ST Rian Johnson (Director Of TLJ) Discussion Thread

One other thing to bear in mind is that Mark was well aware of where George had wanted to take the story. They had talked about the trilogy and what Luke's part in it would be and judging by what we know, it was pretty much in line with what most of us had expected; a natural continuation of Luke's journey that someone like Rian would probably deem too predictable but that would also be just right for a trilogy about rebuilding the galaxy, which is what George had in mind.
So naturally, that's the Luke that Mark had expected to play; the Luke that both he and the creator of the Saga felt comfortable with.

 

I think Mark Hamill is just exceedingly diplomatic and professional... He wasn't in a position where he couldn't do anything but say 'well I suppose it's your vision Rian and I'll respect you for that'...

I suspect that originally, Luke was always envisaged as being more in the role of what we got with Han in TFA i.e. the sage guide/mentor, but once KK et al got involved, Luke was relegated in favour of Han/Ford.

 

****ing Kathleen Kennedy

 

I personally think KK was on board with anything that felt exciting/lucrative at that point, including GL's story. Reportedly, it was Michael Arndt who found it difficult to write a script where Luke wouldn't overshadow the new protagonist.
Perhaps there was a growing concern between Kathy, Bob Iger and other executives that the proposed story would be risky, but honestly, I think the arrival of Abrams was the final and largest nail in the coffin of George's treatment. If a different director had been hired, someone who was passionate about the trilogy George wanted them to do, I really think they would've done it.

 

I'm very suspicious of the claim that they couldn't get past Luke Skywalker in those early drafts... I mean, they settled on Han Solo, and Harrison pretty much dominates every scene he's in. I think this was all about their preferences and whom they, DLF/Kennedy, thought would be the biggest box office draw for a returning character... and that was Han Solo/Harrison Ford...

 

Well, fair enough. I mean, you'd think Luke Skywalker would be more attractive to them since he's arguably the most famous fantasy movie hero of all time, but they may also have locked in on the idea to tease us for a whole movie while treating us to some Harrison Ford along the way because they simply considered it a reasonable long-term plan once it had been suggested.

 

Along with whose less than bright idea it was to never reunite Luke, Han and Leia onscreen, I'd like to know whose idea it was to not put Luke and Han together on screen. Probably the same person who panicked at having Finn and Poe together in a scene....

The whole idea of breaking everyone up and then having them reunite throughout the film is so unbelievably stupid. There is no other word for it. It doesn't even lend itself to a good story structure!

 

Kasdan and Abrams are on record (during production of TFA) as stating that Han Solo was their ‘favourite SW character’… and Harrison Ford is one of the biggest Hollywood stars of his generation (and still is a big star). I mean Harrison Ford reprising his role for TFA is a much bigger news story than Hamill (sorry Mark)… and it worked.

I don’t think it’s a stretch to determine that Han’s/Ford’s inclusion was both a personal and financial preference, rather than a choice about what was best for the story. And I think that goes to the heart of the issue I.e. no one had a grasp (seemingly) of what the story for the ST should have been. There wasn’t a coherent and consistent vision. Which is why the ST ends up being a derivative set of disconnected action and character sequences, punctuated by cameos of the OT gang.

 

I'm not saying it's a stretch, or that you're wrong. I'm just saying that in the Star Wars context, Luke is the biggest star. Han being their favorite and Harrison being a huge movie star was probably a big part of it, but I also think they saw something in the whole "let's make Luke more mythical/mysterious before putting the spotlight on him" approach. It made him seem even greater and more important in a way. At the time, it certainly made me excited.

 

I agree that this is possible... and I understand (whilst not agreeing with) the principle of one OT legacy character per ST film. However, I think that further speaks to the lack of overall direction and foresight... as given Luke Skywalker's huge significance to the narrative of the OT, then he really needs to be front and centre of how the ST is established, and how the new leads are introduced. I mean, if they'd just reversed that approach (similar to what that've done with the Willow TV series) i.e. you have Luke called into the quest at the start of the ST, with Han or Leia being the ones missing in action, then you can still have an element of 'mystery', but Luke's place in the ST is much more organic and able to underpin the ST structurally (even if they decided to kill him off in TFA a la Obi-Wan in ANH). Luke absence in TFA creates a substantial emotional and structural vacuum in the ST IMO... which never gets filled satisfactorily. Even a Luke/Kylo duel at the end of TFA (instead of Rey) reduces some of the gaps in logic issues in TFA.

 

Agreed. Unexpected things needed to happen, but handling those characters this way wasn't the way to go, I feel. This trilogy was to be primarily focused on the new generation and going to such extreme lengths not to draw too much attention to Luke and his friends kind of had the opposite effect.
They should've just been there doing their thing, like it was just another episode in the series. A solid, comfortable, natural foundation for the new generation to get started on. From there, the story could have gone in any direction

 

What I find really surprising, given the plan (we assume) for multiple live action films, is why DLF just didn’t plan for two distinct trilogies rather than putting all their eggs in a single, hole ridden basket. They could have had the first trilogy, focusing on (but not exclusively) what Luke, Leia and Han were doing in terms of establishing and running the New Republic, the New Jedi Order etc. These films could have introduced the new characters, with Ben Solo as Luke’s Padawan, Snoke as the leader of an opposition pro Empire territory, and whatever the new big galactic ‘conflict’ was going to be. This then serves as the ‘prequel’ to another trilogy, which then deals with the all new characters Rey, Poe, Finn and Kylo Ren.

 

I don't find it surprising that they didn't have that much foresight, especially since they immediately made it clear they were in a rush to pay off the four billion dollars they spent to acquire LFL. There was also Harrison's, Carrie's, and Mark's ages to consider. It would have been a much better structure, however. After TFA came out I realized it needed a between trilogy, after I saw that TFA didn't even come close or even bother to function as that.

 

Imagine if they had the opportunity to go back in time and redo it all, knowing what they know now. It would be very interesting to have a peek at that alternate timeline...

 

I think they also viewed the skywalker saga as constrictive. They wanted freedom to tell their own new stories without having to worry about Luke Skywalker. And while theT knew they had to make a ST - they were ready to move beyond the saga as soon as the ink dried on the contract.

 

Then why haven’t they told any new stories set after the sequel trilogy

 

And now those key people left and the people in charge want to tell more Skywalker stories and have digitally recreated Luke Skywalker.

Can't wait for LFL to be candid about the future of SW. Maybe Celebration.

 

ummm. Because that was 2014. TLJ and TROS (not to mention Solo) weren’t well received enough. They have no idea what to do now.

 

I think if they had any ideas for new stories they would be using them, regardless of the critical reception of the sequel trilogy. Lucasfilm is still making more Star Wars movies and TV shows. I’m just saying I doubt the motivation behind the decisions with the sequel trilogy was because they had ambitions for a new story,

I see no evidence any of the authors of the ST were even interested in Star Wars without the OT characters

 

They have ideas for new movies. They've chosen to shelve them indefinitely. Every single project director is on something else. It's all vague. There's nothing in production right now.

Because they have no clue what to actually do movie-wise. TV wise they're experimenting and tossing out whatever comes. They came into this arrogant. They thought they knew what they were doing. Put out the saga and start pumping out 2 movies a year. RO did well, but I don't think they knew what they had until Andor was a huge success. Solo bombed, for many reasons. The ST was a mixed bag at best that almost killed the franchise. It blew up in their faces. And now, they're being extra cautious (movie-wise)

 

Or they do have an idea and the Lego series that shipped them off to sea was their choice.