shoved aside, but then again he was mostly minor among the main characters and got a happy ending with Kallus. And Kallus was never going be this ani-hero, he was a villain who became a hero. Hera was always going to be one of the best and we have what 3 people of trillions who's the best pilots. You may not like it but always the protagonist is agreat pilot even George would do that. It's a good show even if you do ont like it. And the damage the ghost do dosen't affect the empire so. You probable shoudn't watch anymore animation series, you probaly hate it anyways. All star wars shound't be held up by as high standard as CW or Original trilogy.

 

If Rebels Thrawn doesn't match up with the book Thrawn, than it is an inconsistency error in the saga because Thrawn isn't matching up to Thrawn, basically. If they can't portray Thrawn as the super intelligent and logical person that he is in Rebels because kids can't understand it, then he shouldn't be in Rebels at all and they should get someone else as the big baddie. I don't mind fan-pandering, but Rebels does it to an absurd and illogical degree and has way too many cameos, when I'd rather just focus on developing the Ghost crew characters further. I don't mind a few, like Ahsoka and Rex, maybe Maul, but I think that's about plenty. We don't need Vader, Mon Mothma, Lando, Leia, Saw, and others constantly shoved into our faces to remind us that we're still watching SW. I just wanted to see an original tale about the members of the Ghost crew and their adventures and misadventures.

Yes, Rebels seems to constantly rely on the fallback of "the villain just let them go so he could fulfill his master plan", yet the Ghost crew continues to get away even after constantly wreaking havoc time and time again on the Empire's force. And Darth Vader just....does nothing about it? That's not what the real Darth Vader would do. Sure, at first he might let them go so the rebels lead him to their fleet, but then he would entirely decimate the rebel forces. Anything less seems kind of sloppy from him, especially considering how much damage the Ghost crew causes later down the road.
I can agree that Grievous was pretty much destroyed in the Clone Wars, and Dooku wasn't all that great of a villain either. Again, the Clone Wars is all right, but it isn't exactly a high bar either. It had its fair share of flaws, though some of the arcs were entertaining and amusing, and it introduced many llikable and intriguing characters to the Star Wars galaxy.

I'm not just looking for something to hate. When Rebels was first announced, I was really excited about it. From the initial descriptions of the characters, they sounded like really interesting people, and I was looking forward to getting to know them. I even enjoyed the first season (until they killed off the Grand Inquisitor and brought in Darth Vader at the end, which put me off a bit). The second season wasn't too bad either, and I really loved the ending. I think I would probably still enjoy the Twilight of the Apprentice; those two episodes were pretty good, and it left a really good set-up for season 3. But the golden opportunity for character growth and drama was completely wasted in season 3, and that's where the show really lost me. In all honesty, almost all Rebels episodes are so propelled by the plot that there is little consistency in the characters, because they aren't allowed to grow in natural ways, but forced along whatever path the writers deem the plot should go, which is annoying. I get the importance of the plot, but it should follow a route that feels like something the characters would choose. But Rebels focuses more on plot and plan detailing scenes (which is boring) rather than scenes that develop and grow the relationships between the crew members (which are usually touching and interesting).

I'm not sure why you keep bringing up The Clone Wars. The Clone Wars isn't the bar I had set for Rebels. And if Rebels was never going to go more in detail than CW, than that in itself should send up red flags. Rebels has like 75 episodes focusing on the same group of six people, and it always keeps the focus on at least one of them. This should give a lot of time for us to get to know each character really well. On the other hand, for the CW, it focuses on many different people, whether they're Sith lord, part of crime syndicates, the Jedi Order, the Senator, the CIS, the Republic, whatever.

I think Zeb shouldn't have been shoved to the side like he was, though. Why have him in the show at all if you're just going to neglect him for most of the show? Just downsize the crew a little then. The way Kallus was introduced made it sound like he was going to be an anti-hero, but then he ended up being just another of the villains, who turned into a rebel like everyone else. Kallus could have been an interesting character, but his story felt like the cliché "Imperial-turned-rebel" that seems common in Rebels.

Nothing Hera does seems particularly exceptional, and nothing she does makes me believe that she is an exceptionally talented. I think SW should throw in some more average pilots occasionally so that we don't hear the same "best pilot in the galaxy" every time. Yes, I can buy that Anakin, Luke, and Han are some of the galaxy's best pilots. But I don't need to hear that Poe, Rey, and Hera are also the best pilots too. It just seems like something that is starting to be overused, and I don't think Hera should have been anything over average.

I'm not sure what you mean by the Ghost crew doesn't affect the Empire. They defeated Vader, they killed like 4 inquisitors, liberated Lothal, defeated Thrawn, killed Rukh. And you have to think that for each cruiser, we can probably assume that there are at least 10,000 people, and I know they destroyed at least 10 Imperial cruisers. Thus, the Ghost crew ended up causing the deaths of at least 100,000 people. That definitely affects the Empire.

