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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Senate Safety pins, FaceBook profile pictures, and whatnot

Discussion in 'Community' started by poor yorick, Nov 13, 2016.

  1. darth-calvin

    darth-calvin Jedi Grand Master star 2

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2002
    As far as LGBT issues, the problem I have with coming down on people for wearing safety pins is the potential assumption that it is the only thing they are doing. Personally, the four people I know who are wearing them are also highly politically and socially engaged - driving people to polls last week, getting people registered to vote, going to rallies and community meetings, etc. All of them are people who I know would stand up for me if I needed it. I wouldn't want to be automatically be dismissive of them.

    When I was much younger, in the 80's and early 90's, symbols of support were very helpful. Seeing someone with an upside down pink triangle or a Keith Haring symbol helped me feel less isolated and alone. I looked for them. During the Bush years, seeing so many of the = sign bumper stickers was a hope that change was coming. There is a part of me that will always remember the time when allies were too afraid to show any kind of public support.

    I agree it's time to move beyond mere tokens. The majority of people in the US are accepting. But not everywhere. If some young and frightened LGBT person in rural America finds comfort in seeing someone wearing a safety pin then I think that is useful.
     
    tom, anakinfansince1983 , Rew and 2 others like this.
  2. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    Did you put "rules for appropriate comma usage" on ignore as well?
     
  3. Darth Punk

    Darth Punk JCC Manager star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 25, 2013
    Did someone say something?
     
    Ender Sai likes this.
  4. poor yorick

    poor yorick Ex-Mod star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Jun 25, 2002
    Phenomenal article, Merk!
     
  5. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    Darth Punk, the machines are just getting lippy, and perhaps learning irony as an American had the audacity to criticise the way in which someone else spoke English.

    He was clearly channelling Tony Blair, you monster.
     
    Darth Punk and SuperWatto like this.
  6. Healer_Leona

    Healer_Leona Squirrel Wrangler of Fun & Games star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2000

    Guess I'm in the minority about this. When I first saw the safety pins on fb and such I went looking into what it was about. After reading the article Jedi Merkurian posted I thought it a good idea and after some thought, it was what made me decide to wear a pin. I post this article every time I see someone posting the one in the OP and would like to think not everyone wearing a pin is as insincere as he tone of that article implies.
     
  7. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    Look, if symbolism could bring Joseph Kony to justice, it can help here...
     
    Jedi Merkurian likes this.
  8. Jedi_Jade-Skywalker

    Jedi_Jade-Skywalker Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 8, 2000
    History has shown that its very easy for neighbor to suddenly turn on neighbor. It happened in WW2, and it continues happening to this day. One minute you're fine, and the next minute your neighbor could be your enemy. I see wearing the safety pin as a rejection of hatred, bigotry and racism...though its only valid if you're willing to take action. Just wearing a safety pin because its a 'thing' isn't cool. Personally, I find the idea reassuring, since I live in a rural area where most folks voted for Trump.

    Paperclips and/or safety pins were used as symbols of resistance and solidarity in the Netherlands and Norway when those 2 countries were occupied by the Nazis.

    http://www.todayifoundout.com/index...s-a-symbol-of-resistance-during-world-war-ii/

    This article does a pretty good job explaining the situation and why I'm not at all happy right now.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tobias-stone/history-tells-us-what-will-brexit-trump_b_11179774.html
     
  9. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    You shared Kony2012 didn't you?
     
  10. GrandAdmiralJello

    GrandAdmiralJello Comms Admin ❉ Moderator Communitatis Litterarumque star 10 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 28, 2000
    @};-


    Missa ab iPhona mea est.
     
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  11. Healer_Leona

    Healer_Leona Squirrel Wrangler of Fun & Games star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2000

    and when it's not just symbolism?
     
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  12. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    I think to PG's point earlier; in the event an angry mob of semi-literate primates demonstrating why the south will never rise again is harassing someone vulnerable, I doubt they'll have the presence of mind to go looking for safety pins.

    In the event an ally saw harassment, they should be interceding irrespective of accoutrements.

    This, again, feels like a gesture for people to Do Something. And I'm sorry, comparing it to an underground resistance of people punished by the Nazis for turning their back on their "Aryan-ness" is breathtaking stupid, ignorant, and pompous. The oranje resistance receives **** all credit for their courage against fascists, because everyone is fixated upon the French one. Even the onderduikers were doing more than spoiled Americans looking for a way to be meaningful agents of change without having to lift a finger.
     
  13. mavjade

    mavjade Former Manager star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 10, 2005
    I 100% agree that for a lot of people it's the case of 'look I'm helping', and it certainly doesn't help anyone. I changed my icon to the one that is currently my avatar as a reminder to myself not to be complacent. I've promised myself I'm not going to be quite, that I'm going to stand up and do something, not just let all of this become normal. It's a reminder to myself in a semi-public place that I see everyday.

    Is that stupid? Quite possibly, but if it serves as that reminder, then it's worth people thinking I'm stupid.
     
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  14. Healer_Leona

    Healer_Leona Squirrel Wrangler of Fun & Games star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2000
    I agree about irrespective of accoutrements. I didn't need the pin before to stand up for someone being harassed and who the hell knows if I'd even have it on the next time I do say something to someone, but to assume that all who would wear one are only doing it for show is dumb. And just like the whole check in at Standing Rock on fb that was condemned, who knows what good can come from it. Thanks to another posting a list better things to do, more good was done. Perhaps someone wearing it may feel empowered and actually take a stand when needed if they see others wear it too.

