ST Poll: Your top 3 Force power moment in the ST

1) Luke's Force Projection
2) Leia's Force Pull
3) Rey's Mind reversal

 

I definitely would have chosen the Yoda moment too if it had been listed as an option.

 

1. Kylo's blaster bolt trick was an impressive move to me, and it made me excited about his potential.
2. Luke's projection was really impressive, and along the lines of what I expected from him. Him dieing afterwards, pretty much ruined the scene for me though. It kind of gave the victory back to Kylo in the end.
3. I have to embrace Leia's force pull in space as a favorite for me, because I really wanted to see her use the force in a way other than sensing the status of people she cares about. I didn't like how it was executed, but at least I got to see she did train in the force at least a little.

 

The blaster bolt trick from Kylo just seemed odd to me. We never saw that before; even during the Republic era by the Jedi and/or Sith. They'd always just deflect the blaster bolts with their sabers.

 

It’s the first time we have seen a light sider use force lightning. That was pretty cool.

 

Technically, not really. Yoda was able to deflect, absorb and resend force lightening out to Dooku during their duel in Ep II. It was just the first time we have seen a FORCE GHOST use any power to affect the physical world around them.

 

I meant the first time he actually did it himself though.

 

The thing I love about Kylo Ren's blaster bolt stasis is how it sets up how incredible he can be at multitasking with the Force when he's most confident and focused. Whatever he lacks in saber skills in comparison to similar Force using adults, or people who've had to fight their whole lives like Rey, he makes up for in this level of multitasking skill. It's his best and most unique Dark Side trait and it's up there with Masters.

He remains aware of the bolt while continuing on a conversation entirely, executes a man, and then releases the bolt back into motion. It's the perfect setup for how he later kills his master. Very similar multitasking skill and focus involved in his death of Snoke. He knows he's having his mind read. He's conscious of it but stays cool and physically multitasks his saber and its turn with the other he's controlling with his mind and then strikes.

 

I have to say, out of all of the options listed on this poll, from Kylo freezing the blaster bolt to Rey's Force vision on Acht-To, my bias is forcing me to vote for Luke's Force projection only because it was so unexpected, vastly interesting, and a testament to Luke's strength. Even though a part of me doesn't fully agree with the idea of Force projection, I often like to imagine that Luke was there, on the salt world, dodging and parrying Kylo, as if Kylo is nothing to Luke. Now that's cool.

 

He's as there as there can be without being there if that makes any sense. It's not just a visual. He's communicating sound. He's focused on the environment and trying to sell the entire experience of being there as much as he can to everyone who sees him. The lack of footsteps are meant to imply that it's impossible to get all aspects 100% but he's focused on the big things and does get them all right. The kiss and the dice imply he did have the ability to physically interact on limited levels with, at a minimum, the other Force users. It's already established in canon that Force Ghosts are only seen by other Force Ghosts so it's possible that the golden dice and kiss could have only been felt by other people strongly connected to the Force as he is since it connects them all. I think that's part of the beauty of the scene in a way. He probably could have hurt Kylo Ren on the same principle if he'd really wanted to. He didn't. He's fully tapped into the Light side of the Force as you can get and his killing days are behind him. Before the fall of Ben Solo he just wanted to teach, and learn more about the Jedi ways, and be at peace with the Force like a non-violent Buddhist monk. He gets to become that again in the end. People act like it was some flickery hologram thing that he pre-meditated like some recording and just sent there because of how he eventually disappears but he's there in real time reacting and before disappearing he's as real to everyone who sees him, even close up, as can be and these are people who'd seen plenty of holograms in their lives.

 

Before she left Jakku, how had Rey been fighting her whole life; especially more than Kylo had?

 

Snoke's Mind Probes, and in general the way he dominated with the force (until his demise that is)
Luke's projection: I don't really think we've gotten anything like this before in canon, maybe we did in one of the animated tv shows.
Luke becoming one with the force: I know we have already seen Obi-Wan and Yoda do this, but showing it happen to Luke seemed to cement his legendary status with his two mentors.

 

What do you mean how? It's clear. It's established. It just takes some logical assessment of the lawless and desperate world she lives in. Do you think others wouldn't ever come to try and kick her out of his sweet pad on a planet like that?