Firstly, about me personally, I actually like quite a few animated shows, just not Rebels. As a Star Wars fan, I don't have to like everything thrown at me just because it has a Star Wars label slapped on it. Being under the "Star Wars" banner doesn't automatically qualify it as a great work of media or literature; the art of storytelling is so much more special and complex than that. I actually enjoy quite a few animated shows, and I think Naruto, Avatar: The Last Airbender, and Yu-Gi-Oh are some of the best stories ever told and I would highly recommend them. I also enjoy other animated shows, such as The Dragon Prince, Fairy Tail, One-Punch Man, Orange, Your Lie in April, and others. I even enjoy Ninjago, though it is a bit juvenile, but at least I think it is a good show for kids. Just because I don't like Rebels doesn't mean I hate all TV shows.

And why shouldn't I hold Rebels up to the same standard as The Clone Wars or OT? (you forgot to mention the PT, which is likely the highest standard in SW, as the Prequels have some of the most complex and detailed storytelling I have seen in media). It was Disney's choice to make Rebels cannon, thus stating that Ezra's adventures are as real as Luke or Anakin's ever were. If they wanted to make a nonsensical show that was just for fun, they should have put it under the Legends banner as something that maybe happened, maybe not. Or they could have had it as a "just for fun" thing like the Lego additions to Star Wars. I personally enjoy the Yoda Chronicles and Droid Tales immensely, even though it is unrealistic in relation to the rest of the saga. So yes, I expect Rebels to be an addition to the franchises worthy of its predecessors. I'm not going to ever lower my standards just because it has the "Star Wars" logo before the show's name; if anything, that should actually raise the standards that the show needs to reach.

 

Rebels got better and better with each season. The last season was excellent and the finale was one of the best ends to a series I've seen.

 

I'd be interested to hear what people's thoughts are on the relationship between Kanan and Hera, now that the series is over. I just reread A New Dawn, and afterwards I rewatched Jedi Night.

From start to finish, Kanan and Hera's relationship seems to be very much a give-and-take. Wherein Kanan gives and Hera takes. Consistently.

I don't think I like that very much. Kanan gives everything he has to Hera's cause. His skills, his dedication, his effort. He gives up so much for the Rebellion that she supports. His sight, and eventually his life.

But Hera doesn't seem to have given Kanan anything in return. The only thing he gets, at the very end, is a single "I love you."

It's pretty sad that when Kanan hears that for the first and last time, he thinks that she doesn't mean it. And then, he dies, sacrificing his own life to save Hera's.

I can't bring myself to feel much, if any sympathy for Hera after that. She's sad that her love is dead, but she had many years with the man. During which she never really acknowledged his feelings for her.

For Hera, the Rebellion has always come first. Before family, before love. That's not the message that I want to see in my Star Wars.

If Kanan hadn't decided to join Hera at the end of their adventure on Gorse, he would have still been alive, happy and healthy by the time of Endor. He gave up his life for the Rebels and got very little in return.

Kanan Jarrus deserved better.

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I think she gave him more than just a single "I love you" by the end.


But I think it's unfair to suggest "he gives up so much" for her, while getting nothing back. After Order 66 occurred, he virtually had nothing, right? She gave him a purpose he could believe in once again. Otherwise he'd have been on the lamb; kind of like how Ahsoka was after SOM. I never got the vibe that Hera used Kanan for her own agenda; I always felt it was nearly mutual - even though he had his qualms about her methods every so often. She didn't have to constantly show her affection to know she deeply cared about him. That's what I really liked about her character. Sure, you'd immediately pick up that she was in it for the cause; but in the end she most certainly cared about her "family"; and Kanan above all.

 

Ideal Jedi are selfless. That's quintessential Star Wars. It was in Kanan's upbringing to give and not expect anything in return. In the end, he did receive affirmation of Hera's feelings, and that probably meant everything for him.

 

Good point. Didn't realize that.

 

Huh? To me that seems to be one of the core messages of Star Wars. Fighting for something larger than oneself, or one's in-group. Having an all-encompassing empathy, rather than empathy just for your friends and family. Hera is the very picture of Star Wars-style heroism.

And Kanan sacrificing his life for the Rebellion is the ultimate heroic act. Would you rather he retired with Hera and sipped cocktails on the beach while the Empire reigned? That's not better. His end was just about the greatest honor Filoni could pay him as a character. A timeless hero who died fighting the Empire.

Out of curiosity, where does this more selfish version of Star Wars exist? I'm genuinely curious, and not being antagonistic. After all, the entire conclusion of the PT is predicated on the notion that Anakin's fall to the darkside was driven by a selfish pursuit of his own interests (and the interests of his family) over that of the galactic good.