Full Series Rebels 3.20 - Twin Suns - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Indeed, and now because of Filoni's crazy idea, we're just trying to find a logical explanation why it did happen this way, really hate Filoni.

 

Hmm for me the duel is not the big problem with the episode. For me it's all the Ezra/Chopper slapstick, which was just painful and the fact that at the end Ezra for no reason didn't tell them about Obi wan. From his perspective there was no reason not to, yet Filoni can't even be bothered to address it !

 

Honestly, this was the episode that made me give up on Rebels as a series. I'll still watch it of course, but Twin Suns made me realize that Rebels isn't on the same quality level as Clone Wars. They have different audiences and different maturity levels. Once you accept that Rebels is a show for younger children and that it will always have a level of immaturity and childishness, it's easier to watch.

 

I loved the duel

 

Pretty sure you're in the minority.

As a successor to the epic fights we saw Maul have in TPM, Revival and the Lawless, Twin Suns falls very short of the mark.

 

Or am i?

Though i must say the episode does feel out of place and forced in this season. It should atleast have been a two parter to build up momentum.

 

They had plenty of time to build up momentum, they simply needed to cut out the Ezra/Chopper slapstick which had no point besides being filler

 

See, that's the real issue. To the producers it's not filler. Ezra is the primary character on Rebels. It's his story, so the episode has to be framed from his perspective. It's just that he's a very boring and immature character. So much of his story comes across as slapstick and comedy, rather than exciting adventure.

 

Well the show has kind of suffered due to the criteria that most of the episodes must be stand-alone, just so that the casual viewer can watch. Maybe some would recognise Maul, and maybe some would recognise Obi-Wan, but some of the main cast would have to be in the episode so the casual viewers understand what's going on.

The criteria seems to harken back to s3 of TCW when ratings dropped due to longer storylines.

 

Sorry, but that doesn't make sense. If the regular characters are in the episode, that makes it less stand-alone, not more. Ezra being there is a result of the previous episodes and thus new viewers need to be brought up to speed, whereas if only Maul and Obi-Wan are in the episode, the explanations needed are much simpler : Maul hates the other guy and he just found out where he was hiding, so now he's searching for him. In the actual episode, we need to explain why Maul has a piece of the Holocron, why he's able to interact with Ezra through it, why Ezra would trust the Holocrons, etc.

 

Stand-alone as in storywise, like having a new adventure every week. Do you understand me now?

 

I wouldn't have a problem with that. Leaving aside my personal preference regards the Slapstick, it's that the Ezra portion of the episode had no point or relation to the Maul part. It was basically 2 separate cartoons in 1 episode. It's why Ezra not telling Kanan and Co about Obi-wan Just doesn't work

 

So every duel in Star Wars should've been like this ?

 

Great episode but it was very contrived to have Ezra go to Tattooine, just so the Kenobi-Maul plot line could be resolved. & how could Ezra not mention, or be asked about Obi-Wan when he returned to Kanan?? That's was the whole point of his mission.

 

Ezra found a shiny Holocron shard on Maul's ship and was so enraptured by it, he forgot he ever met Obi-Wan.

 

Filoni said in an interview that Ezra is now mature enough to understand that when he's told something has nothing to do with him and he absolutely never should have been there, the appropriate thing to do is respect that and keep his mouth shut.

Every single additional person that knows about what's on Tattooine - yes, even among the good guys - is a danger.

 

Yeah I read that interview when it came out after the season finale. I thought I'd provide a slapstick answer instead of my usual factual answers, since the episode in question was one long slapstick sequence, right up until the end.

 

That doesn't explain why the others didn't ask him about his mission. He got back to base & it was totally ignored. He may as well have run off to buy some groceries without asking permission.

 

Ezra showed them the shiny Holocron shard and they promptly forgot all about his unauthorized departure. Zeb kept it in his room as a night-light.

 

Would've been a strong mid-season finale, if they paired it with that Nightsister episode. Maybe I'll do that tonight.

 

Now that's how you draw that scene. Much better than the version we got in the new Darth Vader comic.

And loved that duel as well. Wouldn't want every SW duel to look like that, but in this case, it fitted into the scene and moment.

