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Amph #RestoreTheBatman'66verse: DC Comics Film Discussion

Discussion in 'Community' started by Lazy Storm Trooper, Jul 2, 2013.

  1. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    To be fair, that was mostly out of their own general incompetency in handling their properties than it was any particular diversity (or lack thereof) initiative.
     
  2. godisawesome

    godisawesome Skywalker Saga Undersheriff star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2010
    They messed up a lot of details... but there is a (wrong) part of me that wants to argue their main mistake was doing Hal as a classic hero, since I think of him as the least interesting of the GLs unless you start leaning into stuff like him being possessed by Parallax.

    Of course, that’s partially because I’m a bitter Post-Crisis fan who wound up liking Guy first, John second, Kylo third, and then wondered why people didn’t think Parallax was an interesting take on the character because I liked Emerald Twilight.

    ...I’m mature enough and empathetic enough to know I was wrong, mind you, and I now get exactly why Hal fans were so ticked.

    Largely because I’m a fan fo Wally West (who objectively was a better Flash than Barry:p, and got Dan Didio bound and determined to screw him up as much as possible for existing.)
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
  3. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2013
    Was Black Panther popular before his movie? I would argue not to the extent that he has become since then - in fact I don't really think it's close. Marvel can turn C-List characters into A-Listers, it's just a risk.

    So why is Warners waiting so long? Like, it should not have taken until 2017 to make a Wonder Woman movie.
    You took all of my statements out of context but nice try. You literally grabbed random quotes from completely different posts and just randomly slapped them together. Not sure why you're going to bat for the powerful megacorporation but you be you.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
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  4. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    I don't give a rat's ass about WB, I just don't want to spend my time reading bad argumentation.
     
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  5. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    @Darkslayer Marvel took a defunct comic book in Guardians of the Galaxy and turned it into a smash hit movie. Meanwhile WB cannot seem to even get Superman right. MCU is always progressing forward it seems while WB is one step forward and then one step backward.
     
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  6. PCCViking

    PCCViking Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2014
    Well, WB did get Superman right with Christopher Reeve (70's and 80's movies, though) and Dean Cain (90's TV show).
     
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  7. bstnsx704

    bstnsx704 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 11, 2013
  8. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2013
    Then avoid your own posts at all cost.
     
  9. Luke02

    Luke02 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    @PCCViking Superman I and Superman II were great (though I do prefer Donner's vision for Superman II then Lester's). But after that it fell off a cliff though there is part of me that kind of enjoys Superman III because it brings back good memories (it is the third movie I remember seeing in the theater as a kid along with E.T. and Return of the Jedi) and it does have at times a fun bad quality to it. Superman IV is just bad bad! :)
     
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  10. Diggy

    Diggy Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Feb 27, 2013
    KAPOW!
     
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  11. heels1785

    heels1785 Skywalker Saga/JCC Manager star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    yes, look over there at wb, so we can blame them entirely and absolve our lord and saviour zack snyder when the bad news drops about the sny...

    https://bgr.com/entertainment/justice-league-snyder-cut-hbo-max-q1-earnings-5921243/

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Ramza

    Ramza Administrator Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2008
    I'll be honest, that's three movies in a row from Snyder where they didn't have the financial projections properly in check. Fire the budget team. :p
     
  13. heels1785

    heels1785 Skywalker Saga/JCC Manager star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    70 million dollars for a dozen icelandic wailers, five minutes of darkseid, ben affleck saying ****, and an emo song to be played while barry ogles iris.

    i absolutely do blame warner brothers for one thing, and that is giving in to the cult. the latter's full-court press, after getting what they begged for, to make wb out to be the bad guys now is juvenile and transparent. and just to clarify, that's not my siding with wb - it's rejecting the bull**** spam tactics of the snyderists.
     
  14. laurethiel1138

    laurethiel1138 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 6, 2003
    The article you're quoting is comparing apples to oranges, as HBO Max is only released in select markets, while both Disney + and Netflix are available globally. So you can't use raw numbers as actual indicators. To have a better idea of the reach of the Snyder cut, we'd have to add to the HBO numbers cited above the figures for viewings through third-party partners (such as Crave) and VOD (like iTunes/AppleTV). Until we get this data, any parallel between streaming services will be biased and unbalanced.
     
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  15. Ramza

    Ramza Administrator Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2008
    The CNBC article does lay out that comparison, it’s generally a stronger analysis. HBO co-branded service size globally is at about 60 million total accounts vs, e.g., 200 million for Netflix.

    Edit: They also note (and this is in keeping with the general vague morass these services like to keep any real numbers obscured behind despite the fact that they have perfect data) that there was no comment on the Snyder Cut’s performance, but from analysis it did have less member watch through than WW1984 (perhaps to be expected given that was a new sequel to a popular film).
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2021
  16. Sith_Sensei__Prime

    Sith_Sensei__Prime Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 22, 2000
    I'm sure John Cena's Peacemaker will make a fine bizarro parody type of Captain America, as the trailer for The Suicide Squad makes the character out to be. So glad that James Gunn is handling it.
     
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  17. Darkslayer

    Darkslayer Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Mar 26, 2013
    If you talked to them, I think you'll find most of the members of the "cult" to be kind and caring people. At least, that's been my experience with it.