Did Luke walk around with a big hand-to-hand combat weapon in his Tatooine farm home? Of course not. Luke had a more coddled life with friends and warm breakfasts cooked by his aunt as a kid. Rey carries a staff because you need one on a planet like that where it's every person for themselves. If there's anything valuable out there you'd need to be able to overcome multiple attackers. When BB8 is first picked up the other alien doesn't even test Rey despite being fully armed because he knows. Consider how valuable a droid of BB8's caliber would be on a planet like that and he doesn't even test her. She clearly has a reputation for being able to handle herself. Unkar Plutt sends two of his best thugs to steal BB8 from her and she dispenses of them.




She's clearly had to fight for everything she's had her whole life. That's what puts her ahead in that area. That's the setup of Rey. She's like a young Samurai girl living in a desolate place on her own.

 

Hmm. I like that. But if you were to remove the Force projection aspect out of the picture, and actually put Luke there, in the flesh, would that change anything? While I do understand your take on the moment, I feel as if Luke didn't learn to forgive himself of his troubled past with Ben. He failed to return from exile and back into reality after his powerful talk with Yoda. You know, looking at the Force projection more closely, I think Luke's daring choice to reveal himself to the Resistance, to Leia, and to Kylo and the First Order in the flesh would've held much more weight in the long run because Luke's there, in danger, but with purpose. The thought of this once proud Jedi Knight squaring off against the First Order's AT-ATs, on foot, and without protection, other than his belief in the Force, adds more to the character of Luke Skywalker, since everything he learned and did built up to that very moment.

When Kylo and Luke faced off, Kylo, as per usual, reacted with emotion and insecurity, while Luke portrayed himself as the reserved Jedi, relying on the Force and believing in himself. Luke knew that Kylo wanted to murder him, as he had done with Han, and giving Kylo that grave choice of "do I murder Luke or learn to let go of the past" was a smart choice, because we heard what Kylo said to Rey on Snoke's ship. If Kylo truly wanted to let go, why kill Luke? But at the end, Kylo, unlike Luke, failed himself and his arc by choosing to murder Luke. Instead of dying on Ahch-To, alone and without returning, I think Luke's whole character arc would've been much more satisfying had he showed everyone (including Leia, who was watching) what kind of a low-life Kylo really is. Luke, on the other end, resurrected himself in the eyes of the Resistance. But because Luke and Leia shared that quiet kiss prior to his death, Leia knew that Luke did all that he could.

 

My point wasn't so much to say she didn't fight at all; but she fought her whole life more than Kylo?

 

He did return. Stronger than ever before.

 

Yeah... but:

 

Possibly. At least as far as real risk and real pain fighting that could result in actual death. Ben could have had a pretty wealthy life for a lot of it. He left to train with Luke not as an infant but as a teen. But I do think Kylo Ren is further ahead in skill than she is. He let his guard down in TFA because he likes her. Now we know that with certainty. He was also seriously injured and under order to bring her in. Most of all he just underestimated her.

In TLJ he kills 5 guards to her 3. When she tries to pull the same saber a second time he's become stronger from having killed his master and it's suddenly dead even between them and the saber.

 

Well I haven't read the pre-TFA novels to get a sense of Ben/Kylo's background before the movie, but wouldn't it be suffice to say that he was on the front lines fighting against The Resistance well before Rey left Jakku? I like Rey, but I think the notion of her fighting off some scavengers with the staff she carries on Jakku isn't the same as Kylo getting shot at from all directions when The First Order invades a Resistance-held planet.

 

Agreed.

In summary, I DO think Kylo Ren was ahead of Rey despite the outcome of their first encounter in TFA and that he's even stronger after killing Snoke than he was before.

I also think Rey is further ahead of Luke in hand-to-hand combat because of their different upbringings and that Luke's greatest Force skill as a younger man was Poe Dameron-esque pilot skils.

 

Well that was really carried on from his father, wasn't it? I didn't think that was necessarily a Force skill.

 

Quite the contrary, IMO, it WAS a Force skill inherited from his father.

 

Poe is a great pilot, for someone who is not using the Force. Yet, Luke is the only one that could make the shot that destroyed DS1. Poe would have to rely either on luck, or on the target computer.

 

But Wedge was a good pilot, wasn't he? There were many good pilots who weren't force users.

 

Kylo was always just training, not many real fights.