About Ezra not having a place in the episode, I agree, however at the last Celebration, Dave Filoni said something that made me re-evaluate how I look at Rebels. He said that he makes the show in a way that is accessible for everyone, including people who never saw SW before. Basically, each episode of Rebels needs to work also for an audience that doesn't know anything else about Star Wars, except Rebels. If Rebels is the only thing you watch and otherwise ignore the rest of the SW universe, that's fine, you will still be able to understand everything that goes on in the show. At least from the point of view of Dave and his crew. That's why every single Rebels episode needs at least one main Rebels character in it. If for example you have no idea who Obi-Wan is and why Tatooine is so important, you still have Ezra and Chopper and their shenanigans there to keep you entertained.

 

Actually, when Ezra went back, Thrawn was advancing, Fulcrum in danger. So I guess there was little room for asking Ezra about what happened with the old man at Tatooine. Maybe it will be talked about at the start of S. 4.

What I spotted was how circular Dave did forge the ways of Maul and Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan lived as a hermit for twenty years at Tatooine watching over young Luke until he turns active again, when his new apprentice (Luke) is ready. It takes only a short while after Obi-Wan is meeting his quick end by the hand of his former apprentice after a dramatic dialogue.

Maul also was depicted to be a hermit at Malachor gazing at the holocron he could acquire only with the help of an apprentice (Ezra). He failed but turned nevertheless into action finding Kenobi for having a dramatic dialogue, a quick duel to meet his end. That are the Twin-Suns Maul-Obi-Wan.

BTW: James Luceno did draw the last twenty years of Darth Plagueis almost the same way as a dark precedent version of Obi-Wan in a chronological sequel-manner for the DP-novel was published only 2011. Not only to mention Plagueis' words to Sidious after the attack of the Maladians: "Soon I will become stronger than you ever imagine." He went into hiding on Sojourn for twenty years and when he came back to Coruscant to take the lead again, he was murdered by his apprentice after a dramatic speech of the latter.

- Triplet Suns! -

 

At first I was shocked on how short their final duel was but now I can't see it happening any other way.

It's perfect. Absolutely perfect.

 

I thought it was interesting that Sato was brought into the “the holocrons are acting up, what should we do about Maul” meeting, since I would’ve assumed that it would be an issue kept solely among the Ghost family. Hera and Ezra’s conversation was nice, but I’ll always want to listen in on the conversation between Sato, Rex, and Kanan in the background…

When Chopper startled Ezra and he bumped his head against the windshield, I thought for a moment Ezra had actually knocked himself out (and I almost wish he had).

The part where Chopper “dies” was nice too; for some reason I liked seeing Ezra so distraught. Also, it seems that Ezra has a bit of a hallucinating problem.

Obi-Wan’s voice matched well with his voice in A New Hope and his animation looked good, but his “Look what I’ve risen above” line was extremely petty and childish. Not one of his better comebacks.

It seems out of character for Ezra to leave Obi-Wan and Maul to hash it out; he seemed too involved with both of them to just walk away just because Kenobi told him too. Plus, Ezra is all about helping people, and he was there to warn Obi-Wan. I don’t think he would abandon someone he would perceive to be in need/danger. It seems inconsistent with his character that he would lead a dangerous former Sith to Kenobi’s door and then just leave.

Also, I feel like Kenobi mis-diagnosed the problem with Ezra. He acted like Ezra ran away from his family, when that’s not really why Ezra was out in the dessert at all. Ezra wasn’t leaving the Ghost crew behind, he was trying to help Kenobi. There’s a pretty big difference. And why should Kenobi know so much about Ezra anyway? I think this was supposed to be “Ezra rejecting the dark side” episode, but Ezra hasn’t really been leaning towards the dark side in the slightest since The Holocrons of Fate. When Kanan comes back and Ezra realizes that his mentor forgives him, and Ezra can start forgiving himself is more of Ezra’s “rejecting the dark side” moment.

Also, Maul’s death was the most pathetic thing I’ve ever seen and a complete rip-off for the character. I get that they were trying to make it ‘samurai’ style, but this isn’t a show about samurai. It’s a show about Jedi, and Jedi have long, drawn-out and flashy battles that are an intrinsic part of Star Wars. Obi-Wan killing Maul appeared to be more of Maul committing suicide. It was a waste to bring Maul into the character into the show just to kill him off in such a disappointing way. Instead, I think they should have had either Darth Vader or Bo-Katan kill Maul. Darth Vader is more than a match for Maul, and it makes sense with the information we got in Twilight in the Apprentice. Bo-Katan ending Maul would fit in nicely with the Mandalore arc of Rebels. Then we could’ve seen Bo-Katan earning the darksaber, which would’ve been cool.