    In fact, you do talk to one of them ;)

    WB shoots themselves in the foot, no one needs people like me to say that.
    This I agree with. BvS and Man of Steel did not need to have budgets of 250 million. Totally ridiculous.
    I'd hardly call this bad news, it really only measures American subs. That number would have tripled had HBO Max been available worldwide. While that wouldn't have hit WandaVision numbers for instance, that still would have been pretty successful.

    I do think WB has really bungled the rollout for HBO Max which is unfortunate. It's library of content is actually incredible. And the 2021 theater specials actually make it even more attractive as a service. Surprised they are so behind the 8-ball in making it available worldwide.
     
  18. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    I'd say the knock-on effect of keeping those effects houses in business during the pandemic was worth while
     
  19. dp4m

    dp4m JCC Playoff Pick 'Em Winner, Also a Narc star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001
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  20. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    hey if WB goes completely loony and throws 400 million at Snyder to finish his trilogy, sure why not? However, it's exceptionally unlikely due to starting from scratch costs vs. finishing off a mostly done flick. But you'd never think WB would put it's movies day and date on a streaming service either, which was basically AT&T saying "We need more people signing up for this giant goddamn money pit streaming service!" When you look at that way, what's another 400 million at that point to finish Snyder's movies? Throw that bad money after bad!
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2021
  21. appleseed

    appleseed Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 5, 2002
    They didn't do Hal as a classic hero, though. They presented him as the ripoff of Tom Cruise from Top Gun that Geoff Johns turned him into. They should have based him off the 60's Hal as written by John Broome and on Hal from New Frontier by Darwyn Cooke.
     
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  22. Ramza

    Ramza Administrator Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2008
    I think they should have made him a drunk **** up like in Emerald Dawn. Ramming headlong into yellow signs, getting his best friend killed in a hospital explosion, not realizing that maybe if an entire planet is rebelling against a guy who keeps talking about order like it's a religion he might be a bad guy, deciding it's okay to take orders from a bunch of nakedly duplicitous and untrustworthy guardians, etc.

    In short, just make him a total goddamn moron. Hell, there's even precedent beyond that story.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
  23. godisawesome

    godisawesome Skywalker Saga Undersheriff star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2010
    New Frontier Hal is pretty relatable and has a much better origin story with the tragedy of his lone, needless reluctant kill. Weirdly, I think that Hal with some variation of the Emerald Twilight story would actually be pretty magnificent as a combination; just tweak Twilight so it doesn’t have the body count and to incorporate a “More Than Mind Control” aspect to the possession by Parallax, and have him have to deal with the consequence afterwards.

    Geoff Johns has a habit of being attached to resurrected Silver Age characters who clearly he and others were fans of but have some degree of insecurity about because the Bronze Age and beyond characters that replaced them tended to start out as more defined clearly defined characters with a higher standard of writing at DC. He’s the one behind Zoom killing Barry’s mom so that he can have angst and *something* that can compete with the awesomeness of Wally fighting Professor Zoom in The Return of Barry Allen. He created the “dead dad” story for Hal to try and create some kind of tragic backstory where there was none as well.

    Heck, even his more retro-Silver Age takes on Superman and Aquaman feel like they sometimes scream some insecurity. The speed with which his taking over the Superman books was followed by Pa Kent’s death is almost hilarious if it weren’t so predictable. And while pretty much every single 90’s fan knew the Aquaman jokes were pathetic and didn’t apply to the badass beard and hook hand version, he couldn’t stop tripping over himself to have characters in his Aquaman comic make them so they could be disproven by the boring clean shaven version.

    I think part of the struggle some people have with adapting Johns’s contributions to the lore is that he’s good at executing them, but they’re not actually the inherent improvements some people think they are. Even something like The CW Flash’s success with Zoom killing Barry’s mom on Season 1 ended up collapsing once they got past the first story and tried treating it like some immutable time moment.
     
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  24. Ramza

    Ramza Administrator Emeritus star 8 VIP - Former Mod/RSA VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 13, 2008
    Okay, have to take nitpicky umbrage here, Johns didn't come up with that. If anything Johns defanged the death of Hal's dad by making it less emotionally crippling, at least compared to its portrayal in Emerald Dawn. It's implied there that Hal never really processed his trauma properly until being granted the ring stopped him just before he ruined his life. That's a theme that Marz brought back in Emerald Twilight, where he links Hal's inability to process what happened to Coast City with his inability to accept what happened to his father, and the very last thing that happens before the Guardians shut off his power is his inability to get his dad construct to say he's proud of him (I literally just reread all of this stuff a few days ago following the short discussion ITT so it's a bit fresh in the memory banks, I swear I do not normally know what is psychologically haunting 90s Hal Jordan at the drop of a hat). I think this is part of why Parallax Hal is always so convinced he's always doing the right thing, even if it takes horrible steps to accomplish - a total inability to deal with grief manifesting as a self-destructive desire to "set things right."

    That all said, I agree there's a really good movie in Emerald Twilight, and maybe the consequences would be precisely something like the ultimate sacrifice in The Final Night; hell, there's a good-ass trilogy in an origin story, going through with ET, and paying it off with a bang. Imagine seeing a movie about Green Lantern and feeling emotions other than boredom! If only. :p
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2021
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  25. gezvader28

    gezvader28 Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Mar 22, 2003
    I just want the GL that argues with Green Arrow.
     
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