    There's so much negative feelings and fear for many right now (even those that may want to stand up and do something) instead of just condemning it as a frivolous when you see discussion or someone posting an image, do as Jedi Merkurian and post the article he did and ask the wearer or poster if they realize what it means.
     
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  15. Fire_Ice_Death

    Fire_Ice_Death Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Feb 15, 2001

    Fact remains that a good percentage of blacks and latinos put this guy in the white house as well. So blaming white people in general is what got us here and will keep us in the muck if liberal-leaning types keep blaming white people for everything that's wrong in this country. It was perfectly summed up on election night, "White people are voting like a minority group."

    Should I start painting with the broad strokes of, "if Latinos and blacks had voted Hillary then Donald Trump wouldn't have won! All minorities are to blaaaaame!" No, of course not, you'd call me a racist and a bigot no matter how true it was. FYI: Trump got less of the white vote than Romney. It was voter apathy and minorities that pushed him over the top. And white women. Sooo...yeah. Huffington post can eat a bowl of penis with that white guilt BS.
     
    darth-calvin likes this.
  16. Jedi Merkurian

    Jedi Merkurian Future Films Rumor Naysayer star 7 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    May 25, 2000
    I'm...not understanding the relationship between my post and yours..?
     
  17. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013
    This article and the OP basically echo what Ender and I were saying in the Standing Rock thread: Facebook activism helps no one but the fake activists (by making them feel good about their absolute minimal effort towards a cause).

    It was a sentiment I also shared on Facebook, to the outrage of many people posting "I stand with Standing Rock!" images.

    That said, while I clearly agree with the article, I apparently have too few minority friends on Facebook to post about it without it leading to another argument. :p
     
    Jedi Merkurian likes this.
  18. tom

    tom Chosen One star 8

    Registered:
    Mar 14, 2004
    an overwhelming majority of minorities voted for clinton, while whites voted resoundingly for trump. if all minorites had stayed home trump's margin of victory would have only dramatically increased, while if all white people had stayed home hillary clinton would be president. i guess i agree that it's wrong to pin the election on any one factor and misses a lot of nuance, but it takes a special kind of magical thinking to assert that the minority vote put trump over the top.
     
  19. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    I think the objection is being mischaracterised here.

    The issue I have personally is that this kind of non-activism takes the place of activism. Complacency and unipolarity make democracies stale and illiberal. As much as I love Singapore, for example, it is a rather wretched democracy with its opposition gelded and humbled.

    On the literal most recent BBC News podcast, Bernie Sanders said this:

    "Over the years the Democratic party has become a party more concerned about raising money from wealthy individuals than they have been about bringing working people into the party and taking on the billionaire class, taking on Wall Street, taking on the drug companies or the insurance companies. The Democratic party has not been strong in standing up for the needs of working families. I think people are saying, ‘Well, the Democrats haven’t done it for us, let me try this guy Trump."

    Some of us have been saying it; most of the JC haven't.

    The message though is clear; do something active, not something passive.

    The pin is passivity and what allowed a Trump to exist in the first place. What allowed the Democrats or other centre left parties to shut out the working class whites who went populist right instead.

    If we agree something must be done, we must also agree by that extension the pin is, really, doing nothing.
     
  20. Healer_Leona

    Healer_Leona Squirrel Wrangler of Fun & Games star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jul 7, 2000
    "If we agree something must be done, we must also agree by that extension the pin is, really, doing nothing."

    You're again assuming all people are wearing the pin for show and not acting on it or doing anything else. Because I know I will act on it and still doing more, how would I assume I'm the only one? Because of this that statement is not logical to me.

    Edit: also, I feel the pin is reminder that action must be taken.
     
  21. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    People thought sharing a video about a guy they just learned about (which in and of itself was a savage indictment on the West) would somehow result in justice and a conviction. Four years on, Joseph Kony remains at large.

    Irrespective of whether for a handful of people or not it's part of a matrix of activities, for the vast majority this, like checking in to Standing Rock or sharing a video on FB, is enough for them to be convinced they're doing something. And their self-aggrandizing apathy is what allows a small orange populist rapist to get elected and put minorities in a vulnerable position in the first place.

    If there wasn't so much emphasis on armchair activism I'd probably object less, I guess.
     
  22. Rylo Ken

    Rylo Ken Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2015
    in this thread we congratulate ourselves for not congratulating ourselves in the lame ways that other people congratulate themselves. OMG, NOW I'M DOING IT TOO!
     
  23. SuperWatto

    SuperWatto Chosen One star 7

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2000
    As far as I'm concerned, people can do whatever the hell they want with their profile picture - just don't use the term "whatnot".
     
  24. EHT

    EHT Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 13, 2007
    This is true, but apparently Trump got a larger percentage of the black and latino votes than Romney did in that election, and voter turnout for those groups was also lower than before.
     
  25. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    It's an aggressive move, taking something derided as empty symbolism intended to make the person making the gesture feel better and not those at risk, and apply it to a forum icon...
     
    Lord Vivec likes this.