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  1. ATTENTION: All leaks and rumors MUST be spoiler tagged. Information from official sources or the big trades do NOT need to be tagged

The “death” problem

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Current and Future Shows' started by SeparatistFan, Jun 16, 2022.

  1. Darth_Accipiter

    Darth_Accipiter Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2015
     
  2. EMPEROR_WINDU

    EMPEROR_WINDU Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 23, 2002
    The part that frustrates me is the way in which Reva was stabbed with the saber both times. Especially while pre-suit Vader is storming through the Temple. I always imagined him amped up and wildly hacking away at everyone, sort of how he dealt with the Separtist leaders on Mustafar. Sure, he impales some of them but his attacks were barely controlled. Meanwhile, he's calmly stabbing a youngling in the torso. It just doesn't seem to fit the character and what was happening in ROTS at that time.
     
    wobbits likes this.
  3. Darth Weavile

    Darth Weavile Jedi Master star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 10, 2017
    It never was. Vader’s survival was unique, Maul’s was unnecessary and doesn’t even make sense in the context of the films. You would think that the Jedi would be interested in the former apprentice of the Sith Lord they are on the hunt for in ROTS, but that’s never brought up. Because Maul was dead when ROTS was written, and resurrecting him not only cheapened the story but created massive plot holes.
     
  4. Def Trooper

    Def Trooper Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2019
    What I really, REALLY hope is that it was purely a visual storytelling thing to portray how Reva feels scared and powerless like a child in that moment. Like, he didn't actually walk up and stab her as a child, but Reva is twisting/projecting that image over his current self in her mind.

    Not only is that more clever IMO but it makes far more sense than Vader just doing the same thing twice and Reva simply surviving it both times.
     
  5. Count Yubnub

    Count Yubnub Force Ghost star 4

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    Oct 1, 2012
    That's kind of how I took it.
     
  6. Vorax

    Vorax Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Jun 10, 2014
    She should not be walking around after a stab wound through the spinal cord, cause that was not just a flesh wound. Same problem with the GI. No idea how she gets off world either,lol.
     
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  7. Dorryn

    Dorryn Jedi Master star 3

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    Jan 24, 2015
    To be fair, we don't know that her spinal cord was damaged. She still shouldn't be alive though.
     
  8. Vorax

    Vorax Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Jun 10, 2014
    He impaled her dead center like she did the GI from what they showed. In any case the circumference of Vader's blade surely would've encompassed her spinal cord not just her vital soft tissues and organs . How she got up and walked from that and then again on Tatooine is as dumb as bantha poodoo

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  9. Fifi Kenobi

    Fifi Kenobi Jedi Master star 4

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    Feb 13, 2019
    well it's a multiverse thing isn't it? lol
     
  10. Darth Weavile

    Darth Weavile Jedi Master star 3

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    Oct 10, 2017
    [​IMG]
    No reason to believe Agen Kolar isn’t alive now I guess.
     
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  11. RetropME

    RetropME Jedi Master star 4

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    Dec 11, 2017
    I totally get the argument here but I will just point out that people get impaled through the torso in real life and survive. It's not a stretch and TBH, the way it was shot, Vader's saber could have been off-center. That being said, I do think her defeat and survival could have been handled better.
     
  12. Erkan12

    Erkan12 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2013


    This line alone explains why they can return.

    If they get cheap-shotted, and want revenge, that gives them more power. They know they can get revenge if they survive, and the need of revenge gives more power to the dark siders.

    But if there was no cheap-shot, then the result would be the same even if they survived, so they wouldn't want revenge.


    Does Agen Kolar want revenge by turning to the dark side? Even then, Kolar wasn't cheap-shotted, Palpatine was simply a better swordsman and duelist, the result would be the same even if Kolar returns back.

