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Saga Relationship between light/dark and cosmic/living Force?

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Count Yubnub, Jun 30, 2018.

  1. FS26

    FS26 Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 2018
    The issue I'm trying to get to is how we define light and dark within the text of Star Wars, and I think the problem is exemplified in this quote by Lucas: he mixes together 2 separate kinds of dualities: one where two forces are opposed, yet morally equal; another where one side is good, the other evil. The Jedi's explicit goal/ideal is to bring "balance" to the Force, yet they are defined as wielding the Light Side (Ashla), rather than trying to be both light and dark. Furthermore, Obi-Wan says that the opposite of bringing balance is leaving it in darkness. The Balance of the Force therefore cannot be the DnD-alignment-style "neutral".

    I think that the best indicator of the difference between the Light and Dark Side, and how they relate to the idea of balance, are the Mortis and the Yoda's quest arcs in the Clone Wars. The Daughter says that it is her nature to do what is selfless, and the Son's always to do what is selfish. I think that this is the key difference: the path of the Light is to put others before you, the path of the Dark is to put yourself above others. The Yoda arc then shows that in order to attain the ability to manifest as a Force Ghost, Yoda has to recognize and gain control over the dark (aka selfishness) within himself. I believe that control of one's dark side and active choosing to be selfless is what as meant by balanace, as it means aligning yourself, your personal aspect of the Living Force, with the flow of the Cosmic Force.

    Going back to the Mortis gods, the Father seems to be representative of the Cosmic Force, governing over the Light (Daughter) and Dark (Son). He is the only one of the Mortis trinity whose body disappears upon death (becoming fully one with the Force) and he is said to be the source of the power of his children. The Daughter follows the guidance of the Father while the Son rebels against it, which fits with the idea that the Light balances the Force, while the Dark disrupts it.

    Of course, a lot of this is trying to construct unified meaning from separate sources, and the idea of the Force changed and expanded as time moved on, so this is far from definitive.
     
  2. PadawanGussin

    PadawanGussin Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Sep 6, 2017
    IMO - The Living Force are the actions taken by each person / Being. If , in general , the galaxy is at peace and times are good the "feel" of the living Force is relaxed and peaceful. Its like walking into a room where everyone is having a good time vs walking in on an argument. The feel of the situation and your own reaction is very different.

    The Living Force in turn feeds the cosmic Force, In a sense the cosmic Force is galaxy karma and this energy can have a direct impact on all life as this energy is part of all life.

    Beings who are Force sensitive are particularly vulnerable to these shifts in energy and based on their personality and environment will react differently to shifts in the cosmic Force. This n turn will further feed the cosmic Force and help to steer the Force in one direction or the other.

    To me this explains he conversation between Yoda and Mace when they speak of the Jedi's ability to use the Force had diminished. In a way they were running on AC but the Force had shifted and was now DC. The tools the Jedi had simply would not work. Its like bringing electronics from America to other parts of the world. The device itself might be in perfect working order but wont function because it does not have a compatible energy source.
     
  3. theraphos

    theraphos Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    May 20, 2016
    I think this is the correct explanation. TCW supports it too, with Pong Krell suddenly getting clearer visions of the future after he starts going dark. (Unfortunately this only inspires him to commit atrocities in hopes of impressing Dooku, but that's darksiders for you.)

    For everyone that's not corrupted, using the Force is like trying to see a penny at the bottom of a bowl full of tar.
     
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  4. Steve McGarrett

    Steve McGarrett Jedi Knight star 1

    Registered:
    Jun 1, 2017
    Cosmic: The past, the future, the 'big picture' of things.
    Living: Play what's right in front of you.

    Don't get too much into one at the expense of the other and you'll be ok.
     
  5. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 28, 2001
    Yoda states that the shroud of the dark side has fallen, when he rebukes Obi-wan's assessment that they won at Geonosis. This builds off of what Lucas also said.

    "If good and evil are mixed things become blurred - there is nothing between good and evil, everything is gray. In each of us we to have balance these emotions, and in the Star Wars saga the most important point is balance, balance between everything. It is dangerous to lose this. In The Phantom Menace one of the Jedi Council already knows the balance of the Force is starting to slip, and will slip further. It is obvious to this person that the Sith are going to destroy this balance. On the other hand a prediction which is referred to states someone will replace the balance in the future. At the right time a balance may again be created, but presently it is being eroded by dark forces."

    --George Lucas, Cut Magazine Interview, 1999.


    "It's not that they can't see the dark side coming, it's just that the dark side begins to envelop everything. It's like walking into a fog. The Jedi's ability to see lessens as the dark side grows."

    --George Lucas, Starlog Magazine Interview.


    When the Jedi use the Force correctly, they are doing so to make sure that the balance is maintained. The darker nature of people will always be there, as will the lighter nature of good people. There will always be good people like Padme, like Obi-wan, like Han, like Leia, like Rey, like Finn, like Poe, who will fight for what they believe in. Peace, justice, honor and selflessness. And there will always be those who corrupt the balance. Like Nute, like Grievous, like Snoke, like the Sith, like Jabba, like Tarkin. They will always be motivated by fear, greed, anger and hate. Palpatine disrupted by balance by blurring the lines between good and evil, which he did in his rise to power.
     
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