    It didn't create any plot holes, because Maul already lost his power at the end of the Clone Wars because of Sidious's attack. If Maul still had his power base Mandalore and if he had the full control of the all the Crime Syndicates, then they would need to mention him, but Maul didn't hold any significant power at the time to threat the Republic in RotS. Thus they didn't need to mention him. The Jedi's focus was on the Separatists and the other Sith lord who was controlling the senate.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  13. Todd the Jedi

    Todd the Jedi Mod and KENOBEEHHH Herald of SWTV and Lit star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2008
    Y'know I happened to run across this video on hard vs. soft worldbuilding and it made me think of this thread.

    Notably he classifies Star Wars as being a mix of the two, which explains why people have such an issue with these sorts of inconsistencies- Star Wars usually cares more about the "what" than the "why", sticking with whatever works for the story over what might or might not work for the universe. IMO that's the better way to go, since while they'll mostly stick to the established rules of the world, they won't hesitate to bend those rules if it benefits a certain story.
     
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  14. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 25, 2003

    [face_hypnotized]
     
  15. clone commander bossk

    clone commander bossk Ostrich Velocity Expert star 5

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    Nov 5, 2019
    This has already been explained several times, yet people still complain and act as if there isn't an explenation.
     
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  16. Darth Weavile

    Darth Weavile Jedi Master star 3

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    Oct 10, 2017
    Maul would be vital to revealing Sidious’ true identity, so yes, he would be very important.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  17. Def Trooper

    Def Trooper Jedi Master star 4

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    Apr 6, 2019
    I'm fine with the idea of being "too angry to die" in certain circumstances, but I think it's ridiculous that the implication is now that no dark sider can be killed as long as they don't wanna die. The only way to kill them is to behead them or completely destroy the body, and as the sequels have shown us, even that may not be enough.

    It took me a LONG time to accept Maul's survival, but if they could've done the same story without him I would've picked that over bringing him back from a very clear death. Should've been contained only to Vader, who even then was rescued and receieved immediate emergency surgery.
     
  18. Erkan12

    Erkan12 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 27, 2013
    Which is why defeating them fair and square is now more important or if there will be a cheap-shot, they should capture them alive.
     
  19. themoth

    themoth Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 5, 2015
    I like this. Reva felt like Anakin was singling her out, when in reality he just walked in there, hacking them up like he did everyone else. Time felt like it slowed down as she's always reliving the moment in her head.
     
  20. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    I remember the days when Plagueis was considered special, because he had learned the secret of keeping himself alive with the Force. A secret no one else had learned.

    Now it's...
    [​IMG]
     
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  21. Elle-Wan

    Elle-Wan Jedi Grand Master star 3

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    Jul 11, 2004
    This was how I interpreted that. Anakin didn't stab her in the Order 66 raid. That was a blended vision of the past and present.
     
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  22. The Chalk Jedi

    The Chalk Jedi Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 8, 2019
    There's no way that a lightsaber doesn't destroy vital organs if it misses the spine. And to survive such an injury twice is absurd. And based off of reports from the reliable leaker, Reva was indeed stabbed by Anakin as a youngling. Her body, of course, was smaller then, so surviving is even more absurd.

    Storytelling is built on probability, not possibility, so arguing that something happens on occasion misses the point -- it's bad storytelling.

    Good writing would have made these events believable in some way. For instance, a good writer would have given Reva an ally who could have saved her from Vader's attack. Instead we just see her survive for no reason and then engage in combat and chase people around on Tatooine!

    If you care about the integrity of SW storytelling, you absolutely should hate what these writers are doing. It creates irreparable damage to the tensions in SW that should be created through probabilistic cause and effect.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
  23. Pro Scoundrel

    Pro Scoundrel Socially And Emotionally Distant Mod Of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Many don't. Including some who are in charge of telling the stories.
     
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  24. oncafar

    oncafar Force Ghost star 6

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    Jan 10, 2017
    Isn't it too late for that integrity? From my novelty seeking pov what is left is to run with the new and don't look back, don't look back. (But it means they must really go new.)
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2022
  25. The Chalk Jedi

    The Chalk Jedi Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 8, 2019
    It's never too late. But the creatives at LFL won't care unless the fans speak up. And they do listen to the fans, although for many years people attempted to claim they don't.
     
    Elle-Wan likes this.